Heath Ledger will NOT be nominated for a fucking Oscar, fanboys

[Servo]

Why are people spinning about this bullshit? I, like everyone else under the sun, am extremely excited about The Dark Knight and Heath Ledger's performance as The Joker. But Jesus, people! What the fuck makes you think he's going to be nominated for an Oscar?!

A) The film hasn't even come out yet, so how can we judge that his performance is going to be the best of this year?!

B) HE'S DEAD!!!!!! If the Academy were going to give a dead actor an Oscar, IT WOULDN'T BE HEATH LEDGER AS THE JOKER!

But don't get me wrong...it's gonna be great, Heath is going to rock, but I HIGHLY doubt that the role will be Oscar-worthy, and I highly doubt that the Academy will be rubbing their chins after the film comes out "Hmmm...maybe we should give this dead actor an Oscar." No, sorry, fuck that, WHY are we giving the Academy THIS much credit?!

:confused:

[someguy]

I don't think we should be giving Oscars out to a loser drug addict anyways.

[vesaker]

I don't think we should be giving Oscars out to a loser drug addict anyways.

:confused:

[CyclicNightmare]

There's a big difference between giving him an Oscar, and giving him a courtesy nom. I think the fact he's already been nominated hurts his chances, but I can still see it happening. I seriously doubt he'll win.

I love how point A) condemns people for judging the performance before any one has seen it, but doesn't your whole post do the same thing?

[KingofKings2525]

I don't think we should be giving Oscars out to a loser drug addict anyways.


I'll 2nd that.

[Homyrrh]

I don't think we should be giving Oscars out to a loser drug addict anyways.
You're completely wrong; the Academy is a meritocratic award, transcending issues behind the camera.

[outsyder]

Obviously judgment must be held until the film is released, but I think a nom is at least possible, especially after Johnny Depp was nominated for Jack Sparrow.

[jaw2929]

Wait a minute.... Heath Ledger was a loser drug addict? Really? I thought he OD'd on fucking sleeping pills?

[pablo_super1!]

Yea he did Od on sleeping pills. I don't know why someguy said that, maybe he was trying to get a rise out of people.

But back on topic. Yes the film hasn't come out yet so maybe fans are a little to eager to call out the best actor nom for Ledger because of his death. We'll have to wait and see.

Why say he doesn't have a chance at it, if his performance is strong enough I'm sure he can get a nom even if he is dead.

Just like outsyder said Johnny Depp was nominated for best actor for Curse of the black pearl so why is it so hard to believe Ledger can get a nom too.

[MisterTwister]

Yea he did Od on sleeping pills. I don't know why someguy said that, maybe he was trying to get a rise out of people.

But back on topic. Yes the film hasn't come out yet so maybe fans are a little to eager to call out the best actor nom for Ledger because of his death. We'll have to wait and see.

Why say he doesn't have a chance at it, if his performance is strong enough I'm sure he can get a nom even if he is dead.

Just like outsyder said Johnny Depp was nominated for best actor for Curse of the black pearl so why is it so hard to believe Ledger can get a nom too.

The reason Someguy said that is because he has no respect for anyone or anything. He has proven this many times. Go the Patrick Swayze cancer thread for proof.

Anyways,

It really doesn't matter to me if he is nominated or not. All that matters is that he kicks ass in the role and so far the trailers/tv spots are proving he is.

[echo_bravo]

Yea he did Od on sleeping pills. I don't know why someguy said that, maybe he was trying to get a rise out of people.

.

Ding Ding what do we have for him Johnny???;)


But yeah, I really hope Heath gets a nomination. Such a badass character.

[Weapon X]

If Heath does get an Oscar nod, it wouldn't be the first time an actor has received a posthumous award nomination. If I recall correctly, John Ritter got a Golden Globe nom for "8 Simple Rules" the year he died.

[Reigh Kaufman]

someguy only reads posts related to his own posts. He feeds off the power it gives him

He is Metaphysical solipsism: he exists only as a concept of his own reality; when we acknowledge him that reality is temporarily broken and he can transcend it just long enough to upset a few schmoes

Descartes wrote about it in 'Philosophy: A Dummies Guide'.

Meanwhile, Heath Ledger - who was not a drug-addicted loser - will not be nominated for an Oscar. The performance, purely in Oscar terms, whether it merits it or not, will be forgotten about by the time February comes around. The fans of the film and the actor may remember, but we are talking about people who could not splice together a few seconds of footage for Roy Scheider in the very same week he died. What chance does anyone have this early in the season?

[brodeurnumber1]

People take Someguy way too seriously. And James Dean got two posthumous nominations at the Oscar's so we'll see.

[APzombie]

A) The film hasn't even come out yet, so how can we judge that his performance is going to be the best of this year?!

Wait, so you are saying that we shouldn't judge a performance that hasn't come out yet all the while your thread title states "Heath Ledger will NOT be nominated for an oscar!"

A bit hypocrytical for you to say buddy, since you haven't seen the film yourself, therefor you are in the same disposition of judging wether it should or shouldn't be nominated.

B) HE'S DEAD!!!!!! If the Academy were going to give a dead actor an Oscar, IT WOULDN'T BE HEATH LEDGER AS THE JOKER!


recognize this guy?

http://www.topfoto.co.uk/gallery/bestactor/images/thumbs/0449554.jpg

That's Peter Finch. He won a posthumanous oscar for his great performance as Howard Beale in Network. Granted he was alive when nominated, this shit has happened before.

If the academy in this day and age are willing to give 12 oscars to a single mediocre Lord of the Rings film and a whacky lead performance like Depp's Jack Sparrow what the fuck makes anyone think they will turn their heads to Heath in a role where every goddamn oscar winning co-star praises the shit out of him? Not to mention the academy already gave him a nod for leading male in Brokeback, they already know his talent.

There is a very good chance. At least enough not to discourage the possibility 100%.

end of rant.

[Ratlehed]

I made a bet with a friend that Heath will win an Oscar. They probably made one for him a week after he died. It would be "hip" to give Ledger an Oscar and thats all the Oscars try to be anymore. Thats why Johnny Depp was up for one.

But I dont know if he'll deserve one. I am skipping Dark Knight. It cant possibly live up to the hype.

[brodeurnumber1]

But I dont know if he'll deserve one. I am skipping Dark Knight. It cant possibly live up to the hype.

You're skipping TDK because there's a lot of hype? Uhhh

[MisterTwister]

I made a bet with a friend that Heath will win an Oscar. They probably made one for him a week after he died. It would be "hip" to give Ledger an Oscar and thats all the Oscars try to be anymore. Thats why Johnny Depp was up for one.

But I dont know if he'll deserve one. I am skipping Dark Knight. It cant possibly live up to the hype.

Come on man, don't skip DK because of the hype. Forget the hype and see it because you think it looks good (unless you think it looks horrible).

[SkyNet]

this rant is a bit of a Hypocrite rant in that:

A) The film hasn't even come out yet, so how can we judge that his performance is going to be the best of this year?!

so by your own quote... how can you say that his performance ISNT the best of the year?


I personally could see a nomination for Ledger, as from the trailers, this performance appears to be fucking amazing... and i wouldnt doubt the Academy giving him a post mordem (SP??) nomination.

I also could see Robert Downey Jr. getting some recognition for Iron Man... they like to recognize big talent who step out of their comfort zone and knock it out of the park (Johnny Depp, POTC)

[jaw2929]

I don't know Someguy. Now I'll know.

[CyclicNightmare]

this rant is a bit of a Hypocrite rant in that:



so by your own quote... how can you say that his performance ISNT the best of the year?
You're the third person to mention this.

[ListersParanoia]

If the Academy will give an Oscar to an actor/acress who's knocking on death's door then why not right after? *cough the old woman from Titanic*

[Tweek]

But I dont know if he'll deserve one. I am skipping Dark Knight. It cant possibly live up to the hype.

You're priceless.

:D

[bigred760]

It's called a prediction. People do it all the time . . . even bet on them in Vegas (and other places :D).

I'm predicting he gets a nomination. I was doing that before his tragic passing. If this movie rocks as much as everyone is hoping and expecting, a lot of it will probably have to do on Ledger's performance. When that happens, there's usually an Oscar nomination . . . I'm just predicting a nomination, not a win (yet).

[FLAME_ON]

Some people might think an Oscar nod or award would undeserved, but with everyone talking about, not just fanboys, the idea will cross the Academy’s mind and could happen solely because of the fanboy campaign. This thread adds to that kind of campaign... even if it’s against Heath; if someone on the Academy read this, the idea would be in their mind despite whether or not he deserves it. As opposed to, if no one thought it was in the realm of possibility and never mentioned, no one would ever think of the idea. Just like Oscar-worth films are released at the end of the year to keep it fresh on people's minds... If people are always talking about Heath being considered, it will be fresh on people's minds.

[Cinexcellence]

I'm not saying it's likely, but it is a possibility.

[Sigur509]

If anyone should be nominated for an oscar on this film it should be Nolan.

Ledger getting the nom would be cool, but Nolan has deserved it for a long time now.

[jdparker]

I think someone else said it buuuut... I think he'll get nominated and not win. They'll nominate him for the ratings, then they won't give it to him cause he's playing a comic book character... Sick I know. I hope he does win though. If he lives up to my expectations in TDK then I'll totally be hoping for an oscar nod.

[Badbird]

The words "Oscar" and "The Dark Knight" should never enter anyone's brain, save for costumes or visual effects, but even then, doubtful

Give me a break. He's the fucking Joker.

I must be the only one who isn't pissing their pants over this movie. Plus, from the trailer, I think his Joker looks rather pathetic.

[bigred760]

I must be the only one who isn't pissing their pants over this movie.

Yeah . . . just about.

[jaw2929]

Yeah, oddly enough I'm pretty excited about this movie too. And honestly, I don't even really like the Batman character. But it's less to do with it being a Batman movie, and more with it having to do with Bale in the lead role, and Ledgers' final performance. Plus the Joker's always been an amusing character, in & out of the comic books. When I first heard that Ledger was slated to play the Joker on a radio show in 2006, I couldn't really believe it. I said "What. The. Fuck? Heath Ledger? That's not going to work" but based on what little I've seen (by design) from the trailers, I'm thinking I was totally wrong.

I think it'll be one helluva movie... I'm also excited at the prospect of Cillian Murphy reprising his Scarecrow character in a bit role in this one too.

[Ratlehed]

The words "Oscar" and "The Dark Knight" should never enter anyone's brain, save for costumes or visual effects, but even then, doubtful

Give me a break. He's the fucking Joker.

I must be the only one who isn't pissing their pants over this movie. Plus, from the trailer, I think his Joker looks rather pathetic.

Yeah, in the end the movie is about a guy that dresses up as a Bat-Man-Ninja and then he fights a crazy clown villian. A more comic booky version of a James Bond flick. But since Heath missed an award for "BrokeBack Mountain" they might give him one for TDK.

I was never really a Batman fan anyway. But, I dont see this blowing away movies like X-men 2 or Spidey 2. It also doesnt look any better then the Tim Burton/Michael Keaton version.

[bigred760]

It also doesnt look any better then the Tim Burton/Michael Keaton version.

It'll be different . . . and that's one of the things people are waiting for. For starters, it's a sequel. The Burton movie was not. And Ledger's Joker will be different than Nicholson's.

Ledger will be the difference in this movie. I'm counting on it. And that's why I'm predicting an Oscar nomination . . . at the very least.

[KcMsterpce]

I'm going to hold off on considering Heath for Oscar nom for several reasons.

First, I haven't even seen the movie yet, so there's no way to tell just by trailers alone that his character will fit within the context of the movie itself. He might transcend the expectations of TDK and pull through with a performance that makes the rest of the movie look like shit.
There's also the chance that his portrayal will be so over the top that it won't work for the rest of the flick's tone.

Second, just because he's died doesn't mean that his final performance will be his best. It doesn't magically imbue him with "final performance prowess."

