what's u.s.a's pop culture obsession with black people

[Orson-Cockart]

It seems like in America every black fella is considered cool! Hancock (or wanker) is yet another example of this. A tramp superhero, who could save the planet but can't be bothered, is hyped up to be the dog's bollocks. How about Superman or Spiderman who get up off their asses and get a job. Then this Handcock gets a white woman! like every blonde -- *cough* Heidi Klum *cough* -- is dumb enough to believe the black dick size myth, or maybe they just buy into the "black men are so cool right now" BS. Oh look, Madonna has another black child, she's so cool right now, she's so in the hip hop scene omgz!!!!!!1111. It's terrible it really is. The only black actors who imo are anywhere near good are Washington and Whitaker, the rest seem to be in the business to fill a quota. Will Smith is boring, but I guess he'll still be taking up all the blockbuster films as long as the masses keep buying into it.

[mel1ssa]

when i read this post, i am reminded of the media exploits of tom cruise, brittany spears, and such. give an idiot a microphone and what you get is idiocy spewed for all to see. i just hate to watch fellow humans make fools of themselves...

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Yeah, and whut's the deal w/this Barak Obama charecter? The senate only hired him cuz of his race! THere was probably a white guy who could do the job just as well!!!!!!11

[SAI]

Then this Handcock gets a white woman! like every blonde -- *cough* Heidi Klum *cough* -- is dumb enough to believe the black dick size myth, or maybe they just buy into the "black men are so cool right now" BS.

Yes, obviously. Because, you know, there's no way that Black people and White people could actually love one another and if they THINK they do they should be forcibly seperated and sent to camps where they can be re-educated.

^Please note staggeringly obvious sarcasm.

Seriously, Orson, go post this bullshit elsewhere. Post reported.


Post edited to remove what I felt, on re-reading and after some discussion, was a somewhat harsh accusation

[Orson-Cockart]

Yeah, and whut's the deal w/this Barak Obama charecter? The senate only hired him cuz of his race! THere was probably a white guy who could do the job just as well!!!!!!11

Barrack does seem to have some refreshing ideas; though he hasn't talked politics enough to warrant such a huge following, though neither has Hilary, so I think Barrack was/is the Democrats best candidate.

Melissa, it's called freedom of speech. Take yourself for example, you could have refuted by opinions, but instead decided to make it personal, but that's up to you.

[mel1ssa]

surely you are more intelligent than this... surely you realize what your incoherent and ignorant rant would do in a forum as direct, in-your-face, and brutally honest as joblo is and continues to be.

admit you just want to stir everyone up, admit it's a lame attempt to start a 'go-nowhere' thread and get attention, and just move on sadly.

very unoriginal and terribly predictable...

[Orson-Cockart]

Yes, obviously. Because, you know, there's no way that Black people and White people could actually love one another and if they THINK they do they should be forcibly seperated and sent to camps where they can be reducated.

^Please note staggeringly obvious sarcasm.

Seriously, Orson, go post your racist bullshit elsewhere. Post reported.

Although I've raised issues regarding ethnicity, I don't consider what i've said to be unfair.

And I never said different groups shouldn't mix. I personally find Ziyi Zhang very attractive. My issue was with pop cultures view that a black man is automatically cool because of his skin colour.

Look at stand up comics, no problem for Dave Chappelle to make fun of Koreans, but a white comic says anything about black people and it's a big no no! So there is a different set of rules involved. "Oh isn't that black man funny for making fun of Koreans, isn't it harmless, tee-hee........I can't believe Michael Richards said that!!!!" :rolleyes:

[Gregorious8]

Well Chapelle's stuff is all part of his act, while Richards insulted a heckling crowd member with the N-word. It's a bit different.

[SAI]

Although I've raised issues regarding ethnicity, I don't consider what i've said to be unfair.

And I never said different groups shouldn't mix.

Look at stand up comics, no problem for Dave Chappelle to make fun of Koreans, but a white comic says anything about black people and it's a big no no! So there is a different set of rules involved. "Oh isn't that black man funny for making fun of Koreans, isn't it harmless, tee-hee........I can't believe Michael Richards said that!!!!" :rolleyes:

You IMPLY that different groups shouldn't mix with the paragraph I quoted, or certainly that if they do it is for purely superficial reasons like dick size or percieved coolness.

On your point about comics... actually it's NOT okay for black people to make racist jokes, it's not okay for anyone to do it, and that needs to be said a lot more often.

[Orson-Cockart]

Well Chapelle's stuff is all part of his act, while Richards insulted a heckling crowd member with the N-word. It's a bit different.

hahahahahahaha! so racism on the one-off occasion is frowned upon, and the only way to make racism acceptable is to do it on a regular basis? lol :D "Mel Gibson! I am Robocop, you are going to jail for racism" - "g'day officer, look i'm an anti-semite on a regular basis" - "my apologise Gibson, have a nice day" Laughing.My.Ass.Off.

[Orson-Cockart]

You IMPLY that different groups shouldn't mix with the paragraph I quoted, or certainly that if they do it is for purely superficial reasons like dick size or percieved coolness.

On your point about comics... actually it's NOT okay for black people to make racist jokes, it's not okay for anyone to do it, and that needs to be said a lot more often.

Yeah, I think there are some blondes -- fashionistas -- who do it because it's "trendy". But I also think that sometimes it's genuine and opposites do attract, so it's not always for superficial reasons.

[Jamesadin]

Orson, I think you will be hard pressed to find people who agree with you about this on Joblo Forums.

[SAI]

Yeah, I think there are some blondes -- fashionistas -- who do it because it's "trendy". But I also think that sometimes it's genuine and opposites do attract, so it's not always for superficial reasons.

I'm glad you said as much, because that really doesn't come through in your first post. I know we often speak in generalities around here but you do have to be careful in an area like this because it's very easy to be offensive.

I probably leapt a little to judgement myself. I've been reading and re-reaading your first post and while you make what I feel is an erroneous point, badly, and sometimes offensively, I was a bit harsh in leaping in an calling you out as a racist, full stop.

[Lindsey]

Moving thread to the Rant forum...

[Lindsey]

It seems like in America every black fella is considered cool!

I've been thinking about this touchy thread for a bit, and that quote reminds me of Danny Vinyard from American History X:"I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.". Well look what happened to him.

[Scarfather]

This is my favorite bout of brazen racism I've read all week.

Though it is only Sunday, so Orson might be able to top himself.

[Cop No. 633]

Although I've raised issues regarding ethnicity, I don't consider what i've said to be unfair.

And I never said different groups shouldn't mix. I personally find Ziyi Zhang very attractive. My issue was with pop cultures view that a black man is automatically cool because of his skin colour.

Look at stand up comics, no problem for Dave Chappelle to make fun of Koreans, but a white comic says anything about black people and it's a big no no! So there is a different set of rules involved. "Oh isn't that black man funny for making fun of Koreans, isn't it harmless, tee-hee........I can't believe Michael Richards said that!!!!" :rolleyes:

It's so cool to be black in America that they have to put people with darker skin in jail just to give all us squares a chance. They're so cool, they had to give them Affirmative Action just so they could squirm their way to the top without putting any effort! Hell, black people in this country have it the easiest compared to everyone else! They just have to give a nod of their head and they could practically do anything, even be President!

There's a big difference between Michael Richards going on an insane rant and a joke with a punch line. And there are white comedians who make fun of everyone, including black people, but they don't show it on TV. You have to go out to actual comedy clubs to hear it. My friend is a stand up and he's never shied away from any subject. Sounds like a case of somebody needing to stop basing their reality on the TV screen and go out and live in the real world.

[Shinigami]

I will agree with orson that there's a lot of silly grandstanding around these topics. I've heard pro-gay people getting called homophobic because they think men kissing is gross. Oooooo. That same thing happens when anyone says anything that could be construed as racist, but once again, I hope that most of these harsh reactions are media sensationalisms, or people just dicking' off. Hell, there was this old thread about some schmoe telling muslims to shut up, and everyone -me included- started calling or insinuating him as a racist, which he obviously wasn't. We were just being sensational. It's the internet. And we need to remember that, at the end of the day, a lot of these things are nothing more than dramatic prima=donna reactions. They don't reflect reality.

Look at stand up comics, no problem for Dave Chappelle to make fun of Koreans, but a white comic says anything about black people and it's a big no no! So there is a different set of rules involved. "Oh isn't that black man funny for making fun of Koreans, isn't it harmless, tee-hee........I can't believe Michael Richards said that!!!!"

It's the context of the thing. Yeah, the media blew up richards' one case of public 'racism', but that doesn't mean every person on the street was clamoring for richards' blood. The media likes sensationalism. To that extent, the media and the internet both like sensationalism. They act shocked or appalled, but those reactions rarely flood over into actual level-headed reality.
Even this very website practices sensationalism pretty much daily (DID YOU HEAR WHAT TOM CRUISE SAID OMFG HE'S A NAZI SPACE ALIEN!). But once again, I doubt it reflects reality.

And back on point, if you're still not sure why a lot of movies show black people as 'cool', there's an easy reason. A lot of blacks are portrayed as real street-wise people in movies because the movies generalize, okay. Now, blacks had a rough start in the US a long time ago, and a lot of generalized news still places blacks as an underprivileged minority against the privileged white people. Now how do you take that tabloid junk if you're hollywood? Because remember! To them, it doesn't matter if these generalizations are accurate or not, nor should it, so here's what they do: generalize whites into pampered nancies, and blacks into rough street smart guys. So what? It does the same with women, gays, and everyone else.
Sensationalism.

[Benj]

So, suddenly there's something wrong with growing black kids to have a hero to look up to? I mean, like it or not, it is very easy for kids to identify more with people of their own race. So, there IS a need for "cool" black actors, since we have enough "cool" white actors. I don't think it's always to fill some sort of quota. And every white woman that's with the "cool" black guy is in it for his dick, eh?

Racism, you own at it. Not in a good way.

I think that quote from American History X is not really on the money. While you could see where the mindset came from (ignorant racist suburban kids who were fed bullshit and quoted it like a dictionary), they were just fueling a stereotype. Urban apparel, speech, etc. were never exclusive to only black people, only popularized by them.

[Shinigami]

...benj's right. And I don't think I can rationalize this into an actual topic. It's just stupid. :(

[mel1ssa]

since i was the first to react, i want to say to orson that i don't disagree with everything you have stated throughout this thread. please allow me to take a step back and start over (w/o directing anything personal at anyone - i apologize, orson).

i just don't think that the original post makes sense. what does hancock getting a white woman have to do with anything? do you realize that the way it's stated in the post makes it look like you might disagree with the two races dating? ...which could make a reader wonder why you might feel this way? why make comparisons to racial stereotypes - how does this further your argument? also, i just don't agree that we in the u.s. are 'obsessed' with black people. will smith may not be a good actor in your opinion, but he has gained a very broad fan base because of his charisma and versatility in both music and film. agree with it or not, it is what it is.

when i first read your post, my impression was someone was making an argument that was literally incoherent - i couldn't follow it and so i jumped to my own conclusion. want to enlighten us on where you're coming from, or correct any other assumptions?

[Orson-Cockart]

I've been thinking about this touchy thread for a bit, and that quote reminds me of Danny Vinyard from American History X:"I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.". Well look what happened to him.

Are you implying that a comment regarding race (such as the one you quoted) is justifiable grounds for being raped?

If you do think that, then your's is the most disgraceful post on this thread, and certainly you shouldn't be taking the moral high ground.

Danny Vinyard's father, a firefighter, was killed while doing his job in a black neighbourhood. It's understandable (albeit undeserved) that he focused the blame on black people, and built up a resentment of them while also falling into a bad crowd.

However, there's a big difference between racial comments and stamping on someone skull so that their teeth shatter and their skull is caved in. Nonetheless he didn't deserve to be raped by those gay Nazis -- yes that's right, i've decided to open up another can of worms, they were GAY nazis.

[Orson-Cockart]

It's so cool to be black in America that they have to put people with darker skin in jail just to give all us squares a chance. They're so cool, they had to give them Affirmative Action just so they could squirm their way to the top without putting any effort! Hell, black people in this country have it the easiest compared to everyone else! They just have to give a nod of their head and they could practically do anything, even be President!

I'm sure the black prison community are all innocent. :rolleyes:

Yes because being President is often considered the height of coolness. :rolleyes:

There's a big difference between Michael Richards going on an insane rant and a joke with a punch line. And there are white comedians who make fun of everyone, including black people, but they don't show it on TV. You have to go out to actual comedy clubs to hear it. My friend is a stand up and he's never shied away from any subject. Sounds like a case of somebody needing to stop basing their reality on the TV screen and go out and live in the real world.

Well that's the point, Chappelle gets to be racist on television, while white racists have to shy away at comedy clubs where tramps like you urinate on the floor and laugh at random moments just in hope of catching the punch line.

[Shinigami]

Nonetheless he didn't deserve to be raped by those gay Nazis -- yes that's right, i've decided to open up another can of worms, they were GAY nazis.

You crossed a line when you started to make fun of nazis. Way uncool.

Schmoe: :O Are you somehow insinuating that he made fun of nazis because he called them GAY? You're so homophobic!
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:y31Lm388rMwJ:jooyeol.files.wordpress. com/2006/05/explosion.jpg

Anyways, while people are way dramatic online, I really don't think that moderator was insinuating you deserved to be raped, orson. Where did you find the hat to pull that rabbit out? It's a stretch.

[Tweek]

It seems like in America every black fella is considered cool! Hancock (or wanker) is yet another example of this. A tramp superhero, who could save the planet but can't be bothered, is hyped up to be the dog's bollocks. How about Superman or Spiderman who get up off their asses and get a job. Then this Handcock gets a white woman! like every blonde -- *cough* Heidi Klum *cough* -- is dumb enough to believe the black dick size myth, or maybe they just buy into the "black men are so cool right now" BS. Oh look, Madonna has another black child, she's so cool right now, she's so in the hip hop scene omgz!!!!!!1111. It's terrible it really is. The only black actors who imo are anywhere near good are Washington and Whitaker, the rest seem to be in the business to fill a quota. Will Smith is boring, but I guess he'll still be taking up all the blockbuster films as long as the masses keep buying into it.

I dunno if this is facetious. But you do know that the character Hancock is supposed to be disgraced and... Not looked upon too highly. And Charlize Theron's character is married to Jason Bateman (but there's some weird ass spoiler I read that I'm not going to try and rewrite here.lol) And you mentioned the actors. Well, Smith's married to a black woman so you can rest easy on that one.



Melissa, it's called freedom of speech

Doesn't cancel out anyone else's.





...


"Where the white women at?"

[starcat]

When I clicked on this thread I thought we were gonna be talking about how white people try to act like black people. Most black people can pull the look off, and most white people can not, though a few exceptions in either case. I just love when you havent seen a white kid in a couple of months, and he goes all gangsta thug dress, even going so far as to change his action to sound more like that dirty south lingo, and everyone knows he talked nothing like that a few weeks ago. It just makes them look like wannabe siller poseurs.
however, i cannot agree on your topic. not all black people are automatically cool. and will smith for the most part is cool. from when i was in middle school when parents just dont understand came out, to highschool watching fresh prince of bel-air, to some truely great movies, not all...but mostly great. thats what makes will smith cool. but come on, wesley snipes isnt exactly looking to cool right now is he? nor the guy from CSI Las Vegas... and there are many more great actors than that. Morgan Freeman, Lou Gosset Jr., Levar Burton, Danny Glover just to name a few. I agree that in many movies it seems like the black character is always cool, while the white character is some uptight jerk who either has to be helped out of his shell, or put in his place... and as a white person it gets on my nerves cause I nor anyone I know have ever been or acted like white people are in those movies, but the we can get along message its usually throwing out is enough to get over that.

[Orson-Cockart]

You crossed a line when you started to make fun of nazis. Way uncool.

Schmoe: :O Are you somehow insinuating that he made fun of nazis because he called them GAY? You're so homophobic!
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:y31Lm388rMwJ:jooyeol.files.wordpress. com/2006/05/explosion.jpg

Anyways, while people are way dramatic online, I really don't think that moderator was insinuating you deserved to be raped, orson. Where did you find the hat to pull that rabbit out? It's a stretch.

It's not really a stretch, she said: "I've been thinking about this touchy thread for a bit, and that quote reminds me of Danny Vinyard from American History X:"I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.". Well look what happened to him."

The only bad thing that I remember directly happening to him was him being raped by those lavender Nazis.

[Tweek]

Are you implying that a comment regarding race (such as the one you quoted) is justifiable grounds for being raped?

If you do think that, then your's is the most disgraceful post on this thread, and certainly you shouldn't be taking the moral high ground.

Danny Vinyard's father, a firefighter, was killed while doing his job in a black neighbourhood. It's understandable (albeit undeserved) that he focused the blame on black people, and built up a resentment of them while also falling into a bad crowd.

However, there's a big difference between racial comments and stamping on someone skull so that their teeth shatter and their skull is caved in. Nonetheless he didn't deserve to be raped by those gay Nazis -- yes that's right, i've decided to open up another can of worms, they were GAY nazis.


Was it Danny or Derek that said the line Lindsay posted?

And bad crap happened to both of 'em.








Well that's the point, Chappelle gets to be racist on television, while white racists have to shy away at comedy clubs where tramps like you urinate on the floor and laugh at random moments just in hope of catching the punch line.

Hmmm... Something wrong?

[Gordon]

it's called freedom of speech.


Well, this is technically a business. Thusly, you're subject to their rules. One of their rules being that asshole bigotry is subject for removal from involvement, on any level, in their enterprise. I'm all for free speech even when it offends. But being offensive in your belief, and peddling unspecified, uncontrolled hate based off of an inherited trait has proven in the past to be the worst fucking thing to happen in the history of humanity.

[Orson-Cockart]

I dunno if this is facetious. But you do know that the character Hancock is supposed to be disgraced and... Not looked upon too highly. And Charlize Theron's character is married to Jason Bateman (but there's some weird ass spoiler I read that I'm not going to try and rewrite here.lol) And you mentioned the actors. Well, Smith's married to a black woman so you can rest easy on that one.

Hancock is a bum, a lazy bum, yet because he's black gets the upperhand on the white man who works for a living by having an affair with Miss South Africa. Well i'm sorry, I much prefer Superman, he had a job and didn't claim welfare. You didn't see Spiderman reach out for food stamps neither.


Doesn't cancel out anyone else's.

It certainly doesn't, and I wouldn't dream of attempting to censor someone else's view.

[Gordon]

I know I'm a clever motherfucker that understands and can articulate in every single possible way why you're wrong but do please not shy away from attempting to respond cleverly with more racist comments.

[Shinigami]

Hancock is a bum, a lazy bum, yet because he's black gets the upperhand on the white man who works for a living by having an affair with Miss South Africa. Well i'm sorry, I much prefer Superman, he had a job and didn't claim welfare. You didn't see Spiderman reach out for food stamps neither.