Third, the hype for TDK and excessive marketing might be putting many people (I am NOT naming names, and NOT saying it's "you") into such a hyped up frenzy that the movie will never live up to the expectations. I find this to be most notably the case with Ledger - as the Joker - especially after him dying.

Those are the main reasons for me not even wanting to entertain the idea of him getting a nom. The movie isn't even out yet, and many will say he was amazing out of respect for his death. [rolleyes]

[X-Nightcrawler]

I must be the only one who isn't pissing their pants over this movie. PI don't have plans of watching it in theatres, so that makes two of us.

[The Postmaster General]

I'm excited for this film on the prospect that Nolan was inspired by Heat when making it.

As for an Oscar nom and Ledger, I don't see why it's such an impossibility - in light of Depp getting nominated (twice?) for Jack Sparrow. Of course it all depends on whether he's good or not, but I'm not ruling out that a comic book character wouldn't get props. I doubt like hell that he'll win, just because we haven't even hit Oscar season yet, and I'm sure there will be a lot of talked about performances.

[Tweek]

I'm excited for this film on the prospect that Nolan was inspired by Heat when making it.


YES! I mean, that merely sweetens the deal... Makes it too sweet because I've loved Batman since I was a youngun.

As for Ledger getting an Oscar nom or win... I'm also gonna pull out the Johnny Depp as Sparrow card. Not vehemently suggesting he'll win it but I don't think it's entirely out of the question.

[a7xfan]

i am actually getting sick of the premature praise that tdk is getting, come on people.
batman begins was good, not great. why so much hype for the sequel?

also i think KCMSTERPCE is right about people expecting WAAAY too much from this movie, its as if god himself is fucking directing, im getting sick of it. but hey...im not the one that will be devastated if its bad.

just because it is his last performance, there is no sayin that ledgers portrayal of the joker is gonna be good. people are being really dumb thinking his joker will be the best.
im sorry.......WE HAVE SEEN 3 FUCKING MINUTES IN TOTAL OF HIM. give me a fucking break

im not going to rate the movie until i see it, im not overhyped for it. i'm excited. well because i love batman. i was excited for the halloween remake, because i like michael myers. look how that turned out.

im just saying its gonna be a really dull week or two on these boards if this is another 'just good' film.






and ignore SOMEGUY he has no respect for anyone, he is a pathetic swine of a human.

[Jig Saw 123]

I don't think Heath's performance should be looked over just because he's playing in a comic book movie. He shouldn't be judged by what movie he's playing in, thats basically saying comic book films can't be taking seriously. I mean Johnny Depp is nominated for playing a demented, serial killing, barber in a musical horror movie. I don't think his performance is being over-rated because what makes a truly good actor is one who tries to get into the mind of the character their playing, Ledger changed his tone of voice, and his complete physical appearance. If anything half the actors and supporting actors shouldn't even get a nomination... cough* George Clooney Cough*

[The Postmaster General]

Clooney was fucking great in Syriana. I'm not a Clooney lover either, but that role made me one. It was one of the few roles I've watched thinking about how good its being played. I don't know how you can preface Clooney not deserving an Oscar with mentioning how great Ledger is for changing his tone of voice and physical appearance. Clooney looked fucking twisted-sharp in that film and not like Charlize Theron in Monster where you're just thinking how different he looks, but I have digressed.

IMO, before anything else, what makes this Joker so great isn't Ledger - we don't totally know how good he is in the role --- but the way the comic's joker has adapted to the screen. That's an amazing fucking character and to bring it to the screen is a really cool thing. I really doubt Ledger's performance is going to take me out of that, but hey - I never thought Clooney would own a role so who knows...

[Jig Saw 123]

I wasn't talking about Syriana I was talking about Michael Clayton...

[The Postmaster General]

Dear god, man. Hurry up and finish the sentence!

[muttly69]

I’m afraid to see this movie because of all the hype. It’s always a disappointment every time a movie gets this hyped up. People are going in with stars in there eyes and are going to love it and claim it’s the best movie ever made and Heath will probably get a award for it because he is dead. Just like when Fox got the “best actor” for Ray. Why, because Ray Charles just died and it was the “P.C.” thing to do. I liked the movie and thought Fox did a great impression of Ray Charles but Clint Eastwood deserved it more for his performance in Million Dollar Baby.

[Jig Saw 123]

Clooney's performance was over-rated and he didn't deserve the nomination. Heath can get at least a nomination for best supporting, I don't care if people say he's just playing the Joker, he brought something that hasn't been seen on screen only in the comics. I have no doubt in my mind that Heath will not be any thing but phenomenal. What makes people think he won't act the same way he does in the trailer for the entire movie? Judging from the tv spots and trailers I know Heath Ledger will be one of the greatest villains to praise the screen.

[The Heart Collector]

The words "Oscar" and "The Dark Knight" should never enter anyone's brain, save for costumes or visual effects, but even then, doubtful

Give me a break. He's the fucking Joker.

I must be the only one who isn't pissing their pants over this movie. Plus, from the trailer, I think his Joker looks rather pathetic.

Favorite Movie: Equilibrium.

[The Heart Collector]

and ignore SOMEGUY he has no respect for anyone, he is a pathetic swine of a human.

It was a joke post, genius.

[Scarfather]

Wally Pfister will probably get nominated though.

i am actually getting sick of the premature praise that tdk is getting, come on people.
batman begins was good, not great. why so much hype for the sequel?

also i think KCMSTERPCE is right about people expecting WAAAY too much from this movie, its as if god himself is fucking directing, im getting sick of it. but hey...im not the one that will be devastated if its bad.

just because it is his last performance, there is no sayin that ledgers portrayal of the joker is gonna be good. people are being really dumb thinking his joker will be the best.
im sorry.......WE HAVE SEEN 3 FUCKING MINUTES IN TOTAL OF HIM. give me a fucking break

im not going to rate the movie until i see it, im not overhyped for it. i'm excited. well because i love batman. i was excited for the halloween remake, because i like michael myers. look how that turned out.

im just saying its gonna be a really dull week or two on these boards if this is another 'just good' film.


Punctuation and Grammar must have been out on an overnight drunk when you were born.


and ignore SOMEGUY he has no respect for anyone, he is a pathetic swine of a human.

Also, lol.

[Winston Wolfe]

Someguy's comments are deplorable but that's his demented opinion. Please remember not to attack him personally on this site as that is cause for a banning.

WW

[SAI]

I know two awards The Dark Knight will be getting... Golden Schmoes for Favourite Movie and for Ledger. That's pretty much signed, sealed and delivered. The Oscars... I can't see it happening, it's just not the kind of movie that wins acting Oscars. If he does get nominated though I hope the Academy will relax its policy of not allowing proxies to accept the award, one of his relatives should be allowed to speak if it happens.

As for the film, well, I was one of the three people who didn't like Batman Begins. I will go and see this one though, I should review it, given that it's one of the biggest films of the year, and besides it does look better and it also looks like Ledger will be great. I'm just hoping that Chris Nolan has either learned to direct action scenes, or hired somebody who is better at it than he is.

Here's my recent re-review of Batman Begins, in case you're interested. http://www.joblo.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2754489#post2754489

[DarthWade]

Heath will not win or be nominated for an Oscar - because it's a genre film. If it was a "serious" film then maybe, but for this I doubt it. Not because I think he's a bad actor or anything, it's just the Academy usually doesn't give a crap for this kind of stuff. I do hope I'm proven wrong though.

On a side note, I always thought Bill Mosely should have been nominated for The Devil's Rejects. He was awesome in it.

[someguy]

Someguy's comments are deplorable but that's his demented opinion. Please remember not to attack him personally on this site as that is cause for a banning.

WW

Please tell me which is worse, making a joke post or using the fact that you have access to an admin's account to hurl a direct insult at somebody without the fear of being banned?

[therealjohng]

I'm so glad people can recognize an obvious joke when they see one.

[CyclicNightmare]

Yeah, how is calling his opinion "demented" not a personal attack?

[Digifruitella]

I'm excited for this film on the prospect that Nolan was inspired by Heat when making it.

Dammit Bubba, why don't I know you personally :D We have much in common.

[Digifruitella]

Wally Pfister will probably get nominated though.



+1. Without a doubt.

[RicochetShaw]

Please tell me which is worse, making a joke post or using the fact that you have access to an admin's account to hurl a direct insult at somebody without the fear of being banned?



Maybe Winston was joking, too? If you can excuse what you say with that, why can't he?

[someguy]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/90/HeathJoker.png

WHY SO SERIOUS SHAW?

[a7xfan]

Punctuation and Grammar must have been out on an overnight drunk when you were born.

:D

[Moviefan1234]

Please tell me which is worse, making a joke post or using the fact that you have access to an admin's account to hurl a direct insult at somebody without the fear of being banned?


I think the problem with your initial post was that it was a very off color joke and something that many people would find offensive. You were well aware of that when you posted.

[Badbird]

Favorite Movie: Equilibrium.

And this is relevant because...?

Honestly, think of it this way:

If Tim Roth had died tragically a few months ago and people started saying "Will he get nominated for playing Abomination in Hulk? He looks fantastic?" Would that not sound totally crazy?

[the saw is family]

And this is relevant because...?

Honestly, think of it this way:

If Tim Roth had died tragically a few months ago and people started saying "Will he get nominated for playing Abomination in Hulk? He looks fantastic?" Would that not sound totally crazy?

personally i don't care whether he gets an oscar or not but are you really comparing abomination to the joker? you know cuz they have the same mythos and grandeur. and abomination is known by as many casual fans as there are comic book fans like the joker is. also you know abomination was previously played by a legendary actor that makes people hype up the new performance for comparisons sake.:rolleyes:

[The Postmaster General]

Clooney's performance was over-rated and he didn't deserve the nomination. Heath can get at least a nomination for best supporting, I don't care if people say he's just playing the Joker, he brought something that hasn't been seen on screen only in the comics. I have no doubt in my mind that Heath will not be any thing but phenomenal. What makes people think he won't act the same way he does in the trailer for the entire movie? Judging from the tv spots and trailers I know Heath Ledger will be one of the greatest villains to praise the screen.

Oh, we've flipped because I've only sparsely seen Clayton, but will take your word that it's not a slam-bang performance. My praise of Clooney is limited to his work in Syriana, O Brother, and probably a few others.

Remember though, I'm in your camp and think there's no reason Ledger won't get a nom. I don't think him playing a comic character means anything nowadays when you have wizards and pirates getting nominated. I think the only things working against Ledger are the timing of the movie (I don't think Summer films do well at Oscar time.) and the fact that there will probably be 50 movies in November and December that are actor showcases.








On a side note --- A person can be demented and deplorable without being an asshole. Howard Stern is demented and deplorable and seems like a helluva nice guy who I'd probably trust to watch a kid before a lot of people that aren't demented and deplorable --- I don't think those words are the insults they are being made out to be, but that the real offense is that it's official now.

[Servo]

Just because Peter Finch (Hollywood legend), James Dean (Hollywood legend) and John Ritter (TV legend) received posthumous nominations (and wins?) doesn't mean Heath Ledger (nowhere near legendary as Peter Finch and James Dean) will get nominated.

And no, I'm not being a hypocrite. I think the word some of you (all three of you) were looking for was contradictory, which I can understand why it'd be taken that way, but I wasn't judging his performance, my statement was mostly based in logistics. Like anyone else's opinion before a movie comes out, I have doubts about his performance being Oscar-worthy. Doubts. That mean's we'll see. To make my own prediction, the only mention Heath Ledger will get at the 81st Annual Academy Awards will be three slow motion shots of him in Brokeback Mountain, Dark Knight and whatever the name of that Terry Gilliam movie is.

But shit, if Marissa Tomei can get an Oscar, what the fuck do I know.

[dellamorte dellamore]

My predictions , TDK gets the respect it deserves from the academy because , much like the LOTR series , it will transcend it's genre . It won't simply be a great comic book movie , it will be a terrific and extremely well crafted film regardless of it's obvious inspiration and source material .

Nolan has already proven with BB that you can make the world of Batman realistic and believable , with carefully constructed characters who don't merely exist only comic books . There is but a hint of the fantastic in his version of Batman , everything that happens , every scenario he creates , and every action the principal characters engage in is grounded in some sort of reality .


He looks to have expanded on that approach with TDK , and Ledger has most definitely brought an over the top character from the comics and made him human , something nobody else has done before up till this point . Every incarnation of the Joker from the tv series to Bat 89 to the cartoons has merely presented the Joker as a one dimensional goofball . I can see Ledger has breathed , slept , lived and became the Joker , it is a multifaceted performance , and i don't need to see the entire perf to understand that .

He truly gave all he had to bring this complex character to life and to bring him out of the cartoon representation shadows . Depp's perf in the Pirate films seemed too light and breezy , it didn't seem as if he was even breaking a sweat , he didn't become Jack Sparrow , he was J . Depp playing a cool and charismatic character . We never forgot it was him playing to the camera and mugging mercilessly . Ledger has disappeared into this role , he is the Joker , it is a complete and total transformation , it's the height of the art of acting and performing . Depp never reached those heights , but he was nommed for the role twice . So , i'll say it right now , even without Ledger's passing , he will be nominated for this role . The academy does recognize brilliance , but this is even beyond that , this is genius , he is guaranteed to get recognized by his peers .


Back to the Lotr reference and comparisons . When a film transcends it's supposed genre , all bets are off , it doesn't matter that Tdk is based on a comic book universe , just like Lotr wasn't affected by the fantastical universe the story took place in , it was the reality they created despite the fantasy elements that won it all those Oscars .


Not only will TDK garner Ledger an Oscar nom , but i'll go on to say best picture , best director and some other noms will be in order .


And i don't know why some people are saying that the hype will potentially kill the film for them , if anything , i'm fully expecting Tdk to surpass the supposed hype . It can't miss , Nolan is in full command of his vision and craft . He knows exactly what he wants , and he knows exactly how to get it from the talent he surrounds himself with .

This will be everyone's high water mark , all the people involved with Tdk from the caterer to the sound designer , to the editor , to the actors , to the director , this will be the quintessential comic book hero movie , but giving it that moniker is simplifying it , it will be one of the best films ever made , in any so called genre , and it will be recognized as such come Oscar time .

[Winston Wolfe]

Demented was being used to describe the opinion, not the person. But nice try.

[the saw is family]

man i love reading your posts dellamorte, i disagree with you almost all the time but your talent for hyperbole and hype is second to none.

[bigred760]

. Depp never reached those heights , but he was nommed for the role twice.


He was only nominated for the Oscar once for Jack Sparrow. Unless you mean a Golden Globe as well.

[Moviefan1234]

And this is relevant because...?

Honestly, think of it this way:

If Tim Roth had died tragically a few months ago and people started saying "Will he get nominated for playing Abomination in Hulk? He looks fantastic?" Would that not sound totally crazy?



The difference is that Ledger was getting Oscar attention for the role before he died.

[bigred760]

Heath will not win or be nominated for an Oscar - because it's a genre film. If it was a "serious" film then maybe, but for this I doubt it. Not because I think he's a bad actor or anything, it's just the Academy usually doesn't give a crap for this kind of stuff. I do hope I'm proven wrong though.


Genre films have been nominated before, in acting categories and others. LOTR: Return of the King won 11 Oscars, and Johnny Depp's nomination for the first Pirates movie has already been mentioned. It's rare . . . sure, but not unheard of.

[xseanymacx]

Yeah, in the end the movie is about a guy that dresses up as a Bat-Man-Ninja and then he fights a crazy clown villian. A more comic booky version of a James Bond flick.

I was never really a Batman fan anyway. But, I dont see this blowing away movies like X-men 2 or Spidey 2. It also doesnt look any better then the Tim Burton/Michael Keaton version.

Batman Begins was better than X2 and Spidey 2. Unless you're going for a direct sequel comparison in which case, we certainly must wait until July.

Also, Batman's been around since the '40s. If anything, James Bond is a more gadgetry version of Batman.

[bigred760]

And noone . . . at least I'm not . . . is saying that he'll get a nomination because he died before the movie's release. I'm saying that he'll get a nomination because I think his performance will make the movie greater. And usually that's how nominations come about, especially supporting performances. (Although I'll admit that the fact that he died probably won't hurt.)

And for those of you who are "sick" and "tired" of all the hype surrounding The Dark Knight . . . you're going to have to get over it. There are a lot of us who are really excited to see this movie; because we loved Batman Begins, because we love the comic book and its characters, because we've seen the trailers and promos - which include Heath Ledger as the Joker by the way - for the movie, whatever. If the movie turns out to be just "okay," then we'll be the ones disappointed, and you guys can pat yourselves on the back in triumph. Until then . . . you're going to have to deal with it.

[RicochetShaw]

The difference is that Ledger was getting Oscar attention for the role before he died.



I don't know about that... he died before even this year's Oscar ceremony occurred.

[bigred760]

I don't know about that... he died before even this year's Oscar ceremony occurred.

I don't know about anyone else, but I predicted a nomination after seeing the 1st trailer - which was in December.

[someguy]

Demented was being used to describe the opinion, not the person. But nice try.

The WW account is more than one person right? If that hasn't changed, why are you hiding behind the admin's account to lob insults at me? Post or PM me under your account.

[Homyrrh]

Favorite Movie: Equilibrium.
Ah, you got even me cackling on that one.

And I always intended to buy Winston Wolfe a big ol' pack of Charmin to wipe his ass after shitting on every party ever started...but with my salary, not sure I could buy one for however many people utilize the account. Rather cowardice.

[bigred760]

When (and why) did this become the "Bash the Winston Wolfe" thread? Get over it and yourselves and stay on topic for crying out loud.

[The Postmaster General]

Well, at least we can all agree Mike Myers won't be getting an Oscar.

Right? :worried:

[Tweek]

I don't know about anyone else, but I predicted a nomination after seeing the 1st trailer - which was in December.

Take me back to that special time: The IMAX dealy? Yeah, I should've put that under the last scene to give me goosebumps (General Movie Talk thread reference)



Well, at least we can all agree Mike Myers won't be getting an Oscar.

Right? :worried:

Stranger things have happened. :D

[DarthWade]

Genre films have been nominated before, in acting categories and others. LOTR: Return of the King won 11 Oscars, and Johnny Depp's nomination for the first Pirates movie has already been mentioned. It's rare . . . sure, but not unheard of.



Not as much as they should have though, in my opinion. The problem TDK has is that many Academy types will simply dismiss it as a good performance in "just a superhero flick". It's unfair, but that will probably happen.

All I can say is that just from seeing his acting in the trailers alone, I know we're in for one hell of a performance. If he does get nominated, it would be nice...already it looks like it's going to be one of the outstanding acting jobs of the year.

[brodeurnumber1]

Although people have been using Johnny Depp as an example a lot, I'll just throw out William Hurt getting nominated for A History of Violence. If he can get nominated for a supporting for doing basically nothing, then Ledger can get one or this.

[adamjohnson]

Not as much as they should have though, in my opinion. The problem TDK has is that many Academy types will simply dismiss it as a good performance in "just a superhero flick". It's unfair, but that will probably happen.



Unless the picture is better than we think its going to be. what if its nominated for best picture or best director?

The academy has been coming around. They made a point to prove that with ROTK. If Ledger's performance is oscar worthy, he'll get a nom.

[Moviefan1234]

I don't know about that... he died before even this year's Oscar ceremony occurred.


When I first heard Nolan's comments about Ledger's take on the Joker, the first thing that came to my mind was award buzz. And then I saw the trailer, the rest in history. And judging by the first review for THE DARK KNIGHT, my gut instinct on Ledger's performance was correct.

[dellamorte dellamore]

man i love reading your posts dellamorte, i disagree with you almost all the time but your talent for hyperbole and hype is second to none.

I do tend to go a bit over the top at times and my penchant for half truths and misinformation is another one of my gifts :D . I'm glad you like it though , and yes , TDK will be the best , most stupendous comic book hero movie ever made , since the advent of the flipbook .

[JohnLocke2342]

This non-oscar talk is baffling to me. Purely baffling.

"The Dark Knight isn't a movie that would win academy awards". This has been uttered by people all across this thread and across this website for the last 4 months and it's really starting to get to me. What can get nominated for an academy award? Who has the criteria? I'm pretty sure it's given for the best overall performances in a film in each individual category every year. Now, we can all agree that there are movies that get shunned.. but they are fun, interesting movies.. not instant classics with academy award winning acting.

A cartoon can't get nominated for an academy award. Hey, remember Beauty and the Beast's 6 oscar nominations and an impressive Best Picture nomination? I do.

We all remember The Lord of the Rings like it was yesterday. You were a big fan of the books, but made fun of more then a Star Wars fan, because these books had elves, goblins, trolls, and magic. We all remember heading into that theater, anxiously awaiting a movie directed by The Frighteners acclaimed head man. Starring that kid from Deep Impact and The Faculty, Steve Tyler's daughter, that guy from Rudy (hey, he's still alive?), a little known role player named Viggo Mortensomething and Sallah himself. We creamed ourselves watching the trailers and seeing the epic battle scenes. We were fan boys.. nerds.. loving every single second of this hyped up movie, that other people called gay and boring. Remember when we walked out of the theater talking about how this is the best movie ever? How it should win Best Picture? Well.. I saw Ian McKellin get a nomination for a role that looks to be played down compared to Heath Ledger's joker. I saw the three movies in the trilogy wrack up an insane amount of oscar nominations, including 3 best picture noms. And I saw Return of the King snag 11 oscars.

This isn't the kind of movie to get an oscar nomination. Star Wars, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Pirates of the Carribean, The Lord of the Rings, Beauty and the Beast, even The Incredibles were all nominees or winners of major categories. So, give it a rest with all of the hate. Either you're a Spider-man fan, pissed off at the world because the way your trilogy ended up was a complete and utter mess and have to sit through Batman smashing what Spidey used to hold as "the best comic book movies ever made" or you're just purely a hater. You need to open your eyes and realize the insane possibility of this film.

[Badbird]

Jesus, people. It's a fucking Batman movie. I don't care if it has all the substance in the world (hardly), it's still a Batman movie (and a sequel) and will be viewed as such. Just because it's three hours long doesn't mean it's Oscar worthy.

Some people take this shit way too seriously.

Don't forget, X-Men 2 had near universal praise as a movie, and Hugh Jackman as an actor. Did that get any nominations? Did anyone even consider it seriously for nominations? No and no.

If Dark Knight is half as good as X2, I'll be shocked.

[FLAME_ON]

Acting aside, this movie has a resume filled with Academy recognition:
Chris and Jonathan Nolan were both nominated by the Academy for writing Memento.
TDK Film editor, Lee Smith, has been nominated once by the Academy.
TDK Cinematographer, Wally Pfister, has been nominated twice. Once for Batman Begins; the other for The Prestige.
TDK Costume Designer, Lindy Hemming, won an Oscar.
TDK Production Designer, Nathan Crowley nominated once for The Prestige.
Nothing really needs to be said about Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard.
Plus who knows, the Academy might give Chris Nolan a director nomination for not only being a bad ass and directing a great film, but for his use of IMAX technology, an extensive and detailed production, and for being a bad ass. (Okay... I might be stretching it there.)

But the Academy will give this movie props... whether or not that means Ledger will get a nod, the rest of the production will be acknowledged.
All I'm saying, is just because this movie is about superheroes and costumed people... if it kicks enough ass, the Academy is not going to be turned off because it’s based on a comic book... The costumes are the only thing separating the movie from any other "normal" movie.
Everyone knows Nolan is one of the most professional, disciplined, and serious directors out there, and skilled; so it has to cross people's minds at some point, "Why would this elite director and filmmaker waste his time with this film if it's about some silly cartoon character??"
I like to believe a part of Nolan's goal with The Dark Knight is to show people that he might be making a movie about Batman but this will be a masterpiece nonetheless.