Holy shit. You're really out of your damn cracker mind, aren't you?
Wait, maybe you're joking. Argh I can't tell!

...must...stop...giving people...benefit...of the doubt!

[mel1ssa]

since i was the first to react, i want to say to orson that i don't disagree with everything you have stated throughout this thread. please allow me to take a step back and start over (w/o directing anything personal at anyone - i apologize, orson).

never mind. i do disagree with everything, and my first reaction was right. it's all for attention.

this is the part where i turn off the tube.

[Orson-Cockart]

Holy shit. You're really out of your damn cracker mind, aren't you?
Wait, maybe you're joking. Argh I can't tell!

...must...stop...giving people...benefit...of the doubt!

Hancock is a bum.
Superman (Clark Kent) did have a job.
And to my knowledge Spidey never went on food stamps.

why must I either be crackers or joking?

[EvilHenchman]

Erm...um....

This is all a joke, right? This thread is far too foolish for me to take seriously.

Well, except for the part about black dick size being a myth. Cuz it's not.

[Tweek]

Hancock is a bum, a lazy bum, yet because he's black gets the upperhand on the white man who works for a living by having an affair with Miss South Africa. Well i'm sorry, I much prefer Superman, he had a job and didn't claim welfare. You didn't see Spiderman reach out for food stamps neither.


I can't really say who I prefer (I've never liked Superman though) because I haven't seen Hancock yet... I'm sure I'd prefer Spidey but um...


But Peter Berg directed it. The two screenwriters are...Not black. So are you trying to rant about some propaganda that probably isn't there?

[Tweek]

Hancock is a bum.
Superman (Clark Kent) did have a job.
And to my knowledge Spidey never went on food stamps.

why must I either be crackers or joking?

Yes Hancock is a homeless dude. He's not universally thought of as cool within the story, though.

Superman is a characters sans ANY flaws.

If Spidey did I missed that issue.


Those three points are not all we're getting from your posts in this thread.

[LordSimen]

Lmao. Woah. Racism.

[X-Nightcrawler]

Well at least he's not a dirty mexican.

[Orson-Cockart]

But Peter Berg directed it. The two screenwriters are...Not black. So are you trying to rant about some propaganda that probably isn't there?

Peter Berg's a cuckold. He enjoyed it when Estella Warren cheated on him with Jerry O'Connell and J.D Fortune. Also, many Jewish men seem to have fantasies about their wife getting railed by a black man. Strange but true.

[EvilHenchman]

Peter Berg's a cuckold. He enjoyed it when Estella Warren cheated on him with Jerry O'Connell and J.D Fortune. Also, many Jewish men seem to have fantasies about their wife getting railed by a black man. Strange but true.

Whoa.

Okay. So. You're NOT joking. You're just fucking nuts.

[Scarfather]

Well at least he's not a dirty mexican.

You took mah jerb!!!

[Lady Stardust]

Thread lock in 5...4...3...2...

[Tweek]

You took mah jerb!!!

He took yer jerb!

[Cop No. 633]

It's quite simple really. Why is the US so obsessed with black culture? Because it lacks any true culture of its own. It's always on the search for a zeitgeist and it tends to find it in black culture.

Oh, I forgot to throw in :rolleyes:.

[Lindsey]

Are you implying that a comment regarding race (such as the one you quoted) is justifiable grounds for being raped?

If you do think that, then your's is the most disgraceful post on this thread, and certainly you shouldn't be taking the moral high ground?

Actually Derek was the one that got raped... Danny was is the brother that says the line. I only mentioned that, because when you said "It seems like in America every black fella is considered cool!", I instantly thought of the quote from AHX "I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.".

I was just comparing the two quotes, and you took it to a whole new level of extreme. Plus, I was nice enough to re-open this thread up which I closed from my forum... and move it to the Rant section for you, so the discussion could continue. Maybe I should have been more clearer, but in no way was my post disgraceful.

[Lindsey]

It's not really a stretch, she said: "I've been thinking about this touchy thread for a bit, and that quote reminds me of Danny Vinyard from American History X:"I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.". Well look what happened to him."

The only bad thing that I remember directly happening to him was him being raped by those lavender Nazis.

Was it Danny or Derek that said the line Lindsay posted?

And bad crap happened to both of 'em.

Exactly, thanks Tweek! (I want to clear this up one last time) I mentioned the quote from AHX regarding Danny, who was played by Edward Furlong. His quote out of the movie reminded me of what Orson said... and when I said 'Look what happened to him', I was meaning (*Spoilers for American History X*.... that he ended up getting killed over the fact) I have no idea where I was really going with that quote, but what it really comes down to is hate is bad. Obviously. And dang this thread has gone to hell.

[Shinigami]

Also, many Jewish men seem to have fantasies about their wife getting railed by a black man. Strange but true.

To be fair, most people fantasize about getting railed by a black man.

[Lindsey]

To be fair, most people fantasize about getting railed by a black man.

Not me really... Except for maybe Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje and EBastard. ;)

[Tweek]

Not me really... Except for maybe Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje and EBastard. ;)

I thought I had a long-ass name. Well I was wrong. :p That must be a pain in the ass trying to use automated customer service.

[BanksIsDaFuture]

Did a Black guy fuck your mother or something? Why are you so mad?

And by the way......it IS cool to be Black. :cool:

[Seansea]

Well...it is cool being black. I should know :D. So how exactly are black people holding you back from doing anything you please? Why should you even care what pop culture thinks? How could you be dumb enough allow pop culture to define you? According to http://quickfacts.census.gov, America is about 75% White, 12.3% Black, 12.5% Latino, and 3% Asian. I've worked damn hard for everything I've got and didn't need to ask anyone for shit. 265 years of slavery plus 80 years of Jim Crow doesn't magically bestow me anything. I don't have a "I'm black so I'm entitled to everything first" card. No reparations check came for me last February. Where was I on Martin Luther King Day? At work! You want to be at the top? Work your ass off and be the best at what you do, get the job you want and stop being a bitch.

We might all be better off if everyone could be happy and secure about themselves and not trip on who has what, who did what to whom, etc. That notion may seem very pie in the sky, but at least try it.

[Tweek]

I don't have a "I'm black so I'm entitled to everything first" card.


Or "That guy bumped into me! 'Cause I'm black!" No, not all of us have that mindset.


And this thread is a thinly veiled attempt to post a rant that might seem passable at being about movies.

[JJFlamingo]

Poppin my popcorn and enjoying the show...:D

[dennisv]

I think Orson got raped in the buttocks and mouth by 2 black guys with monster cocks. It's the only logical explanation.

[Le_Big_Mac]

Hancock is a bum, a lazy bum, yet because he's black gets the upperhand on the white man who works for a living by having an affair with Miss South Africa. Well i'm sorry, I much prefer Superman, he had a job and didn't claim welfare. You didn't see Spiderman reach out for food stamps neither.

There are two things you're missing here. One, there's no reason to believe that the fact that Hancock is black matters outside of cultural differences. The movie is just making a generalization that you don't see many young, homeless white men roaming the streets, which would be completely plausible to the audience. Two, the movie isn't trying to say that Hancock gets away with being a bum and having superpowers because he's black. The whole point of it is the irony that that the strongest man in the world is a complete bum.

This thread is insane.

[Orson-Cockart]

Actually Derek was the one that got raped... Danny was is the brother that says the line. I only mentioned that, because when you said "It seems like in America every black fella is considered cool!", I instantly thought of the quote from AHX "I hate the fact that it's cool to be black these days.".

I was just comparing the two quotes, and you took it to a whole new level of extreme. Plus, I was nice enough to re-open this thread up which I closed from my forum... and move it to the Rant section for you, so the discussion could continue. Maybe I should have been more clearer, but in no way was my post disgraceful.

Sorry Lindsey, I got that all wrong. Your post was as clear as could be, I should have checked up to make sure I got the names right. Derek/Danny, they sound so similar. And yeah you are real nice for opening this thread up. I feel like i'm treading on egg shells here, people are very sensitive.

[Orson-Cockart]

Exactly, thanks Tweek! (I want to clear this up one last time) I mentioned the quote from AHX regarding Danny, who was played by Edward Furlong. His quote out of the movie reminded me of what Orson said... and when I said 'Look what happened to him', I was meaning (*Spoilers for American History X*.... that he ended up getting killed over the fact) I have no idea where I was really going with that quote, but what it really comes down to is hate is bad. Obviously. And dang this thread has gone to hell.

It makes perfect sense now. Hate breeds hate. That hatred only serves violence and trauma. But I want to make it clear that I don't hate black people. If I did, I wouldn't consider Obama the U.S Democrats best candidate; I wouldn't consider Salif Keita a brilliant singer; and I wouldn't consider Woody Strode one of my favourite character actors. I just dislike the U.S pop culture regarding black people. Pimps, Gangstars, ex-gang-members, but all the while oh so cool.

[Orson-Cockart]

Did a Black guy fuck your mother or something? Why are you so mad?

And by the way......it IS cool to be Black. :cool:

No all my ancestry is European...going back seven generation anyway, beyond that who knows.

It isn't cool to be black. It's cool to be the fastest man on the planet (6'5 runner who's name I can't remember); it's cool to become one of the world's richest people, despite having a bad childhood (Oprah); it's cool to stand up and be heard at a time when your people are being opressed (MLK). But despite what's protruding from the U.S media, it aint cool to be black for black sake.

[Tweek]

No all my ancestry is European...going back seven generation anyway, beyond that who knows.

It isn't cool to be black. It's cool to be the fastest man on the planet (6'5 runner who's name I can't remember); it's cool to become one of the world's richest people, despite having a bad childhood (Oprah); it's cool to stand up and be heard at a time when your people are being opressed (MLK). But despite what's protruding from the U.S media, it aint cool to be black for black sake.


That bolded part implies that one's race is chosen by them. Also, if we're going on that train of thought, it's not cool to be anything just for the label.

[Tweek]

I just dislike the U.S pop culture regarding black people. Pimps, Gangstars, ex-gang-members, but all the while oh so cool.
What's uncool about an ex-gang member? Meaning former... Meaning that they're probably seeking a better future.


And can I bring up Morgan Freeman? Or has he played the stereotypical black man an overwhelming amount of times compared to... Not? And he's playing Nelson Mandela next year.

[Shinigami]

Nobody here is flipping out because you said something bad about the angelic black folks. That's a persecution complex, and I keep sensing its persistent little heartbeat in every one of your posts, orson. You're treading eggshells here because you were being a dick with a lot of the earlier posts. Maybe you're just consistently expressing yourself in the worst way possible, but I dunno man. It's always tough to suss' this stuff out over the internet.

I just dislike the U.S pop culture regarding black people. Pimps, Gangstars, ex-gang-members, but all the while oh so cool.

Aren't white gangters, ex-convicts, mob bosses, or hitmen also 'oh so cool' in every single stupid generalizing mainstream movie where the badass Nicolas Cage redneck takes down a plane of convicts? Why single out blacks in your views of pop-reality. Sensationalizing and romanticizing every walk of life is what hollywood does. With any race.
You guys have seen american history x, right? Skinheads aren't fascinating, and it's not confusing as to why they could hate a black man as much as they do, yet the movie treats each of these subjects in the opposite way. AHX is this glamorized drama about racism, where people are sobbing out their retributions and changes of heart. Because that's what movies in general do. Sensationalize and romance. Just because the brother died at the end doesn't mean it's "gritty" - that was the most theatrical thing that could possibly happen, just as derek is trying to change the young chap's evil ol' ways. But the movie is still awesome, because this "flaw" is something every single other film has as well. With gangstahs, skinheads, firemen, police officers, soldiers overseas, or adam sandlers. There's no getting rid of it. But is it really so bad anyways?
Who wants reality in a movie?

[Orson-Cockart]

Nobody here is flipping out because you said something bad about the angelic black folks. That's a persecution complex, and I keep sensing its persistent little heartbeat in every one of your posts, orson. You're treading eggshells here because you were being a dick with a lot of the earlier posts. Maybe you're just consistently expressing yourself in the worst way possible, but I dunno man. It's always tough to suss' this stuff out over the internet.

No persecution complex at all. You say I was being a dick, but there's not one thing i've said on this thread that is unfair or unjust. Be specific, what is it you found offensive?



Aren't white gangters, ex-convicts, mob bosses, or hitmen also 'oh so cool' in every single stupid generalizing mainstream movie where the badass Nicolas Cage redneck takes down a plane of convicts?

I don't know about Cage, but there's a big difference between Pacino playing a part and morons like 50Cent and Nas claiming promoting it as their reality.


Why single out blacks in your views of pop-reality.

Ok, i'll throw in Jews too. The two races are protected like no other. It seems fair game to make racist remarks about others (Chappelle against Koreans), but say anything about black people or Jews and it's the world's worst atrocity.


You guys have seen american history x, right? Skinheads aren't fascinating, and it's not confusing as to why they could hate a black man as much as they do, yet the movie treats each of these subjects in the opposite way. AHX is this glamorized drama about racism, where people are sobbing out their retributions and changes of heart.

I can't say I enjoyed AHX that much, but I did think it was a good film. It showed a fair reflection of racial hatred. And didn't fall into the trap of stereotyping an entire race, it was pretty well balanced. However, AHX is no way a mainstream film, it isn't a blockbuster.

But again, what this thread is about isn't racial hatred. It about my view on U.S pop culture's view that all black men are cool. Whether it be Hip Hop gang culture that has become mainstream; def comedy jam which has become mainstream; or -- with Hancock -- a black individual can be lazy, an alcoholic, but still manage to be the saviour. It's a load of extreme left wing bull shit. Too far to the right and you have an illogical hatred; but too far to the left and you've also got a dangerous situation where people go out of their way to give someone extra rights.

Sensationalize and romance. Just because the brother died at the end doesn't mean it's "gritty" - that was the most theatrical thing that could possibly happen, just as derek is trying to change the young chap's evil ol' ways. But the movie is still awesome, because this "flaw" is something every single other film has as well. With gangstahs, skinheads, firemen, police officers, soldiers overseas, or adam sandlers. There's no getting rid of it. But is it really so bad anyways?

The ending of AHX had to be that way. It puts Derek/Darren/Daniel whatever Norton's character is called in a situation where he could fall back to his racist ways, but has been through a chain of events which should lead him to realise that it was bad individuals that killed his brother and not simply a group of black kids.

[MISFITS_Fiend]

This is awesome...your main problem is with a movie that hasn't even come out yet. You do know you can't base a whole movie on what you see in a trailer, right? The main point of the movie (the way I heard it, anyway) was that Hancock is an outright alcoholic asshole who finds redemption and takes responsibility for his actions and tries to use his powers for good. That he is black is completely irrelevant.

And last I checked, there is NOTHING in the trailers that make him look "cool"; if anything it's more of a "holy shit, that guy's fucked up" portrayal.

[JohnLocke2342]

why does everyone hate so much :confused:

[Shinigami]

You know what's funny?
If orson's not a racist...this thread just slugs his whole point into homerun territory. We would be doing everything he's complaining about; someone so much as expresses a judgmental view of any black (or jew, I guess?), they get burned at the stake, whether they're actually racist or not. Fun-ny.

And orson, I called the things you've been saying dickish because I can't stand when white people in America whine about how they are oppressed in any way, shape, or form. You aren't, and we aren't. People can pick all the exceptions they want, but the majority ruling still stands: straight white males are the privileged party, and any time one complains about his race and sexual orientation being indirectly persecuted by gays, blacks, or females...that's just an all-around stupid thing to say (although you only mentioned blacks...and uh, then jews). Once again, there are exceptions, but remember that whatever situation you were in that made you feel persecuted - that is your situation, not the world's. Exagerrating things is what ticks me off. Then again, I've seen two threads recently that did this very thing. One of them talked of muslims, and another of immigration. But once the fireworks settled down, neither of the talkers were actually against muslims or against mexicans coming to america - I just took it the wrong way.
That's why, when you started this thread, you got' all these white people coming into the thread insulting you to try and show everyone how enlightened they are (including me), and two blacks -I think- who are ironically holding their calm better than anyone else. If you're alarmed by the feedback, chances are you just said mostly-everything the wrong way. Misunderstandings happen. :)
...because there is an actual point here. It's something bill cosby touched on awhile back, about how young blacks have these uneducated gangster thug role models, and how much that sucks. Although it's a topic that's exclusive to the black community, it's still interesting to hear about. If that's at all what you've been poking at, orson.

[Gordon]

I love how Orson continues to pass over responding to the most clever comments.

[Shinigami]

Who said that! I swear I just heard something. Just now. Right below my last post.
...nevermind, there's nobody. It must have been the wind. :p;)

[Benj]

You know what's funny?
If orson's not a racist...this thread just slugs his whole point into homerun territory. We would be doing everything he's complaining about; someone so much as expresses a judgmental view of any black (or jew, I guess?), they get burned at the stake, whether they're actually racist or not. Fun-ny.

And orson, I called the things you've been saying dickish because I can't stand when white people in America whine about how they are oppressed in any way, shape, or form. You aren't, and we aren't. People can pick all the exceptions they want, but the majority ruling still stands: straight white males are the privileged party, and any time one complains about his race and sexual orientation being indirectly persecuted by gays, blacks, or females...that's just an all-around stupid thing to say (although you only mentioned blacks...and uh, then jews). Once again, there are exceptions, but remember that whatever situation you were in that made you feel persecuted - that is your situation, not the world's. Exagerrating things is what ticks me off. Then again, I've seen two threads recently that did this very thing. One of them talked of muslims, and another of immigration. But once the fireworks settled down, neither of the talkers were actually against muslims or against mexicans coming to america - I just took it the wrong way.
That's why, when you started this thread, you got' all these white people coming into the thread insulting you to try and show everyone how enlightened they are (including me), and two blacks -I think- who are ironically holding their calm better than anyone else. If you're alarmed by the feedback, chances are you just said mostly-everything the wrong way. Misunderstandings happen. :)
...because there is an actual point here. It's something bill cosby touched on awhile back, about how young blacks have these uneducated gangster thug role models, and how much that sucks. Although it's a topic that's exclusive to the black community, it's still interesting to hear about. If that's at all what you've been poking at, orson.

You raise a ton of good points I want to touch on. The way a lot of straight/white males have complained about their oppression. One example I have are many people I know who complain about how they can't go places sometimes cause they have to be around homosexuals, and it makes them uncomfortable. Like people are imposing on their rights as a straight male to go to stores or something just because they like guys too. A lot of them create their own oppression by closing the doors of their minds and forcing these sort of bad thoughts of gay dudes.