[FLAME_ON]

Going deeper into the costume thing... if you took away Batman's costume, made Bruce Wayne a private investigator. And took away the Joker's makeup and purple suit. And you called the movie "Escalation"... it wouldn't be a comic book movie anymore. So I find the whole "it's a superhero movie" argument a little weak.

[echo_bravo]

If Dark Knight is half as good as X2, I'll be shocked.

Well prepared to be shocked then.;)

[The Heart Collector]

And this is relevant because...?


If you can get excited about Equilibrium enough to put it in your "Best Movie" box, why can't people get excited about The Dark Knight enough to suggest that it might get a Supporting Actor nomination? You're acting like everyone here is some fucking moron for looking forward to The Dark Knight, like it were some children's movie or something.

It's not like it's out of the question. Supporting Actor nominations, which is what Ledger would most likely get, aren't exactly exclusive. Cuba Gooding Jr has one for fuck's sake. It's likely to be one of the most talked about performances of the year, by virtue of being his last, it'll probably be pretty good and iconic too, the movie will probably get very strong reviews and make a metric fuckton of money, and the Academy owes him one for Brokeback Mountain. Johnny Depp got nominated for Best Actor (not even Supporting... ACTOR. BEST ACTOR) for a much less serious, much less critically beloved movie about Pirates, and he wasn't even dead. But they "owed him one" since he'd had a long, respected career by that point. The movie will be visible enough, the fact that Ledger died *could* lead people to make more out of the performance than there is to it, and hell, it might actually be such an iconic performance it deserves a Supporting Actor nomination. Note that I don't think he actually will, but it's not like it's absolutely out of the question.

[JohnLocke2342]

trying to compare Hugh Jackman's performance in X-Men to Heath Ledger's in The Dark Knight is actually kind of insulting. Yes, these words are premature but really.. what did Hugh do to prepare for the role of Wolverine? Hit the gym 5 times a week and deepen his voice?

I'm pretty sure Heath Ledger locked himself in a hotel room for a month, secluded, keeping a journal of his thoughts, trying out voices, and gestures, and postures, exploring the depths of his character.

Please, please, please don't compare those. And I love X-men, and Hugh Jackman as Wolverine. I don't see any comparisons besides being the main character (or one of) of a comic book based movie.

[Badbird]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

And, no, I don't think people are morons for anticipating The Dark Knight. But I've become very cynical and skeptical over the years. And when it comes to hype, especially this kind of hype, I have problems.

Where everyone else sees the greatest movie ever made, I see the sixth Batman movie in two decades. One that is a sequel to a pretty good, but not that remarkable action movie from a couple years ago. The three hour running time is a warning sign to me. That reeks of bloated, self-important, over-indulgent, Matrix Reloaded/At World's End-level over doing it.

Remember how Spider Man 3 was gonna be awesome? Remember how The Matrix Reloaded was gonna rock the world? And remember how confused and disappointed we were leaving the theaters? Hell, look no further than Indiana Jones last month.

Nothing is foolproof.

[fooknasty]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

I don't think that's the case at all. I believe there were people on this board who were very adament about their prediction of Heath getting an Oscar nod even before his death.

[The Heart Collector]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

But he isn't alive. He's dead. Which feeds into the idea of a possible Oscar nomination. In fact its one of the key points.

If Heath Ledger had never existed we wouldn't be having this conversation, either.

[The Heart Collector]

The three hour running time is a warning sign to me. That reeks of bloated, self-important, over-indulgent, Matrix Reloaded/At World's End-level over doing it.

You are aware the movie is only 12 minutes longer than Batman Begins, right? No, you aren't aware of this.

[Tweek]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

And, no, I don't think people are morons for anticipating The Dark Knight. But I've become very cynical and skeptical over the years. And when it comes to hype, especially this kind of hype, I have problems.

Where everyone else sees the greatest movie ever made, I see the sixth Batman movie in two decades. One that is a sequel to a pretty good, but not that remarkable action movie from a couple years ago. The three hour running time is a warning sign to me. That reeks of bloated, self-important, over-indulgent, Matrix Reloaded/At World's End-level over doing it.

Remember how Spider Man 3 was gonna be awesome? Remember how The Matrix Reloaded was gonna rock the world? And remember how confused and disappointed we were leaving the theaters? Hell, look no further than Indiana Jones last month.

Nothing is foolproof.

I wasn't horribly disappointed by The Matrix Reloaded. (I still 100% love the big freeway chase sequences for example.) I can't possible talk of PotC as I've not seen any of them.

Maybe all the hype became more noticeable after his death but there was still a huge chunk of it before. And while I'm not saying he's a lock and they should have the ceremony right now (that would be silly) I'm merely saying it's not out of the question. It's not foolproof that he'll win or get a nomination nor is it foolproof that he won't.

[brodeurnumber1]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

Except that since the trailer came out before I Am Legend, lots of people were thinking Oscar. And if Nicholson can get a nomination at the Golden Globes for playing himself in white makeup for Batman, then Ledger can get a nomination at the Oscars.

[Digifruitella]

I honestly can't see how the Academy would simply ignore a film based on its' genre. Having seen the trailers and the 6 minute prologue everything just screams "Academy Award Nominee" It doesn't take seeing the actual film to already see just how great Ledger is in this role. If they at least do not recognize his acting by simply nominating him then I feel very sorry for "The Academy" and their bias towards genre films

[a7xfan]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.

And, no, I don't think people are morons for anticipating The Dark Knight. But I've become very cynical and skeptical over the years. And when it comes to hype, especially this kind of hype, I have problems.

Where everyone else sees the greatest movie ever made, I see the sixth Batman movie in two decades. One that is a sequel to a pretty good, but not that remarkable action movie from a couple years ago. The three hour running time is a warning sign to me. That reeks of bloated, self-important, over-indulgent, Matrix Reloaded/At World's End-level over doing it.

Remember how Spider Man 3 was gonna be awesome? Remember how The Matrix Reloaded was gonna rock the world? And remember how confused and disappointed we were leaving the theaters? Hell, look no further than Indiana Jones last month.

Nothing is foolproof.


thank you, my feelings exactly


i think this will deliver alot of the things people are expecting, but not on the level they are waiting for.

[Moviefan1234]

If Heath Ledger was alive, this conversation wouldn't be happening. Period.


What the fuck? The Oscar buzz started last year, you might want to think back a bit there bud.

[JohnLocke2342]

From an article on IMDB entitled "Film critic: Ledger's Joke is oscar worthy"

"One of America's most revered film critics has started championing Heath Ledger for a posthumous Oscar in his review of the tragic actor's final completed film.

In his critique of The Dark Knight, Rolling Stone's Peter Travers calls Ledger's portrayal of The Joker "mad-crazy-blazing brilliant." He goes on to write, "It's typical of Ledger's total commitment to films as diverse as Brokeback Mountain and I'm Not There that he does nothing out of vanity or the need to be liked.

"Ledger's Joker has no gray areas - he's all rampaging id. He creates a Joker for the ages."

Ledger, who died from an accidental drug overdose in January, takes on The Joker role which Jack Nicholson portrayed in Tim Burton's 1989 Batman film. The Dark Knight hits cinema screens next month.

And Travers in convinced Ledger is bound for Oscar gold: "If there's a movement to get him the first posthumous Oscar since Peter Finch won for 1976's Network, sign me up."

from the couple of early reviews this movie has managed to get.. it seems like everything we've waited for and more. This is not spider-man 3, this is not the second matrix. At all.

[DarthWade]

Unless the picture is better than we think its going to be. what if its nominated for best picture or best director?

The academy has been coming around. They made a point to prove that with ROTK. If Ledger's performance is oscar worthy, he'll get a nom.


That would be awesome...I'd love that.

I just want to see this thing already dammit. I'm seeing commercials for it on tv now and it's driving me up the wall that it's not coming out sooner.

[Badbird]

But he isn't alive. He's dead. Which feeds into the idea of a possible Oscar nomination. In fact its one of the key points.


That's a pretty poor reason to get an Oscar Nomination. Plus, I never heard anything about an Oscar until right after he died.

And last I heard, the movie pushed 165 minutes. If it's been trimmed down since then, well goody-goody.

[Moviefan1234]

Have you seen the reviews that have begun to come trickling in Badbird? Looks like we have a masterpiece on our hands.

[brodeurnumber1]

That's a pretty poor reason to get an Oscar Nomination. Plus, I never heard anything about an Oscar until right after he died.

Well then you must have decided to not listen to ANYTHING related to The Dark Knight prior to Ledger's death.

[FLAME_ON]

How in God's name is this movie's quality being compared to X-Men 2, Spiderman 3, and (wtf) The Matrix Reloaded?! I'm dumbfounded... if you can't see the difference between those and The Dark Knight (I’m not talking about the hype, but for the quality of movie) I think the Batman brand is clouding your thoughts.

Yes, this is a movie about Batman. But when I say, "This movie is going to be good, like Oscar good." Batman is not on my mind and the hype machine doesn't mean anything; I base my assumption upon the people involved in the production, the tone and feel of the film, the story, the direction of certain elements. I think people are seeing the hype for this movie as, "OMG THAT NEXT BATMAN MOVIE IS GOING TO RULE! BATMAN RULES! BATMAN! OH MAN THAT BATMAN-DARK KNIGHT THING IS GOING TO BE THE BEST MOVIE EVER!" or, "OMG THE DARK KNIGHT IS THE GREATEST THING IN THE WORLD! I'M GOING TO PAINT MY FACE LIKE THE JOKER LOL!"... And I'm not even going to lie, that's the hype I see from a lot of general people who go to see movies of the week... them and many, many fanboys.
But the people who are backing up the film's quality are people who understand what this movie will be in the end, a very excellent and well-made film.

Just like many reviews I've been reading about WALL-E... I've read a dozen times already, "It's just a great film, not because it came from Disney or Pixar, it just is." (or something along those lines). Plus I've already read buzz about WALL-E being considered for Best Picture; not Best Animated Picture, but Best Picture.
If the movie is good, it's good. It doesn't matter what it's based on, about, or in WALL-E's case, how it's made.
So my point is, yes, there is a ridiculous amount of hype behind The Dark Knight and yes this is a movie about a comic book superhero; but the people who are serious about throwing Heath Ledger and The Dark Knight into the Academy's consideration list are people who look beyond Batman and the genre and see it as a potentially phenomenal film.

[dellamorte dellamore]

I agree , this looks to be an extremely well made film , not simply a great Batman film , it's readily evident from the clips i have seen . Great acting , story , visual effects , sound design . I love how it seems like everything in this film , in this world that Nolan has created is understated save for the Joker . Nothing about the film seems to draw attention to itself , it just flows as one cohesive whole . I think if Ledger went over the top with his rendition of Joker , he would have created too much of a tonal contrast with the rest of the film , but he seems to have effectively immersed himself in this world without overdoing it .

Nicholson was so goofy he dominated Bat 89 ( he's still great though ) , Ledger's take is somewhat of a " quiet " madness that doesn't so much dominate the proceedings but enhances the conflict between him , Batman , Dent , and the law enforcement of Gotham .

[john_rambo]

I will second anyone who said there was oscar buzz before his death... I was not personally saying it (and I am not saying he will not get nominated) but I do remember people saying it when the first trailer came out. I may be in the minority but I always thought nicholson deserved some consideration back in the day for his joker. Either way... the Dark Knight needs to come out it has been my most anticipated for months now.

[therealjohng]

To the people who say that Oscar consideration was being thrust upon Ledger long before his death...ummm....prove it.

[Jon Lyrik]

Some people buzzed about it, very few. Mostly fans. Now is quite a bit different. Yes, his death is a factor, and a nomination is not unprecedented.

[athf1980]

He could get a nod because there could that lack of movies because of the upcoming actors strike if all the key Oscar movies are done being made.