And with black people, I don't even know how I could ever begin to understand it. Maybe some do, but I don't. I don't see why it is WRONG to be black just because black people have gotten a chance to be more than a race that has been given "opportunities" by white people who see themselves as superior. I'm glad they're not seen as charity cases like they were when the majority of black oppression ended. Cause I see that as racism in itself. You're still treating people like they're something different than you or me. They're not charity cases, they're not animals, they're fucking humans. But there are still people who talk about them as if they're something completely different from humans.

I think there's a lot of really great black role models now, Will Smith who is amongst the more mainstream. But, you've also got Don Cheadle, Terrance Howard, etc. And possibly the most important black role model, KRS-One.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Barrack does seem to have some refreshing ideas; though he hasn't talked politics enough to warrant such a huge following, though neither has Hilary, so I think Barrack was/is the Democrats best candidate.

The fact that you didn't see the sarcasm in my post is one thing, but the fact that you didn't try to put me in my place is quite another. Seriously, I gave you so much to work with and you squandered every bit of it.

[starcat]

You know what's funny?
If orson's not a racist...this thread just slugs his whole point into homerun territory. We would be doing everything he's complaining about; someone so much as expresses a judgmental view of any black (or jew, I guess?), they get burned at the stake, whether they're actually racist or not. Fun-ny.

And orson, I called the things you've been saying dickish because I can't stand when white people in America whine about how they are oppressed in any way, shape, or form. You aren't, and we aren't. People can pick all the exceptions they want, but the majority ruling still stands: straight white males are the privileged party, and any time one complains about his race and sexual orientation being indirectly persecuted by gays, blacks, or females...that's just an all-around stupid thing to say (although you only mentioned blacks...and uh, then jews). Once again, there are exceptions, but remember that whatever situation you were in that made you feel persecuted - that is your situation, not the world's. Exagerrating things is what ticks me off. Then again, I've seen two threads recently that did this very thing. One of them talked of muslims, and another of immigration. But once the fireworks settled down, neither of the talkers were actually against muslims or against mexicans coming to america - I just took it the wrong way.
That's why, when you started this thread, you got' all these white people coming into the thread insulting you to try and show everyone how enlightened they are (including me), and two blacks -I think- who are ironically holding their calm better than anyone else. If you're alarmed by the feedback, chances are you just said mostly-everything the wrong way. Misunderstandings happen. :)
...because there is an actual point here. It's something bill cosby touched on awhile back, about how young blacks have these uneducated gangster thug role models, and how much that sucks. Although it's a topic that's exclusive to the black community, it's still interesting to hear about. If that's at all what you've been poking at, orson.


Well, im not wanting to get in the middle of some race war, but i have to throw these two cents before it gets me all worked up. Im white, im straight, and i'm poor. I will hang out with gay people, i find many of them to be a trip, and to those who dont know slang, thats a good thing. I like hanging out with black people, as I long as I dont have to be called honkey... fye... gangsta rap has made the word nigga mean your cool homie or whatever to many white people, honkey is just a dumb word that too me sounds like it should be slang for a runny nose. my problem is when people say that straight white people have it made... no we dont. rich white people have it made, and rich black people unfortunately are not as high on the food chain and i admit that it is wrong... but id rather be rich and black than poor and white. i have been pulled over and harrassed and searched by cops... though thankfully never beat down... but let a rich kid in a beamer get pulled over and they are quickly on their way. Poor are looked down by the rich, white or black... probably black more, but i cant help that. all i know is, black or white, if you have no money already in the bank, or a cosigner with plenty of loot, you aint gettin a loan. white people are not getting any discounts at the gas pumps. "white trash", or white people under middle class like the majority is and black people have been bickering about their racial squabbles for so long, when they are both oppressed by the rich. so to me, the hate goes to all the wrong places.

[Orson-Cockart]

The fact that you didn't see the sarcasm in my post is one thing, but the fact that you didn't try to put me in my place is quite another. Seriously, I gave you so much to work with and you squandered every bit of it.

You were being sarcastic were you, how fascinating. I fail to see how putting you in your place would have been of any benefit to me.

[hasselbrad]

The problem with American pop-culture isn't black and white. It's thuggery and ignorance. The music, television and film industries, for the most part, have taken the absolute lowest road in order to market itself to the lowest common denominator. And, as per its usual, the general American public has gobbled it up like a triple cheeseburger, super-duper size fries and garbage can sized Coke. Our asses and our brains are getting flabbier.
The film industry has done its part by churning out mindless remakes, sequels and movies based on television shows. Quality films that dare to force an audience to think :eek: are shelved in favor of the less risky fare which are the development executives' bread and butter. Garbage they're relatively sure will turn a profit because the first three did, mainly because the captive hat on sideways/Jamie Kennedy look/act alike crowd can be counted on to round up dey boyz and head to the suburban megaplex on opening day the see The Fast and the Furious 8.
Television is worse. Is it any wonder that we lag behind most other industrial nations when Jeopardy is the only game show on television that actually requires adults to know anything? Intellectually, its closest competitior pits adults against fifth graders. Most game shows simply require grown human beings to jump up and down and point like excited chimpanzees. I've pretty much stopped watching network television. The only thing I watch that comes from any of the four networks is The Office. Other than that, I'll watch the History Channel or the Discovery Channel, but I'll be damned if I'm going to sit through anything on network television. If I want to kill brain cells, I'll huff nitrous. And before the people who watch 24 and Lost come at me with knives... I'm not saying everything on network television is stupid... I just don't have the time and/or energy to invest in those shows. Besides, my father briefs me on both of them. :rolleyes: I just happen to think the vast majority of network television is aimed at people with IQs in the Forrest Gump range.
The worst offender, however, has to be the music industry. The film and television industries, at their worst, aren't one tenth as culpable for the thuggery and ignorance that has become so ingrained in American pop culture over the past few decades. Whether it's black artists taking the opportunity or white record executives exploiting the lowest common denominator (i.e.: the thugs and the ignorant) it's pretty hard to look at the state of pop culture and not point your finger at rap music, specifically gangsta rap.
Call me racist, but the numbers don't lie. From the middle of the 1970s through the 1980s, black students had closed the gap in test scores versus white students by a significant margin. I'm talking double digit percentage gains over a decade and a half or so... and then it all evaporated. Almost overnight, black students slid back to where they started just over a decade before. You know what coincided with this? The emergence of gangsta rap. All of a sudden, thuggery trumped thought. Artists that produced thoughtful and insightful music like Public Enemy, KRS-One and De La Soul were pushed to the periphery by the likes of NWA, Biggie Smalls and anyone else that thought they could pull off the thug-transformation.
White conservatives attacked it, ensuring that it would sell to everyone, most importantly, their own kids.
White liberals hailed it as real and authentic, nevermind the fact that most of those in the genre couldn't go back to they 'hood because the real and authentic gang members whose exploits they were making millions glorifying would probably shoot them in the face. Sure, there were a few that really had street cred, but the vast majority were poseurs. But, in the world of pop culture, perception is much more important than reality, and thuggery became the definition of cool. And, sadly, it has acted like an anchor for blacks in general, just like Bill Cosby says.

[Orson-Cockart]

You know what's funny?
If orson's not a racist...this thread just slugs his whole point into homerun territory. We would be doing everything he's complaining about; someone so much as expresses a judgmental view of any black (or jew, I guess?), they get burned at the stake, whether they're actually racist or not. Fun-ny.

Jolly good. Someone with at least half a brain decided to contribute.

And orson, I called the things you've been saying dickish because I can't stand when white people in America whine about how they are oppressed in any way, shape, or form. You aren't, and we aren't.

I'm white European.


People can pick all the exceptions they want, but the majority ruling still stands: straight white males are the privileged party

In terms of Western politics, very much so. However I specifically mentioned pop culture, as in the media.

I'm fully aware that the major powers in U.S politics are found within white families. I also realise that predominantly African-American neighbourhoods are underprivilaged and are in need of better education facilities, i.e more money being distributed to those areas; i'm sure the same applies to other ehtnic minority areas.

The media, however, is a different kettle of fish. The U.S media (especially many in Hollywood) seems to hate their own country; hating traditional family values; hating any negative comment to a black or jewish individual; hating capitalism and wishing for communism (despite enjoying a multi-millionaire lifestyle). The U.S media, on the whole, seems very confused.

Once again, there are exceptions, but remember that whatever situation you were in that made you feel persecuted - that is your situation, not the world's.

I don't feel persecuted, though I'm willing to pretend otherwise if it allows you to fulfil your melodramatic needs.


If you're alarmed by the feedback, chances are you just said mostly-everything the wrong way. Misunderstandings happen. :)

We do seem to have wasted much time through an unfortunate misunderstanding for which I was not to blame.

...because there is an actual point here. It's something bill cosby touched on awhile back, about how young blacks have these uneducated gangster thug role models, and how much that sucks. Although it's a topic that's exclusive to the black community, it's still interesting to hear about. If that's at all what you've been poking at, orson.

I'm sure many African-Americans would share my sentiments and find U.S pop-culture regarding black people to be completely distasteful.

[Shinigami]

my problem is when people say that straight white people have it made... no we dont.

Just because you're a straight white male doesn't mean you're going to be rich. Who'd ever say such a thing to begin with? Straight white people are still the majority, although that doesn't mean everyone who fits those details is going to be rich and wealthy and influential.
At the same time, straight white males aren't poor because of blacks or gays, and although you never claimed anything of the sort, I'm just referring it back to my post.

I'm white European.

Which makes no nevermind about my point all the same, but it certainly makes me sound awful presumptuous. Snap! By the way, I'm also starting to see a real topic and point here, so hopefully other schmoes will glance at this too, and the thread can become a discussion instead of a bonfire.
Anyways, if you don't feel persecuted orson, why do you keep complaining about how white people are being oppressed by their freedom to insult blacks? I know your topic header was about blacks in pop culture, but you quickly segwayed into that old bellyache about how nobody can insult blacks or jews or they are flayed alive. If you've always personally been able to say what you want about blacks or jews, why are you complaining in the first place? You certainly infer that someone is being persecuted, and even if you say that it's not yourself, it's michael richards or mel gibson.
Now, If you felt the word "persecution" was too harsh, I can get that. But I pretty much had to use it. I need to keep insinuating negative words when I refer to you, or else you don't look like such a bad guy! That's why you're persecuted. And, likewise, that's why I'm melodramatic.
Touche, touche! :D

[Tweek]

I love how Orson continues to pass over responding to the most clever comments.

I don't know if mine were "clever" but I feel they were valid.



Jolly good. Someone with at least half a brain decided to contribute.
Because you're being catered to slightly?







I'm sure many African-Americans would share my sentiments and find U.S pop-culture regarding black people to be completely distasteful.

Not to the extremely exaggerated degree you're presenting them.




As for what would possibly be considered offensive:

http://www.joblo.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2768717&postcount=23

^^(And I'm talking about the part where you mentioned Chappelle)


http://www.joblo.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2768774&postcount=40





And by the way, no one is arguing that Hancock is not a bum. He's not well-loved though. It's not a straight superhero movie...

[jdparker]

Besides being offensive, your original post was a thinly-veiled attempt to pick a fight.

You wanna talk movies, talk movies.

[bigred760]

I'm curious as to who said Hancock was cool? I haven't seen the movie yet but the fact that the guy is an alcoholic drunk doesn't make him automatically cool just because he's black and because Will Smith plays him.

Would his character be less cool if he was played by Robert Downey Jr. and was still a drunk superhero bum?

He's a character in a movie (one that hasn't come out yet so therefore few people on these boards have seen). But you're already pissed because the man is black and has an affair with a white woman.

It just sounds to me like you're a little more pissed over more than just pop culture stereotypes.

[therealjohng]

WTF is going on with the boards lately, jesus christ.

[EvilHenchman]

Jolly good. Someone with at least half a brain decided to contribute.

Oh, snap.

Now why you gotta go and throw down like that? To me, that's just needlessly offensive to everyone who’s lowered themselves to intellectually respond in your trifling little thread. The truth is, yes, there have been quite a few smartly-worded posts so far; you’ve just chosen to gloss over them for whatever reason (Too rational for you to handle perhaps? Can’t find a way to work your agenda into a response maybe? Whatever.). I, on the other hand, probably deserve a bit of your nastiness as I’ve been less than kind to you thus far, but then again, I generally tend to be short on social graces with persons of your ilk.

Racists, I mean.


Try all you want to keep us from believing and knowing otherwise, but your true agenda here has pretty much evident in everything you’ve stated from your opening post onward. See, someone who genuinely has the intent of engaging others in a reasonable and measured discussion on something of this controversial nature, says so from the get-go. They don’t just spew random snippets from their racist agenda. And that's all you've offered…

Here ("Then this Handcock gets a white woman! like every blonde -- *cough* Heidi Klum *cough* -- is dumb enough to believe the black dick size myth, or maybe they just buy into the "black men are so cool right now" BS.")

And here ("The only black actors who imo are anywhere near good are Washington and Whitaker, the rest seem to be in the business to fill a quota.")

And for good measure, here ("Also, many Jewish men seem to have fantasies about their wife getting railed by a black man. Strange but true.")

Furthermore, one of the calling cards of your garden-variety racist is the same old tired rhetoric about how “the blacks and the jews can do this and say that, but if we whites did that, we’d be crucified…” And you more or less state just that.

So, if you’re not a racist, then you’re the worst comedian/social commentator in the history of, well, ever. I think the former is true more than the latter.

(Sidebar: See, social commentary is something that "Chappelle’s Show" integrated into the comedy, which is why it works. And for the record, it was equal opportunity-offensive; Koreans weren’t the only targets. Since I’m in sidebar mode here, Lisa Lampanelli is a current white, female comedian who drops N-words left and right, as well as riffing on other races. And she’s very funny, and she’s Grammy-nominated.)

But you know what? I don’t care that you have your racist beliefs. What you think about “us blacks” or “dem jews” is largely irrelevant to me. Wallow in all of your prejudicial sentiments and imagery all you want. What truly rattles my cage - what finally has me responding earnestly to you now - is how you continue to try rationalizing them and justifying them on this board as part of your ill-informed, knee-jerk little rant/discussion/commentary on – what it is you say, exactly? – the “usa’s pop culture obsession with black people?” What the fuck does that even mean? What the hell are you even talking about?

First of all, there is no “pop culture obsession” with black people. Who are you trying to fool with that junk? I’m not seeing anything close to that anywhere in the U.S., and I defy you to specify exactly what you mean without lapsing into redundant generalities. (I can’t believe I have to write this yet again on these forum boards: Hip hop culture is NOT always exclusively a “G- thang.”) What part of American pop culture is lavishing love all over us black folks, eh? Really.


I mean, last time I checked, the faces plastered all over the celebrity-worshipping magazines at the checkout counter were mostly white. (Though recently there were a couple of faces of color: the week Mariah Carey went off and married Nick Cannon. But even then they weren’t the "Big Story" - their mugs were relegated to a panel on the side.)

And of the top five films in the recent box office results, I think only TWO have a major African-American character in it (Iron Man and Sex in the City, I believe), and at BEST those roles are ancillary ones. And whaddaya know…somehow they managed to avoid being “Pimps, ganstars, or ex-gang members.” Or, in the case of SITC, I guess it would have to be one of them “ho” personas.

So, how 'bout TV then? Nope. Again, the highest rated TV shows from last season have predominantly white casts ("Sunday Night Football" being the possible exception - and you could've make a separate argument about race and sports if you were clever enough...). And still no sightings of any of black people slumming in those unsavory character types.

Ah, the music charts…now, there’s bound to be a whole buncha black dudes with their big thug dicks swingin’ over there, right? Well, maybe there are. Well…maybe not. Currently, some of the top digital songs belong to the likes of Usher, Ray J, and Chris Brown. Nuttin’ gangsta’ or even remotely controversial about any of them blokes*. Hell, I’m more gangsta than they are, and I grew up in a Massachusetts suburb. Plus, for good measure, there's also songs by Natasha Bedingfield and Jesse McCartney and Duffy and Coldplay and John Mayer and Gavin DeGraw. (Alas, the black child-adopting Madonna’s also there…) So, I dunno. I’d say that’s a pretty equal opportunity area there more than anything else.

And I know for sure you can’t be talking about all of those black authors congesting the tops of the best-selling authors li…oh, wait. There aren’t any black authors there, unfortunately. (Yes, that black Oprah perhaps is responsible for some of these books’ popularity via her book club deal, but Oprah transcends racial boundaries to some degree. You could huff and puff about this one all you want but there’s no way you could make a connection between her race and her influence upon much of middle America’s decision in what books to buy.)

So, there. Unless you can unearth some aspects of us pop culture that I’ve overlooked, then I can say with the utmost confidence that your original point is pretty much bunk.

But really, we all know you don’t care about black people. Or the U.S.’s purported obsession with them, for that matter. I think you just wanted an opportunity to show off your ignorance. And to that, I say, well played, sir.



*There's nothing remotely gangsta about me. I can pluralize with z's all I want but I still come off looking all forced and phony.

[someguy]

black people!!

[LordSimen]

EvilHenchman I think Just won the best post of the year award. Seriously man. I am in awe. :eek: You won the thread. :cool:

[bigred760]

EvilHenchman I think Just won the best post of the year award. Seriously man. I am in awe. :eek: You won the thread. :cool:

Seconded.

[Shinigami]

All the same Evilhenchman (power-house post, by the way - thirded), people are being dense if they don't think the cool hipster thug persona is something that the more streamlined movies use frequently with their black characters, especially in comedies or other lighthearted romps. Whether they are the biggest movies at the box office or not is almost irrelevent, because they are still being used. Go to blockbuster, shuffle along the New Release walls, you'll see tons of boxes with these very stereotypes on their covers. Even Hancock is clearly being marketed with that angle of a fresh street-wise black superhero ("you've never seen a hero like this before!"), because that angle is going to get the most attention. After all, when was the last time we saw a black superhero, much less one that was a homeless alcoholic who needed a serious shave?
Furthermore, sometimes "black" does sell a character, because hollywood has been filled with pasty crackers for so many decades that a lot of the genres and roles seem fresher when they cast a black. And why not! For that matter, both females and blacks have been accepted into a larger variety of roles in the last few decades, and hollywood is still scrambling to find just the right cliche for each, just as they have for white men (do women want their female heroes lovelorn, or successful, or empowered? do blacks want their heroes cool, or street-wise, or hardcore?). It's a normal process for the movie biz to go through as it studies what their target audience responds most favorably to. In a few years they are bound to do the same thing with gays, as our society more readily accepts that lifestyle.
And since orson was complaining about that specific thuggy-cool portrayal, it's at least sort-of sensible. I know there is a big difference between saying this outright and spewing it forth with various offensive remarks like orson did at first, but the point remains, and through all his unpopular remarks, it's true enough for a joblo.com rant (at least I'm trying tooth and nails for it to be). This wouldn't have gotten so heated if someone posted a more levelheaded debut. That's why I said people are getting on orson's case not because he dared to complain of blacks, but because of the way he went about doing so. Hell, I for one can't stand golden-toothed mtv-pampered rap losers singing about hoes and drugs, but then again...if I ranted about that, I would be specific, and I wouldn't generalize my peeve' as being against rap or blacks. That's just not productive.