[Moviefan1234]

To the people who say that Oscar consideration was being thrust upon Ledger long before his death...ummm....prove it.

It was thrust upon him shortly after he was named for the role. Ledger was still coming off of his brilliant turn in BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN. I still remember the day I read the news with Nolan saying Ledger has a treat in store for us all with his spin on the Joker. The first thought that came to my mind was Oscar gold. And as I recall I wasn't the only one. Now it looks like that gut instinct is turning out to be pretty accurate.

[therealjohng]

That isn't proof.

[CyclicNightmare]

When did the teaser come out? I remember people saying it was the most Oscar worthy laugh they'd ever heard.

[Moviefan1234]

That isn't proof.

What the hell? Dude I know what I was thinking. This goes back to fucking summer 2006. As soon as he was cast, my firsts thoughts were thinking he's going to do something really special that'll be remembered come award season. And other schmoes were thinking the same thing, maybe not as early as I was, but once those trailers started coming out he was being mentioned with the best supporting actor nominations.

[Natty]

To the OP:

A) We can if you think about it, I was pretty confident that Daniel Day-Lewis and Tommy Lee Jones would be nominated for Oscars this year even when thier films weren't yet released.

B) The Academy have given dead actors Oscars and nominations before, just because they died before the ceremony, their film and performance can still qualify for awards.

:confused:

[therealjohng]

What the hell? Dude I know what I was thinking. This goes back to fucking summer 2006. As soon as he was cast, my firsts thoughts were thinking he's going to do something really special that'll be remembered come award season. And other schmoes were thinking the same thing, maybe not as early as I was, but once those trailers started coming out he was being mentioned with the best supporting actor nominations.


Still isn't proof.

[zombievictim]

Still isn't proof.

I would agree with MovieFan and back him up but I know all you'll say is "That still isn't proof" so I'll just let it go.

[therealjohng]

I would agree with MovieFan and back him up but I know all you'll say is "That still isn't proof" so I'll just let it go.


All I wanted was a couple of links.

[thedudeman69]

I would agree with MovieFan and back him up but I know all you'll say is "That still isn't proof" so I'll just let it go.

That is not proof. It's Moviefan's opinion. That's a big fucking difference

[Moviefan1234]

That is not proof. It's Moviefan's opinion. That's a big fucking difference

Well isn't everything regarding who will get Oscar nominations opinion? I say Ledger should get a nomination, others disagree. Until the nominations come out it's all that, just opinion. And, therealjohng, there is no definite proof I can offer you, but it's what I've been thinking since summer 2006. It's up to you to take me for my word or not. The choice is yours. But I can promise you, I've been saying it for almost two years now, this role will garner him an Oscar.

[therealjohng]

Well isn't everything regarding who will get Oscar nominations opinion? I say Ledger should get a nomination, others disagree. Until the nominations come out it's all that, just opinion. And, therealjohng, there is no definite proof I can offer you, but it's what I've been thinking since summer 2006. It's up to you to take me for my word or not. The choice is yours. But I can promise you, I've been saying it for almost two years now, this role will garner him an Oscar.


That's fine, I thought you had posted it here.

[fooknasty]

Chicago Sun-Times

The Oscar buzz for Heath Ledger's performance in ''The Dark Knight'' even has his co-stars in the new ''Batman'' film talking.

During a chat with this column Friday in Los Angeles, the movie's lead -- Christian Bale, again playing Bruce Wayne/Batman, told me, ''When we were in Chicago filming, watching Heath creating his own unique take on the Joker was one of the most amazing things I've ever witnessed as an actor. ... We became so close making this film. I truly feel I've lost both a friend and great acting partner. He absolutely deserves an [Oscar] nomination for that.''

Heath Ledger as the Joker and Christian Bale as Batman in a scene from "The Dark Knight," opening July 18.

Gary Oldman, who plays Lt. Jim Gordon, told me, ''I think Heath's going to win the Oscar, posthumously. After we did our first scene together, I called a friend and said, 'This is one of those actors you dream of working with. He's genius in this role.'''

As for rumors that playing the deeply disturbed, psychotic Joker had lingering effects on Ledger's own psychological state -- perhaps contributing to the reasons he eventually overdosed on prescription drugs -- Oldman said he doubts those tales. ''We had lots of conversations. Between takes, he'd be laughing and joking and totally normal -- often talking about his daughter, Matilda, whom he clearly adored.... Plus, he talked about his future -- wanting someday to direct and write films he had in his head.''

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/zwecker/1030995,CST-FTR-zp30.article

I thought this was really interesting, since everyone has been all up in arms about whether or not Heath's performance was, in fact, exceptionally special.

[CyclicNightmare]

Pfft. Gary Oldman is just a stupid fucking fanboy.

[zombievictim]

Pfft. Gary Oldman is just a stupid fucking fanboy.

Hahahaha that had me laughing like no other. Thanks for that.

[dennisv]

Heath will be nominated, but doubt he would win. We have another 6 months to go.

I was going to continue on and attempt long, witty explanation, but then I realized...


this thread and rant sucks.

Just watch the damn movie out of simple and innocent fun without drawing swords on each other debating whether or not he will win or be nominated. Really. For Heath.

[Jon Lyrik]

Yeah, I think he can be nominated.

My two really out-there wishes for a nomination: Paranoid Park and Wall-E for Best Picture.

[JCPhoenix]

How in God's name is this movie's quality being compared to X-Men 2, Spiderman 3, and (wtf) The Matrix Reloaded?! I'm dumbfounded... if you can't see the difference between those and The Dark Knight (I’m not talking about the hype, but for the quality of movie) I think the Batman brand is clouding your thoughts.

Yes, this is a movie about Batman. But when I say, "This movie is going to be good, like Oscar good." Batman is not on my mind and the hype machine doesn't mean anything; I base my assumption upon the people involved in the production, the tone and feel of the film, the story, the direction of certain elements. I think people are seeing the hype for this movie as, "OMG THAT NEXT BATMAN MOVIE IS GOING TO RULE! BATMAN RULES! BATMAN! OH MAN THAT BATMAN-DARK KNIGHT THING IS GOING TO BE THE BEST MOVIE EVER!" or, "OMG THE DARK KNIGHT IS THE GREATEST THING IN THE WORLD! I'M GOING TO PAINT MY FACE LIKE THE JOKER LOL!"... And I'm not even going to lie, that's the hype I see from a lot of general people who go to see movies of the week... them and many, many fanboys.
But the people who are backing up the film's quality are people who understand what this movie will be in the end, a very excellent and well-made film.

Great post; this is the heart of it for me. I am admittedly not a big comic-book fan - I think Superman is one of the most flat characters ever created (kryptonite is not a flaw it's a dumbass crutch) and while I do think Venom is cool and I like some comic book movies, I've never been one to really look forward to them all that much.

That said, The Dark Knight is the first comic book movie that I've ever really, truly looked forward to. Why? It's pretty simple and it's pretty much what FLAME_ON said above - it's the quality of the people behind it, the story, and the tone and feeling that I'm getting from the trailers. I think Christopher Nolan is as close as we have to the next great director - he's been consistently good (Insomnia 7/10) to great (Following 8/10, Memento 10/10, Batman Begins 9/10, The Prestige 8/10) and he's never made a bad movie. The team he's assembled is fantastic; the actors equally so. I may like X2 a decent amount but I don't think it transcends the popcorn comic book movie (not that there's anything wrong with that kind of comic book movie). With Nolan though, I've come to expect quality. Batman Begins was as close as we got to a comic book movie that treated its material in a deadly serious manner and even more - actually tried to bring in some complex themes (the X-Men series started to but Ratner's X3 had no idea wtf it wanted to say about those themes) and did it fairly successfully.

Comic book movies have seemingly followed so many of the same conventions throughout with fantastical villains, lighter/jokier tones, special powers, and lots of big, crazy *extreme* action sets that it's a wonder when something comes along that transcends that. Batman Begins, as good as it is, doesn't fully do that but everything I've seen from The Dark Knight, everything I've heard about it makes it sound like a real possibility for the first comic book film that will do that.

Having rewatched some of Nolan's movies again lately (Memento, The Prestige), I've been trying to think of the right word to use to fit how I feel about them - and I think that word is dense. His movies are filled from brim to brim with an incredible amount of thematic elements and subtleties in dialogue, even extraordinary detail in production design, etc...his movies have an almost literary richness to them - something that in some cases went a little over my head the first time around (The Prestige). His movies are absolutely the kind that you can go back and rewatch and pick out the layers of meanings and themes; they would make excellent subjects for essays. In fact, the film that comes to mind that I could see Nolan having made (that he didn't) is L.A. Confidential - an incredibly dense, rich piece of filmmaking. L.A. Confidential is a much more vivid/flashy film than Nolan would make but nonetheless, that's the kind of sensibility as a filmmaker that I see in Nolan.

Bringing that literary richness to the Batman universe is exactly what it needs...Batman has always been (in my mind) the most interesting of the comic book characters because he is human, because he's a darker hero than most. The dense noirish sensibilities that Nolan brings to the table are a fantastic match for Batman. The Dark Knight looks like a crime drama/thriller more than a comic book movie from what I've seen and that seems to be the early word too.

This is a little hard for me to explain - quite simply, it looks like it is possibly the first to truly break out of the comic book mold. See - I don't think of "comic book" as a genre. But it's become a kind of genre, a way to describe all these films that have sprung up out of those origins. But just think about that for a second - a comic book movie is a bit of an oxymoron, no? That's like saying adaptations of books should be "book movies". The fact that we can describe them as "comic book movies" indicates some kind of formula going on, some kind of comic book trappings (not that I think of comic books in a negative way, but in the translation from medium to medium) that keep them from becoming just - movies. A comic book movie will truly and finally be successfully translated to the film medium when it is finally called something other than a comic book movie. When it is actually slotted into a genre rather than that term "comic book movie". And The Dark Knight seems to be the first to *possibly* do that.

Okay sorry for that long long ass analysis/post; it started off as a short agreement with FLAME_ON and expanded into a whole new tangent. But anyway, the point of all that is - in short, it's the quality of this movie, the pedigree behind it that's got me interested. And that same pedigree and possible full translation to the movie medium I think makes it not unlikely that Ledger could get a nomination for this.

[Cop No. 633]

I'm really looking forward to the film. It just feels like one of those films where all planets align just for the project. Still, I'm happy to see Batman being handled with a darker pallet than before. I personally couldn't care less about Oscar talk. I just want to see a great film.

We'll never get to see the Joker we want to see, but I'm happy they're doing something different than copying Nicholson. I hope this experiment works... but one day, some time in the future, I want to see this Joker:

http://forum.theemiratesnetwork.com/uploads/shariqq_ArkhamAsylum.jpg

[Tweek]

Great post; this is the heart of it for me. I am admittedly not a big comic-book fan - I think Superman is one of the most flat characters ever created (kryptonite is not a flaw it's a dumbass crutch)



I <3 comics and I don't care for Superman either. You're not alone. You're. Not. Alone.

[FLAME_ON]

Having rewatched some of Nolan's movies again lately (Memento, The Prestige), I've been trying to think of the right word to use to fit how I feel about them - and I think that word is dense. His movies are filled from brim to brim with an incredible amount of thematic elements and subtleties in dialogue, even extraordinary detail in production design, etc...his movies have an almost literary richness to them - something that in some cases went a little over my head the first time around (The Prestige). His movies are absolutely the kind that you can go back and rewatch and pick out the layers of meanings and themes; they would make excellent subjects for essays. In fact, the film that comes to mind that I could see Nolan having made (that he didn't) is L.A. Confidential - an incredibly dense, rich piece of filmmaking. L.A. Confidential is a much more vivid/flashy film than Nolan would make but nonetheless, that's the kind of sensibility as a filmmaker that I see in Nolan.

Bringing that literary richness to the Batman universe is exactly what it needs...Batman has always been (in my mind) the most interesting of the comic book characters because he is human, because he's a darker hero than most. The dense noirish sensibilities that Nolan brings to the table are a fantastic match for Batman. The Dark Knight looks like a crime drama/thriller more than a comic book movie from what I've seen and that seems to be the early word too.