[Orson-Cockart]

As for what would possibly be considered offensive:

http://www.joblo.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2768717&postcount=23

^^(And I'm talking about the part where you mentioned Chappelle)

Go watch his acts. He's a funny man at times but often he steps into an area which is seemingly only afforded to him because he's black. I can't think of a white comedian -- in the mainstream -- who'd get to make racist jokes in such a way.


http://www.joblo.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2768774&postcount=40

Estella was dating other men while she was with Berg. However, I do retract that statement as I have no way of proving that Berg was aware of those affairs. That other comment was with regard to Jewish people I know, they're obsessed with watching Silvia Saint get railed by that black pornstar, then they say they would mind if their gf did porn, they're cuckolds. But again I being presumptuous and can't prove the majority of worldwide Jews are cuckolds, so I reshape that sentiment and pertain it to the Jews I know.



And by the way, no one is arguing that Hancock is not a bum. He's not well-loved though. It's not a straight superhero movie...

Charlize loves him. If Hancock was a decent fella, then i'd have no problem if he found himself a hot girlfriend. Hancock is an alcoholic, bum, yet somehow attracts the hot girl who sleeps with him behind her husband's back! The message is that even the lowest of the low -- just as long as they're black -- can be cool and get the hot women; in addition, it's seems to be saying that a black tramp is more desireable in women's eyes than that white dude who worked for a living and didn't live off food stamps. It's a shocking message to teach the kids! shocking!

[Tweek]

Go watch his acts. He's a funny man at times but often he steps into an area which is seemingly only afforded to him because he's black. I can't think of a white comedian -- in the mainstream -- who'd get to make racist jokes in such a way.

Lisa Lampanelli was mentioned. She's rather mainstream isn't she? I mean, she's not obscure. [shrug]

And I was talking of the "tramps like you" bit.


[quote]
Estella was dating other men while she was with Berg. However, I do retract that statement as I have no way of proving that Berg was aware of those affairs. That other comment was with regard to Jewish people I know, they're obsessed with watching Silvia Saint get railed by that black pornstar, then they say they would mind if their gf did porn, they're cuckolds. But again I being presumptuous and can't prove the majority of worldwide Jews are cuckolds, so I reshape that sentiment and pertain it to the Jews I know.



Lots of men like girl on girl...Entertainment. But a lot of them would mind if their women were involved in it. Men of all shapes and colors. Cuckolds, the lot of them then!





Charlize loves him. If Hancock was a decent fella, then i'd have no problem if he found himself a hot girlfriend. Hancock is an alcoholic, bum, yet somehow attracts the hot girl who sleeps with him behind her husband's back! The message is that even the lowest of the low -- just as long as they're black -- can be cool and get the hot women; in addition, it's seems to be saying that a black tramp is more desireable in women's eyes than that white dude who worked for a living and didn't live off food stamps. It's a shocking message to teach the kids! shocking!

Here's a review that I'm guessing is reliable.

http://www.beyondhollywood.com/a-review-of-peter-bergs-hancock-spoilers/

It's also spoiler-filled but contains vital background info on the two characters.


As for Jason Bateman... An aside: I'd hit it.

[Tweek]

After all, when was the last time we saw a black superhero, much less one that was a homeless alcoholic who needed a serious shave?
Furthermore, sometimes "black" does sell a character, because hollywood has been filled with pasty crackers for so many decades that a lot of the genres and roles seem fresher when they cast a black. And why not! For that matter, both females and blacks have been accepted into a larger variety of roles in the last few decades, and hollywood is still scrambling to find just the right cliche for each, just as they have for white men (do women want their female heroes lovelorn, or successful, or empowered? do blacks want their heroes cool, or street-wise, or hardcore?). It's a normal process for the movie biz to go through as it studies what their target audience responds most favorably to. In a few years they are bound to do the same thing with gays, as our society more readily accepts that lifestyle.
And since orson was complaining about that specific thuggy-cool portrayal, it's at least sort-of sensible. I know there is a big difference between saying this outright and spewing it forth with various offensive remarks like orson did at first, but the point remains, and through all his unpopular remarks, it's true enough for a joblo.com rant (at least I'm trying tooth and nails for it to be). This wouldn't have gotten so heated if someone posted a more levelheaded debut. That's why I said people are getting on orson's case not because he dared to complain of blacks, but because of the way he went about doing so. Hell, I for one can't stand golden-toothed mtv-pampered rap losers singing about hoes and drugs, but then again...if I ranted about that, I would be specific, and I wouldn't generalize my peeve' as being against rap or blacks. That's just not productive

Yes, you're correct. It probably all went back to how the rant was presented.


And for the part I bolded, yeah, I agree. My cohort called me up one day and told me to talk his friend who doesn't believe that a black person could hate rap. LOL

[Orson-Cockart]

Here ("Then this Handcock gets a white woman! like every blonde -- *cough* Heidi Klum *cough* -- is dumb enough to believe the black dick size myth, or maybe they just buy into the "black men are so cool right now" BS.")

Hancock is an alcoholic tramp, yet manages to get the hot girl. To me she's clearly buying in to the myth.

And here ("The only black actors who imo are anywhere near good are Washington and Whitaker, the rest seem to be in the business to fill a quota.")

That's my opinion, nothing racist there...wait...wait...i'm transforming...i'm beco.....becoming a liberal....must stop! grip losening! ahhhhhhhhhhhhh! Ok now i'm a liberal like you....yay......all black actors are the best and Sidney Poitier was very dapper and gentlemanly...and Jennifer Hudson deserved her award, she was better than Barraza.

And for good measure, here ("Also, many Jewish men seem to have fantasies about their wife getting railed by a black man. Strange but true.")

* see my respons to that other poster.

Furthermore, one of the calling cards of your garden-variety racist is the same old tired rhetoric about how “the blacks and the jews can do this and say that, but if we whites did that, we’d be crucified…” And you more or less state just that.

So, if you’re not a racist, then you’re the worst comedian/social commentator in the history of, well, ever. I think the former is true more than the latter.

I'm neither a racist or a comedian. I've raised an issue regarding the extra rights black people seem to get within pop culture.

(Sidebar: See, social commentary is something that "Chappelle’s Show" integrated into the comedy, which is why it works. And for the record, it was equal opportunity-offensive; Koreans weren’t the only targets. Since I’m in sidebar mode here, Lisa Lampanelli is a current white, female comedian who drops N-words left and right, as well as riffing on other races. And she’s very funny, and she’s Grammy-nominated.)

I've never heard of her so I can't comment. Is she mainstream? is she a one off, or are there other acts like hers? is she part Jewish? is she screwing black men? i'm sure she's got something which leads the media to give her that freedom of speech. Nonetheless if she's making racist comments, then she can hide behind jokes all day long, but she's still a racist.


But you know what? I don’t care that you have your racist beliefs. What you think about “us blacks” or “dem jews” is largely irrelevant to me. Wallow in all of your prejudicial sentiments and imagery all you want.

No, you're confusing racism with comment regarding race.


What truly rattles my cage - what finally has me responding earnestly to you now - is how you continue to try rationalizing them and justifying them on this board as part of your ill-informed, knee-jerk little rant/discussion/commentary on – what it is you say, exactly? – the “usa’s pop culture obsession with black people?” What the fuck does that even mean? What the hell are you even talking about?

U.S.A - United States of America, it's a country ;)

Pop-culture - popular culture, i.e mass/mainstream media.

Obsession - The type of behavior a person exhibits that is overpowering, repeated, and often irrational.

With - in relation to.

Black people - people of African origin.

It's kind of self explanatory :rolleyes:

Obsession is the key word here. We're not talking about a love for someone like Doctor Huxtable, a good man who provided for his family, and was actually funny. We're talking about how a black person in the eyes of mass media can be a pimp, a gangster, a lazy drunk, but still be cool. Or how an individual such as myself can write a pretty harmless post, but because its pertaining to black people its a big no no.

In my original post I mentioned how I thought Washington and Whitaker were good actors. But i'm not going to be part of this mindless group who wish to assume every black person in the film industry is there on merit, when in reality they're very much there to fill a quota.

I said on the....fifth? post down that I felt Obama was U.S Democrats best candidate. I've mentioned in other threads how I liked the music of Salif Keita, and had respect for Oprah and that 6'5 runner who broke the 100m record. I've never said every black person in reality is similar to how black people are shown in pop culture. In reality you've got many, many people who have done positive things for America. But you don't get those people in mass media.

Instead, in mass media, or pop culture, you get this image that pimping is cool (Ice T), or gang life is cool (50 Cent, The Game). And like it or not that is a huge part of mainstream culture. Hancock is the same thing, he isn't cool on merit, he's a lazy tramp who's portrayed as cool by the fact that he still gets the hot girl.

And I reiterate what I said on another thread, i'm sure many black people share my sentiments. Once upon a time you had Miles Davis, Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, Fats Domino, and Chuck Berry. Now you got Soulja Boy, Lil' Wayne, and the Ying Yang twins. I have to say I love that Leona Lewis is flying the flag for Britain, she's a good girl. But sadly the mass representation of black people is lazy, gangstars.

[Orson-Cockart]

[QUOTE=Orson-Cockart;2769966]Go watch his acts. He's a funny man at times but often he steps into an area which is seemingly only afforded to him because he's black. I can't think of a white comedian -- in the mainstream -- who'd get to make racist jokes in such a way.

Lisa Lampanelli was mentioned. She's rather mainstream isn't she? I mean, she's not obscure. [shrug]

And I was talking of the "tramps like you" bit.

I just read that other thread. I must confess to having never heard of her. Are there other white, racist, acts in mainstream US comedy? I personally find it shocking that she seemingly has a big stage and she's allowed to be so racist. I'm sure black people get offended by her. I just read that Michael Clark Duncan walked out of a talk show because of her comments. What happened there?

"Tramps like you" ? what do you mean, when I was refering to Hancock?



Here's a review that I'm guessing is reliable.

http://www.beyondhollywood.com/a-review-of-peter-bergs-hancock-spoilers/

It's also spoiler-filled but contains vital background info on the two characters.


As for Jason Bateman... An aside: I'd hit it.

It gets worse. So Hancock -- like R Kelly -- has sex with a minor. Then he gets released and is adored by the public?

So he gets the hot girl after he becomes a good person, and takes up his role as a superhero. Well in that case it's not so bad.

But he was still a paedophile by the sounds of things. Did R Kelly ever do time for his crime?

PS - that face mask looks like Ben Kingsley.

[Tweek]

Hancock is an alcoholic tramp, yet manages to get the hot girl. To me she's clearly buying in to the myth.

Obsession is the key word here. We're not talking about a love for someone like Doctor Huxtable, a good man who provided for his family, and was actually funny. We're talking about how a black person in the eyes of mass media can be a pimp, a gangster, a lazy drunk, but still be cool. Or how an individual such as myself can write a pretty harmless post, but because its pertaining to black people its a big no no.

In my original post I mentioned how I thought Washington and Whitaker were good actors. But i'm not going to be part of this mindless group who wish to assume every black person in the film industry is there on merit, when in reality they're very much there to fill a quota.

I said on the....fifth? post down that I felt Obama was U.S Democrats best candidate. I've mentioned in other threads how I liked the music of Salif Keita, and had respect for Oprah and that 6'5 runner who broke the 100m record. I've never said every black person in reality is similar to how black people are shown in pop culture. In reality you've got many, many people who have done positive things for America. But you don't get those people in mass media.

Instead, in mass media, or pop culture, you get this image that pimping is cool (Ice T), or gang life is cool (50 Cent, The Game). And like it or not that is a huge part of mainstream culture. Hancock is the same thing, he isn't cool on merit, he's a lazy tramp who's portrayed as cool by the fact that he still gets the hot girl.

And I reiterate what I said on another thread, i'm sure many black people share my sentiments. Once upon a time you had Miles Davis, Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, Fats Domino, and Chuck Berry. Now you got Soulja Boy, Lil' Wayne, and the Ying Yang twins. I have to say I love that Leona Lewis is flying the flag for Britain, she's a good girl. But sadly the mass representation of black people is lazy, gangstars.

I'm going to put this link up again

Re: Hancock (I don't know why I'm being persistent. It's 1/4 to 4AM over here.)

http://www.beyondhollywood.com/a-review-of-peter-bergs-hancock-spoilers/


And we're agreed on Huxtable. Most definitely.

About your post being a no-no... It was simply because I found it ridiculous, kinda like how I find when other black people will cry racism on EVERY thing that doesn't go their way. Every thing.


And re: Washington and Whitaker, there well may be other reasons for their existence in the biz, but that doesn't change that they do have merit.


Also, regarding the hip hop artistz of today, no I don't care for it and I do realize it's there. That's why if I stream radio it's under the Classic Rock or Alternative categories of ITunes...

[Tweek]

[QUOTE=Orson-Cockart;2769991


It gets worse. So Hancock -- like R Kelly -- has sex with a minor. Then he gets released and is adored by the public?

So he gets the hot girl after he becomes a good person, and takes up his role as a superhero. Well in that case it's not so bad.

But he was still a paedophile by the sounds of things. Did R Kelly ever do time for his crime?

PS - that face mask looks like Ben Kingsley.[/QUOTE]

The big point you've been bringing up is that she's white, he's black and because he's a bum he still gets to be with her.

Did you read the parts that supposedly explain that, no matter how ridiculous they are?


And R. Kelly hasn't done time yet even though it seems like the trial has been delayed for the last decade.:mad:


And I don't see the Ben Kingsley thing. But LOL

[Scarfather]

I like how Cockheart completely ignored EvilHenchman's post because it was so full of win.

Why is this thread still open again?

Is racism tolerated now, or is this supposed to be like an educational opportunity for us schmoes, like when cheetah having a seizure babbling on about how pop culture is obsessed with lions wanders into a biology class room and the teacher (Lindsey) goes "Wait! Let's just watch it crumble and whither and die!"

[Orson-Cockart]

I like how Cockheart completely ignored EvilHenchman's post because it was so full of win.

Post 88. But believe what you want.

Why is this thread still open again?

To give you something to be melodramatic about. And the fact i've said nothing out of line.

Is racism tolerated now

Not by me it isn't. But neither is being so liberal that you can't give criticism where criticism is due.

[LordSimen]

You're giving criticism to an entire race. How are your NOT being racist?

[Orson-Cockart]

You're giving criticism to an entire race. How are your NOT being racist?

:confused:

I've criticised the mass media, and i've criticised those who are promoting a lifestyle of gangstars, pimps, and lazy drunks.

"obsession with black people" isn't refering -- as stated in previous posts -- to the mass love for someone like Doc Huxtable. But is to do with this "we'll love you no matter what you do (even if you promote pimping and gang culture)" agenda the mass media seems to have with black people.

It is ok to give criticism where criticism is due. Saying Jennifer Hudson gave a bad performance isn't racist. Saying most black people in mass media are portrayed as bling obsessed gangstars isn't being racist. Saying Hancock represents this issue, with the fact he was a convicted paedophile and yet still adored by the public, isn't being racist. The reaction of many on this thread supports my arguement, that there is an obsessiveness regarding black people which attacks any form of criticism even when its warranted.

[Tweek]

It is ok to give criticism where criticism is due. Saying Jennifer Hudson gave a bad performance isn't racist. Saying most black people in mass media are portrayed as bling obsessed gangstars isn't being racist. Saying Hancock represents this issue, with the fact he was a convicted paedophile and yet still adored by the public, isn't being racist. The reaction of many on this thread supports my arguement, that there is an obsessiveness regarding black people which attacks any form of criticism even when its warranted.

I wouldn't call you racist for criticizing someone's performance.

And the Hancock pedophile/statuory rapist thing was a recent development in your info on the movie I take it.

I find it hard to believe that the character's behavior will influence the younguns. And the criticism seemed to begin with Theron's and Smith's interracial character coupling at the expense of the jilted Bateman. Yeah the bitch did him wrong but I'm going to pull out the "If he was exactly the same character but with a white actor, would you have felt this way?" card.

I criticize enough adopted black culture as it is... I don't see how it's completely warranted in this case.

[Scarfather]

LOL

That's the first time I've ever been called 'liberal' for not being racist. That's the first time I've ever been called 'liberal' before.

I've got to e-mail this to everyone I know, they'll laugh and laugh.

I've criticised the mass media, and i've criticised those who are promoting a lifestyle of gangstars, pimps, and lazy drunks.

what's u.s.a's pop culture obsession with black people

I've criticised the mass media, and i've criticised those who are promoting a lifestyle of gangstars, pimps, and lazy drunks.

what's u.s.a's pop culture obsession with black people

?

[Orson-Cockart]

LOL

That's the first time I've ever been called 'liberal' for not being racist. That's the first time I've ever been called 'liberal' before.

did I call you a liberal? well if I did I certainly didn't imply that you were because you weren't racist.

And yes saying "what is pop culture's obsession with black people" isn't a racist comment. If the mass media were willing to criticise and didn't promote gang culture as cool, then I wouldn't refer to it as an obsession. However they seem unwilling to criticise when it's warranted. It's right to call their behaviour obsessive.

[Lindsey]

I like how Cockheart completely ignored EvilHenchman's post because it was so full of win.

Why is this thread still open again?

Is racism tolerated now, or is this supposed to be like an educational opportunity for us schmoes, like when cheetah having a seizure babbling on about how pop culture is obsessed with lions wanders into a biology class room and the teacher (Lindsey) goes "Wait! Let's just watch it crumble and whither and die!"

Completely understandable Scarfather... (And I agree with EvilHenchman's awesome post). But all I did was move the thread out of the Celeb/Gossip forum and put it in the Rant section. I can only close/delete threads in the forums I Moderate, so I can't close this sucker myself. I'm going to have to call Winston Wolfe on this one. (He's 30 minutes away but should be here in 10.) ;)

[Shinigami]

...all the same orson, people on joblo.com have criticized hudson's performance in other threads. People have also questioned denzel washington's earlier oscar win, for examle, believing he beat a more deserving candidate. I shouldn't even have to mention the truckload of threads that complain about will smith.
Yet none of those schmoes have ever been called racist. Think about that.

I've always found these topics interesting, but you're the oddball out, orson, not the schmoes. They are perfectly capable of discussing this stuff without getting all offended.
I still think this could be an interesting topic though. Everyone just has to get past their terrible first impressions of it.

[Tweek]

(He's 30 minutes away but should be here in 10.) ;)

http://www.joblo.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

LOL

[Winston Wolfe]

A discussion on race in movies wouldn't normally be enough to warrant closing this thread down but it's kinda dissolved into something a little more disturbing. So thread closed...

WW