Wow man... "Literary richness"; if that doesn't describe Nolan, no other words can. This is a great post.

[notchreturns]

He will definitely be nominated and maybe even win.

It's a near late July release. If his performance is that great, it won't be forgotten.

It's not like it's getting a March release or something.

[The Postmaster General]

Gary Oldman said he thinks Ledger is a lock.

Of course, what does he know, he's just an actor fanboy who cares about nothing but acting.

[bigred760]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080702/ap_en_mo/film_ledger_oscar_buzz_1;_ylt=AgKdaRZO7Kj66hI14ju9 6doE1vAI

Title of the piece: "No joke: Ledger's Batman villain has Oscar shot"

[The Postmaster General]

As a side-note, if Ledger does win, it would make him the youngest winner, beating out Brody by a year. More obstacles?

[therealjohng]

As a side-note, if Ledger does win, it would make him the youngest winner, beating out Brody by a year. More obstacles?


You can't really do that since Brody won a Lead Acting Oscar and Heath would be Supporting.

[Badbird]

Well, you know what? Sideways was a shoe in to win it all too... Picture, Director, Actor, etc... and guess who didn't even get nominated? Hint: see avitar. This is just part of the hype machine.


To me, this reeks of the same hysteria that preceded Episode I. Not the Oscar buzz specifically, but the fan-boy-frothing-at-the-mouth stuff in general.

I saw the trailer again tonight, and it looks fine. Although you might think it was the Harvey Dent movie, based on how much screen time he gets. Bale is almost an afterthought. But what strikes me most is how puny Ledger is. Between his scrawny stature and winy voice, I really get nothing out of him.

But, whatever. If the fanboys want to make him a martyr, let them. I'm just not excited about this movie. Sue me.

[JohnLocke2342]

every single review of this movie I've seen so far has called it a masterpiece, one of the best movies of the year, and has mentioned oscar buzz for ledger, or best picture. Every one.

[The Postmaster General]

You can't really do that since Brody won a Lead Acting Oscar and Heath would be Supporting.



Oh yeah, I forgot.

[CyclicNightmare]

But, whatever. If the fanboys want to make him a martyr, let them. I'm just not excited about this movie. Sue me.
I'm not sure what your point is. It's clearly not just the fanboys who are driving this hype train.

[Tweek]

But, whatever. If the fanboys want to make him a martyr, let them. I'm just not excited about this movie. Sue me.

Who's making him a martyr? Is it just through the Oscar buzz that you've come to this?


It's quite fine if you're not excited for the movie. No mob will chase you down and drag you to a showing. No litigation is need.

[bigred760]

As a side-note, if Ledger does win, it would make him the youngest winner, beating out Brody by a year. More obstacles?

I assume you mean male winner . . . since Tatum O'Neal and Anna Paquin were tots when they won.

Well, you know what? Sideways was a shoe in to win it all too... Picture, Director, Actor, etc... and guess who didn't even get nominated? Hint: see avitar. This is just part of the hype machine.

Yet . . . it didn't win any of those.


To me, this reeks of the same hysteria that preceded Episode I. Not the Oscar buzz specifically, but the fan-boy-frothing-at-the-mouth stuff in general.

You can say the same for the Matrix sequels. And there are those of us who thought the SW prequels and Matrix sequels are pretty freakin' good . . . I saw Phantom Menace four times in theaters.

High expectations aren't always a good thing, but I really think The Dark Knight will live up to them (maybe more) or at least come very very close.

[Servo]

If Heath Ledger is nominated, I will be the first to write an extremely lengthy apology.

I have no doubts that his performance will be awe-inspiring, and zero doubts that this movie will be fantastic. And though I did say I had doubts it was Oscar-worthy, as the date grows closer and having just witnessed the Domino's trailer (my freaking GOD I can't wait now), those doubts are beginning to subside.

But my lack of faith in the Academy is what drove me to write this thread in the first place. Maybe if Jack Nicholson was in his most career-defining performance and then dropped dead after the production, sure, I'd be on the bandwagon that would state he's on the road for a nom.

But we'll see. We'll just have to see. If he gets nominated, before I write my apology, I will be cleaning my shorts of shit and jizz. It may take a while.

[dellamorte dellamore]

Better wear Depends , it will make the mop up operation a bit easier .

[dellamorte dellamore]

Bad , there is no way the hype for Sideways can compare to the hype for TDK . Sideways was considered an art house film that could . Once the oscar buzz started to heat up and it got nominated , it started to play to the mainstream somewhat . I never thought for a second the film deserved all the attention it received . It was a good film , with a great performance by PG , but man was that thing blown out of proportion . It's obligatory to pimp a small " indie " every year ( Juno , Little Miss Sunshine , ad nauseum ), there is a quota .


Tdk though , this thing exists in another realm altogether , not even the academy will be able to ignore it's importance . I liken the hype to ROTK , it's definitely on that level or higher , groundbreaking for the genre , but more importantly , a film that will most likely transcend the genre .

I have no doubt , from what iv'e seen so far , it will at the least , get nominated for multiple awards , acting , directing , sound . I couldn't say for sure what it will win , but it's no doubt going to get the recognition i'm sure it deserves .

Of course , a small , insignifigant indie will come along around awards time and steal some of it's thunder , but this film is already on the cusp of legendary status , by sheer force of cinematic will , Tdk will be celebrated by the academy .

[Reigh Kaufman]

I would like to recant my earlier post which stated that Heath Ledger would not receive a posthumous award (even though I personally believe he should have already won Best Actor for 'Brokeback Mountain'). Today's critical response and the resulting pressure that the critics/media are placing on the Academy will see Ledger receiving a posthumous award. His performance is getting near hysterical levels of praise, and the Academy will undoubtedly yield...

(...and no-one will ever stop arguing over which came first: the work, or the aftermath of the performance).

[bigred760]

I don't think he'll win just because he (tragically) died. But he'll definitely be nominated . . . there's little doubt in my mind now.

[jeo4]

I remember seeing the first images of the Joker and seeing him as a train wreck of a man. He was disheveled, worn, a complete mess. His actions were psychotic and random, with nothing more than self-amusement and personal gain in mind. He appeared as less of a cartoon character and more a disaster waiting to happen. This is just a throwback to the comic book version of the Joker as he was originally created in the 40's. This doesn't necessarily create added value for the character, though it makes it more true to his original form. (It also doesn't take away from what I consider to be a very good performance by Jack Nicholson in the 1989 version.)

That said, I still need to see this performance before I can judge for myself what's been done with the role. Even if it is mind blowing, I'm pretty skeptical of any comicbook flick getting an Oscar nod in any major category. However...

1. The Fugitive debuted in August of 1993. Nearly eight months later, Tommy Lee Jones walked away with a best supporting win as Samuel Gerard. It doesn't seem so far fetched for the academy to look back at any role throughout the year and offer a nomination.

2. Ledger has had Oscar buzz before, which makes the possibility of another nomination more realistic, depending on his performance. And while colleagues' ringing endorsements don't necessarily mean a win, it says a lot to hear so much from nearly every direction in the industry, including fellow actors, directors, and people who don't normally look at a film like this and get into the hype. On a professional level, he's earned lots of praise. In the academy, this could carry some weight.

3. The media is schooling like hungry pirhana preceding the release of this film. The enormous buzz it's receiving isn't based solely on Ledger's death. Critics are blown away by how fantastic this film is and the performances by several people, not just one. While we will never know how much Oscar talk the film would have had while Ledger was alive, it seems like this film goes above and beyond expectations. It does seem apparent though, that he's made a place for himself in history with this performance. Will it be enough to earn an Oscar nomination or even a win? I suppose anything is possible.

[DaveyJoeG]

But what strikes me most is how puny Ledger is. Between his scrawny stature and winy voice, I really get nothing out of him.


What? At 6'1 Ledger is the same height as Bale, and taller than Eckhart. I remember being relieved that they picked such a tall and slender actor to play the Joker after Nicholson's short, chubby version. I don't know about whiny but the Joker is supposed to have a dynamic voice that hits high and low ranges to reflect his theatricality.

Like Jeo4, and others, have said, Ledger was getting oscar buzz before he died. Without a doubt he was the most talked about aspect of the movie. His death just brought even more attention to the role.

[Animal]

I don't have plans of watching it in theatres, so that makes two of us.

Not sure if i will yet - Im kinda bored with all the hype and sick of the joker atm. They've milked it far too much in the last few months. Fanboys be dammed...

[Shinigami]

Almost nobody can wait patiently for this movie to arrive. I'm excited enough to try and grab some opening night tickets (fat chance!). A lot of that excitement carries over into the things I say about The Dark Knight, sure, but oh my god doesn't Ledger have a good shot?
People are forgetting that The Oscars themselves sometimes appear to be influenced by "hype", and the hype for Ledger's performance has transcended fanboys and fangirls into the mainstream levels of our pop-culture. Everyone is clamoring about one of this wonderful actor's last performances.
I don't know any better, so I have to throw down 100 for Ledger being a lock on a nomination. Either way, I can't wait for July 18th!

[a7xfan]

Almost nobody can wait patiently for this movie to arrive. I'm excited enough to try and grab some opening night tickets (fat chance!). A lot of that excitement carries over into the things I say about The Dark Knight, sure, but oh my god doesn't Ledger have a good shot?
People are forgetting that The Oscars themselves sometimes appear to be influenced by "hype", and the hype for Ledger's performance has transcended fanboys and fangirls into the mainstream levels of our pop-culture. Everyone is clamoring about one of this wonderful actor's last performances.
I don't know any better, so I have to throw down 100 for Ledger being a lock on a nomination. Either way, I can't wait for July 18th!

exactly, i have been trying to stress this


8 months ago, i would of laughed at someone saying 'heath will win an oscar for this'

6 months ago, if the same thing was said, i would have agreed.

and i still do. and my opinion is NOT based on his performance, c'mon people its the oscars, they go for popular choices nowadays, which aren't allways the right choice, shit, hardly ever the right choice.

we will see. but i too would put £100 on him being nominated at least.

[redfiretruck]

I don't think we should be giving Oscars out to a loser drug addict anyways.

Oh. My. God. That's all I have to say to that. And I think a nomination for him is a toss-up; it could happen, and it could not. Either way I'd be happy.

[ElderPredator]

People! If Johnny Depp can be nominated for an Oscar for "POTC", anybody can as far as I'm concerned.

[thedudeman69]

People! If Johnny Depp can be nominated for an Oscar for "POTC", anybody can as far as I'm concerned.

Great Argument ender, sir.

[Jon Lyrik]

Yeah, this thread has been had, because it's not just fanboys now.

[therealjohng]

People! If Johnny Depp can be nominated for an Oscar for "POTC", anybody can as far as I'm concerned.


That was a pretty good performance though.

[ElderPredator]

That was a pretty good performance though.

Yeah, but it wasn't Oscar worthy. A Golden Globe maybe.

[ElderPredator]

Great Argument ender, sir.

Thanks dude, I'm just saying that this entire thread is pointless because of the fact I mentioned earlier. Ledger will get the nomination, there is no doubt of that in my mind.

[fooknasty]

Thanks dude, I'm just saying that this entire thread is pointless because of the fact I mentioned earlier. Ledger will get the nomination, there is no doubt of that in my mind.

Everything that I have been reading in regards to his performance has gotten me so unbelievably excited for Friday night.

[The Postmaster General]

I think he has a good shot, but will add that I think there's a fanboy line crossed when you go from saying there's no reason he shouldn't be nominated if it's a good performance and saying HE WILL BE NOMINATED!!!!

The latter statement of which I think was the sort of statements that resulting in this thread being started.

[Lost in Space]

fuck that

[APzombie]

Ebert also brought it up. He said he'll have a chance...

Mind you. Ebert is usually in touch with the academy. He was the guy who said Crash would likely win over Brokeback.

[Moviefan1234]

fuck that

Fuck what exactly? Are you agreeing or disagreeing? (I'm just curious to the tone of your post, that's all)

[Lost in Space]

Fuck what exactly? Are you agreeing or disagreeing? (I'm just curious to the tone of your post, that's all)

Sorry, I am just being a prick, the whole idea of claiming oscar worthy performances for a film that is yet to be released. i say...fuck that

[Moviefan1234]

Sorry, I am just being a prick, the whole idea of claiming oscar worthy performances for a film that is yet to be released. i say...fuck that

People are just excited man. I'd be lying if I said he doesn't look to be hype worthy in his role.

[john_rambo]

Well, now, as the first person posting in this thread who has seen the movie.. let me tell you, heath does not deserve to just be nominated... he deserves to Win this damn oscar. It truly saddens me we can not see him do more with this character in the sequel.

[zombievictim]

Well, now, as the first person posting in this thread who has seen the movie.. let me tell you, heath does not deserve to just be nominated... he deserves to Win this damn oscar. It truly saddens me we can not see him do more with this character in the sequel.

I only read the first part of this post then I got distracted and had to go do something. But for a second I thought you were crazy. Upon reading it FULLY, I couldn't agree with you more. Best performance I've seen this year.

[BakeTheMooCow]

I agree that his performance is the best so far this year and if that remains true, he deserves to win. This is not just hyperbolic fanboy talk. His performance was mind-blowing.

[the clever guy]

so i'm going to go ahead and ask this:


servo, do you still think he won't be at the very least nominated? his performance had so much dynamic to it, it was literally some of the best acting i've seen in a long time. i'm not saying that because he's dead and all. in fact, i used to not like heath ledger, then again, i was basing this off of 10 things (hated it) and a knight's tale (hated it, too...sorry guys). but after seeing snippets in trailers BEFORE he died, i fell in love (with his demeanor and overall, albeit small, performance if the role). there were so many different attributes and emotions and expressions and physicalities to his role, i would see it as blaspemy (sp?) for him to not, at the very least, get a nom. heath BECAME the joker and not did the character kill people in the movie, he also killed the very man who personified him. that, my friends, takes dedication, talent, and most of all...commitment. every other actor noticed this and are vouching for him to be nominated.

now we can all say, after seeing his brilliant performance, that he will [should] get a nom, and hopefully a win.

[Brendan M.]

"Watch me make this pencil disappear."

[muttly69]

I cant see the joker getting a oscar. But haven't sean the movie yet.

[bigred760]

I have seen TDK and I'll say he at least deserves a nomination. But we're only in July and there's still a lot of movies and Oscar-bait performances to be seen.

I know that as of right now, he's got my vote come Golden Schmoes time.

[countchocula]

Look on the bright side. At least Heath Ledger's daughter will grow up without a father.

Seriously, this is a classic case of Star A.D. I suppose his performance is made that much more stunning when you take his "personal demons" into consideration. Sadly, he'll be nominated regardless of whether or not he deserves it.

[Raoul Duke]

He does deserve a nomination, and he'll probably get one.

[AshleysDad]

Anything can happen in Hollywood. Not likely to win, but he just might get nominated.

I still think Ian McDiarmid deserved to be nominated for Revenge of the Sith.

[adamjohnson]

The problem at this point is not the caliber of his performance but rather the TIMING. Its well known how short the academys memory is, often the most recent films getting all the awards.

So, to me, a nomination would be all we could hope for. And I think he'll get that.

[bigred760]

The problem at this point is not the caliber of his performance but rather the TIMING. Its well known how short the academys memory is, often the most recent films getting all the awards.

So, to me, a nomination would be all we could hope for. And I think he'll get that.

It's not unheard of that a movie released mid-year would be remembered come Oscar time . . . especially if The Dark Knight is as big as predicted. Gladiator was released in May, and it won Best Picture and Best Actor; Pirates of the Caribbean: Curse of the Black Pearl came out in July and garnered a Best Actor nod for Johnny Depp.

[Brendan M.]

The problem at this point is not the caliber of his performance but rather the TIMING. Its well known how short the academys memory is, often the most recent films getting all the awards.

So, to me, a nomination would be all we could hope for. And I think he'll get that.

Too true. Although it should come out on DVD around December so hopefully that might refresh their memories?


Also, does anyone know of any other big films they're filming right now that might be Oscar worthy? Martin Scorsese has Shutter Island coming out in October.

[therealjohng]

Martin Scorsese has Shutter Island coming out in October.


Of NEXT year.



I don't think Ledger should be nominated, I think Gary Oldman should be nominated. I think he gave the standout performance.

[JohnLocke2342]

Of NEXT year.



I don't think Ledger should be nominated, I think Gary Oldman should be nominated. I think he gave the standout performance.

I agree with giving Oldman recognition, but absolutely died inside with the thought of replacing ledger's joker in an award category with James Gordon. Come on. As much as I love Oldman and thought he was such an incredible part of this film I can't possibly agree with that.


After finally seeing it today, yes, I truley believe that Ledger will get a nomination and win for Best Supporting Actor at the 2009 Academy Awards.

[bigred760]

I'm kind of curious as to Servo's (the thread-starter) take on Ledger's performance now that the movie's out.

[gorila]

Brad Pitt for 12 Monkeys
Edward Norton for Primal Fear


Heath Ledger for The Dark Knight

Actually Heath Ledger reminded me of Brad Pitt doing Jeffrey Goines at the mental hospital.

* none of them won. Brad Pitt lost to Kevin Spacey, and Edward Norton lost to Cuba Gooding Jr.

[Servo]

I have to see it again. I'm in shock over the film as a whole. I'm seeing it tomorrow on IMAX, I'll give an updated opinion then.

[Jon Lyrik]

Nice Crow (T. Robot)-eating, dude. :D Nah, but seriously, this is about as disputable as Wall-E winning Best Animated Film.

[electriclite]

Bottom line, the Academy loooooves nominating performances of psychos, drunks, addicts, the physically and mentally disabled and disfigured.

The Joker counts for 2 of those ;)


As for the timing of this movie in regards to the Academy's short memory: Joaquin Phoenix and Russell Crowe in Gladiator ring a bell? And that move came out in May.

[JohnLocke2342]

I have to see it again. I'm in shock over the film as a whole. I'm seeing it tomorrow on IMAX, I'll give an updated opinion then.

the movie in IMAX is the way it was supposed to be seen. It's absolutely incredible and I think the best movie theater/viewing experience of my life. I'm 21.


and servo, I'm really curious if you still think Heath doesn't even deserve a thought about being nominated for an oscar, let alone winning it. Do you still feel that way? Or do you think he should win won? I'm honestly very curious. If you do, don't play it off like you don't, and try to say that "he was amazing and I loved him in it but doesnt deserve an oscar..." because you think youll be contradicting yourself. Be honest....I doubt anyone here really gives a shit about that, or about saying "Haha! I told you so!" I think people just wanna know how you feel. Because people feel so strongly about this film. Thanks.

[zombievictim]

Bottom line, the Academy loooooves nominating performances of psychos, drunks, addicts, the physically and mentally disabled and disfigured.

The Joker counts for 2 of those ;)

Judging by the way he licks his lips and his limp, there may be more :D

[dfnshow]

it's still a comic book movie and the academy doesn't seem to like comic book movies or fantasy based stuff...if they did, don't you think jonny depp would have won an oscar by now ?

[bigred760]

it's still a comic book movie and the academy doesn't seem to like comic book movies or fantasy based stuff...if they did, don't you think jonny depp would have won an oscar by now ?

Well, the Lord of the Rings franchise would beg to differ, especially The Return of the King going 11 for 11 in 2003.

And Johnny Depp has never been in a comic book movie, and has been nominated for one fantasy movie, a drama, and a dark musical. The Academy LOVES the last two.

[Le_Big_Mac]

The Academy is too "high-brow" to nominate Heath Ledger for Best Supporting Actor, even though he deserves to win.

[bigred760]

The Academy is too "high-brow" to nominate Heath Ledger for Best Supporting Actor, even though he deserves to win.

What do you mean "high-brow?"

[Le_Big_Mac]

That they think all summer blockbusters or raunchy comedies aren't sophisticated enough to deserve Oscar recognition outside of the production value-related categories even if they actually surpass what they are expected to be. Or at least the possibility has been lost on them since Raiders of the Lost Ark was nominated for Best Picture.

[bigred760]

That they think all summer blockbusters or raunchy comedies aren't sophisticated enough to deserve Oscar recognition outside of the production value-related categories even if they actually surpass what they are expected to be. Or at least the possibility has been lost on them since Raiders of the Lost Ark was nominated for Best Picture.

Again . . . Gladiator was a summer blockbuster (released in May) - won Best Picture and Best Actor, nominated for Best Supporting Actor. Pirates of the Caribbean: Curse of the Black Pearl was a summer blockbuster (released in July) - nominated for Best Actor.

And The Dark Knight is not a raunchy comedy.

It's not unheard of that a movie released over the summer can be nominated for a major Academy Award. Yes, the majority of summer movies are not looked upon as Oscar contenders, but it has happened before and I think it'll happen in this case.

[chasingbanky]

The Academy is too "high-brow" to nominate Heath Ledger for Best Supporting Actor, even though he deserves to win.

Few un-truer words have ever been said.

[JohnLocke2342]

Few un-truer words have ever been said.

I totally agree. But when, lately at least, has there been a huge summer movie that has honestly deserved oscar regonition? That was such a huge, massively popular hit at the box office, and in the eyes of the world's top film critics? It's not like Indiana Jones was gonna get an acting or screenaply oscar nod, or Transformers, or Shrek, or Armageddon. Maybe for effects and shit but not the big categories. Come on. Summer movies are a bunch of fun, but not oscar worthy shit. This however, is an exception. It's a crime drama that was released in the summer because it had Batman in it. I don't see how you can put this movie in that category.

But, Big Mac, I get what you're saying.. because the academy is that despicable and stubborn to simply ignore this movie and treat it like other summer movies. Regardless of what people say, critics say, or audiences say. I feel you on this.

[Preston_79]

Ledger's performance might, MIGHT be worthy of best of, but as far as best picture for TDK, no chance in hell.

Of course these are my humble opinions. Ever so humble.

What Ledger did was pretty awesome, but I think his death muddles things a bit. Would be be considered if he were alive? I guess we'll never know. Personally I don't think he would.

[zombievictim]

What Ledger did was pretty awesome, but I think his death muddles things a bit. Would be be considered if he were alive? I guess we'll never know. Personally I don't think he would.

Yeah since his death really affects the performance. I mean had he been alive, it would've been a completely different performance. Not even discernible.

[bigred760]

Yeah since his death really affects the performance. I mean had he been alive, it would've been a completely different performance. Not even discernible.

I think what he's saying is that the performance is not Oscar-worthy, but because Ledger died, the Academy will honor him with a posthumous nomination.

Personally, I think he will be, and would've been, nominated either way.

[Preston_79]

I think what he's saying is that the performance is not Oscar-worthy, but because Ledger died, the Academy will honor him with a posthumous nomination.

Personally, I think he will be, and would've been, nominated either way.

That's exactly what I'm saying.

Why that so difficult for some to wrap their mind around? I'm not the one who started the thread. I'm not yelling my opinion in your ear. And if he did win a million awards for TDK, guess who has two thumbs and doesn't give a shit? This guy right here.

God damn, sometimes I have to lay shit out so delicately. People get their panties all in a bunch.

[Walter Sobchak]

That's exactly what I'm saying.

Why that so difficult for some to wrap their mind around? I'm not the one who started the thread. I'm not yelling my opinion in your ear. And if he did win a million awards for TDK, guess who has two thumbs and doesn't give a shit? This guy right here.

God damn, sometimes I have to lay shit out so delicately. People get their panties all in a bunch.

Preston, I think he did understand what you were trying to say. Some people pretend to be dumb, because they'd rather have a smart ass sarcastic response than acknowledge the point you're trying to make.

[zombievictim]

I knew exactly what you were saying. Hence the sarcasm. The whole "The only reason he's getting recognition cause he died" gets really old and annoying.

[Walter Sobchak]

Ledger's performance might, MIGHT be worthy of best of, but as far as best picture for TDK, no chance in hell.

Of course these are my humble opinions. Ever so humble.

What Ledger did was pretty awesome, but I think his death muddles things a bit. Would be be considered if he were alive? I guess we'll never know. Personally I don't think he would.


maybe you should read this again then zombie victim because that's not what he said.

[zombievictim]

He says it right there. He says that he doesn't think Ledger would be nominated had he not died. Maybe I'm not the one that needs to reread that.

[jaw2929]

As fantastic as his performance as the Joker was.... I agree, Heath wouldn't be nominated for an Oscar, if he were still alive. Bottom line.

[poopontheshoes7]

I honestly think he deserves it. He created one hell of a character. The Joker and Anton Chigurh are the only truly menacing villains I've seen in a film in a very long time. Not once did I ever see ledger under that make up.

[Walter Sobchak]

The whole "The only reason he's getting recognition cause he died" gets really old and annoying.

He says his performance is awesome.

No where does he say the only reason he's getting recognition is because of his death. Only that he wouldn't get nominated. That's the world we live in.

[Preston_79]

As fantastic as his performance as the Joker was.... I agree, Heath wouldn't be nominated for an Oscar, if he were still alive. Bottom line.


Agreed.


He deserves recognition, just not an Oscar.:eek: Now, can we move on?

[Brendan M.]

But the Oscar has never before looked so serious.

http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/694/n1143807072901532823kk7.jpg

[Moviefan1234]

As fantastic as his performance as the Joker was.... I agree, Heath wouldn't be nominated for an Oscar, if he were still alive. Bottom line.

That's not true at all. The Oscar buzz started before his death.

[therealjohng]

That's not true at all. The Oscar buzz started before his death.



Maybe internet fanboys, but not the major critics.

[Moviefan1234]

Maybe internet fanboys, but not the major critics.

A lot of Oscar buzz has started on the internet, it's the new medium for free Oscar campaigning for studios.

[Nazgul]

Heath Ledger will win it. BOOK IT!

[thedudeman69]

A lot of Oscar buzz has started on the internet, it's the new medium for free Oscar campaigning for studios.

Yeah, in this decade. but in the 90's it was all trade papers.

[therealjohng]

A lot of Oscar buzz has started on the internet, it's the new medium for free Oscar campaigning for studios.


I understand that, but it was still just fans who were highly anticipating the movie that were talking.

[Danger^Cart]

I'll throw my hat into the pro Oscar bin. Whenever an actor in the past transformed themselves so unconditionally, they've been at least nominated for a statue. I don't feel Ledger should be any different because of what medium the source material comes from.

Best Picture and Director noms as well.

[Moviefan1234]

I understand that, but it was still just fans who were highly anticipating the movie that were talking.

Pre trailer release it was mostly the fans, yes, but once that trailer got released the shit hit the fan and Ledger was getting significant Oscar buzz. And for good reason. His death has/will have very little to do with whether or not he wins awards. He has created one of the most menacing villains in recent memory.

[therealjohng]

His death has/will have very little to do with whether or not he wins awards.

I disagree with that statement, but it's very hard for either of us to prove our side.

He has created one of the most menacing villains in recent memory.

Completely agree.

[notchreturns]

Ledger's Joker is just as well-acted and delivered to the big screen as Javier Bardem last year in No Country.

If the Oscars were today, he'd have the win.

And if he wins, it will have more to do with the fact that he gave one of the best, most effective performances in recent history. Not that he died.

It's obviously a performance worthy of recognition.

Why wouldn't he be nominated if he were alive? Because it's a comic book film? Too early a release? Yeah, I don't buy it. It's going to end up one of the better reviewed movies of the year and no film is going to garner the attention it had.

[psycheoutsteve]

I'll throw my hat into the pro Oscar bin. Whenever an actor in the past transformed themselves so unconditionally, they've been at least nominated for a statue. I don't feel Ledger should be any different because of what medium the source material comes from.

Best Picture and Director noms as well.

Completely agree!!!!! Ledger really did transform himself, and as a result gave us the greatest depiction of the Joker yet. Nolan really deserves the best director nomination as well, he really pulled it off. The movie itself is one of the best films in recent years and can stand alone not only in the comic book realm, but in the genres of action, drama, and crime as well. I hope it gets best picture come the oscars.

[Jon Lyrik]

It can even be nominated for Best Picture now that it's on track to make over $500 million and becoming the highest-grossing film of the decade including inflation. Some things are just too big for the Academy to ignore.

[DimDO]

I honestly think Ledger, Nolan, and the movie itself deserve recognition, but I worry that it won't happen just because it's a comic book movie. Hopefully, the people who decide these things will realize, as many of us have, that this is more than a comic book movie.

[thedudeman69]

http://hijinksensue.com/comics/2008-07-21-dark-knight-heath-ledger-oscar.jpg

[jeo4]

While it's nice to see that Tommy Chong took time from his busy schedule to see The Dark Knight with Arrow and JoBlo, the cartoon makes a good point. Lots of detractors are making a 180. This film is the real deal.

[dellamorte dellamore]

I was totally convinced that he would get a nomination for his brill performance alone , but now that i think of it , his character is a bit too fantastical to convince some of the members to take him seriously .

Now , i think everyone can agree , at least the people that experienced Bat 89 in the theaters , Jack stole every scene and blew people away . The buzz surrounding his performance was much the same as it was for heath's now . This was jack as an over top , goofy , sociopathic clown , and even if people may not feel it was as transformative performance as heath's is , there is no doubt , Jack was the main attraction concerning that film . He was charismatic , riveting , funny , and chilling all at the same time . A larger than life villain like we had never seen before in a comic book movie . The interpretations may be different but the impact they had on their respective films , and the public's response are basically the same , it was all about Jack in that summer of 89 as it is all about Ledger this summer of 08 . Shows were sold out , people were quoting Nic , it was manic , it became an obsession .


Now , i don't recall , but i don't think there was any oscar buzz surrounding Jack's perf , but i didn't pay attention to such inane babblings back then , i just obsessed over films as a teen .


I seriously think that even a nom may be asking too much , but the academy may decide to give him one as a remembrance , even if right now , i don't think it's oscar worthy , and that's a compliment . Then again , he did play to the mainstream nihilist in all of us , so maybe a nod and even a win would make perfect sense . He's like a more fantastical version of Joe Pesci in Goodfellas with makeup , a mesmerizing psychopath that people can't take their eyes off of , a person that is much like a coiled spring , ready to become violent at a moment's notice , a psychopath for the emo generation . So if Pesci can win playing a psycho gangster in Goodfellas , maybe Heath can win for playing a psycho clown , but i have my doubts now that he will even get a nom , although i can't see the academy being that heartless . You never know .


The one thing that may hurt his chances is that the Joker , no matter how he's played , is inherently fantastical ( he seemed at times invincible and omnipotent in this film ) , the academy may not appreciate that aspect of the character , although most of that is the director's fault . Come on , a character who gets beat down and is in a motor vehicle crash that doesn't get hurt , they can't take him seriously . At least the violence in Goodfellas was painfully realistic as were the characters , the flights of fancy in Tdk may doom Ledger's chances . And no way is it winning best picture , for the same reasons .

[Nivekian]

http://hijinksensue.com/comics/2008-07-21-dark-knight-heath-ledger-oscar.jpg

LOL, thats great!

[Raoul Duke]

http://hijinksensue.com/comics/2008-07-21-dark-knight-heath-ledger-oscar.jpg

Like a black hole of comedy right there. Makes me want to regurgitate.

[Terror Australis]

http://hijinksensue.com/comics/2008-07-21-dark-knight-heath-ledger-oscar.jpg

LMFAO! That without a doubt is the funniest fuckin' thing I've read all day!

[Terror Australis]

Sorry, double post.

[the_ultimate_evil]

A lot of Oscar buzz has started on the internet, it's the new medium for free Oscar campaigning for studios.

actually it was cain and many film magazines during set visits that started the buzz not the fanboys

personally i think its a lock he will get a nom and there is a good chance of a win, and i do think he would have got a nomination had he lived, but had he lived i firmly believe a nom would have all he would have got

[john_rambo]

Well, I just gotta say, the prediction this thread laid out is really starting to not look good. I really am starting to get the impression this Heath Ledger bloke will get the nomination. Hey, he may even win it, who knows? I don't know what's giving me this idea... but it's like it came to me in a dream or something...

[Jon Lyrik]

Dude, this thread was embarrassing the week TDK came out. Fucking Dick Tracy had a Best Supporting Actor nomination.

[The Postmaster General]

I thought of this thread the other day, and how sweet it will be when it gets bumped AFTER the Oscar nominations.

[bigred760]

Dude, this thread was embarrassing the week TDK came out. Fucking Dick Tracy had a Best Supporting Actor nomination.

Well deserved one too (for Al Pacino).

Not only with Ledger be nominated, I'm betting he wins.

[Jon Lyrik]

Oh, I love Dick Tracy. A lot of people don't, though.

[APzombie]

dick tracy was brilliant. and ledger will win! :)

[Major Mojo]

Never been a Heath Ledger fan.. never been a big Batman fan either.. when i heard the oscar hype, i really believed it was because of his death, but then i saw the film... he was brilliant.. he does deserve the nomination, if not the win. most excellent!

[someguy]

I heard that as a tribute to Heath Ledger the 2009 Oscars will be a bloated mess.

[fooknasty]

I heard that as a tribute to Heath Ledger the 2009 Oscars will be a bloated mess.

Not quite sure what that means.....elaborate.

[The Postmaster General]

He's referring to Heath's physical appearance at the time of death.

[Servo]

I was afraid this would come around and bite me on the ass...
Afraid in a good way though. I'm glad the odds are for him. I was never opposed to him actually winning, just didn't have much faith in Senor Oscar. But seeing as to how there really isn't any competition for best supporting actor this year (aside from *MAYBE* Liev Schreiber in Defiance), it's a shoe-in.

[The Postmaster General]

Servo, it takes a big man to laugh at their own follies, and it takes an even bigger man to laugh at that man!

(props to Jack Handy...)

[Smiert Spionam]

I have such a great "Epic Fail" picture for this thread once Ledger gets the nomination.

It's quite exciting....

[Tweek]

I have such a great "Epic Fail" picture for this thread once Ledger gets the nomination.

It's quite exciting....

Well damn it! It's not going to live up to the hype you've created in that post. You know that, right? ;)

[Marcelo]

Even though I don't think it'll happen I still have hope. It's a comic book movie but ever since the Lord of the Rings, being a fantasy film, won for Best Picture perhaps the Academy won't ignore the Dark Knight after all.

[someguy]

I have such a great "Epic Fail" picture for this thread once Ledger gets the nomination.

It's quite exciting....

I'm sure it won't be as great as you think it will be.

[Servo]

Tomorrow's the big day, Schmoes. It seems people are waiting to bump the shit out of this thread if it's announced he gets nominated.

Strike, Schmoes. Strike true.

[Turboshandy]

Suck it!!! Suck it hard!!!

boy I bet you wish you really didn't start this thread now.

[The Postmaster General]

As I said following the critics choice awards...

I thought of this thread the other day, and how sweet it will be when it gets bumped AFTER the Oscar nominations.

Timing is 99% of the fun. Waiting, like a ninja. Only the lonely light up a smoke before coitus. But you can count all your baskets while the eggs are being dropped from you, and 2 hens in my pants equal 15 in her bush.

[someguy]

Servo may have egg on his face, but Heath Ledger is still a corpse so at least he has that.

[muttly69]

http://www.aolcdn.com/music-photos/olsen-twins-music-feature-kurt-courtney-300.jpg

Maybe they could get the Olsens to the announce the winner.