How a Conservative thinks

[SpoonMan999]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/06/25/beck.conservatives/index.html?iref=mpstoryview

Thought this was interesting, it's an article written by a conservative about a conservative's mindset.

[Vong]

Too bad there isn't another option for him.

[SpoonMan999]

Too bad for all Conservatives, I'm not a big fan of John McCain's policies but I agree with him more than I do Obama.

[Homyrrh]

I'm no exception. Although I am a "conservative," I'm not a "Republican," and there's a big difference. A true Republican, or a true Democrat, is someone who puts their party above their principles and their candidate above their conscience.

Amen.

[Vong]

A typical political response to a conservative feeling like his party is not "conservative enough" would be to break off and begin another one with more conservative ideals. Same can be spoken about a liberal and his "liberal" party not being "liberal enough".

Politicians and political critics in the U.S. are either lazy or ignorant to create change.

[Homyrrh]

Actually a spectacular synopsis on the whole.

[Homyrrh]

A typical political response to a conservative feeling like his party is not "conservative enough" would be to break off and begin another one with more conservative ideals. Same can be spoken about a liberal and his "liberal" party not being "liberal enough".

Politicians and political critics in the U.S. are either lazy or ignorant to create change.
Then there'd be no bitching to profit from...

[Vong]

Then there'd be no bitching to profit from...

Bitching about politics should not be for money, it should be to influence change. Dark are the days when political critics write for fame and glory rather than promoting reforms or, if needed, subversive advocacy.

[SpoonMan999]

A typical political response to a conservative feeling like his party is not "conservative enough" would be to break off and begin another one with more conservative ideals. Same can be spoken about a liberal and his "liberal" party not being "liberal enough".

Politicians and political critics in the U.S. are either lazy or ignorant to create change.

With the political system the way it is creating a third party is a waste of time. No thirdy party candidate will ever be elected because we've become too comfortable in this two party system.

[Vong]

With the political system the way it is creating a third party is a waste of time. No thirdy party candidate will ever be elected because we've become too comfortable in this two party system.

And that my friend is one of many things wrong with America.

[SpoonMan999]

And that my friend is one of many things wrong with America.

Glad we could agree.

[QUENTIN]

With the political system the way it is creating a third party is a waste of time. No thirdy party candidate will ever be elected because we've become too comfortable in this two party system.

It's that kind of defeatist thinking that prevents a third party candidate from being elected, and little else. If you don't see yourself properly represented by the Democrats or Republicans, then vote third party. I'm voting for Nader because otherwise I'd be voting against my own self-interest and the benefit of the American people. Submitting to the "lesser of two evils" thinking is just accepting the bullshit system that those evils put into place.

[MadsenOMC]

It's that kind of defeatist thinking that prevents a third party candidate from being elected, and little else. If you don't see yourself properly represented by the Democrats or Republicans, then vote third party. I'm voting for Nader because otherwise I'd be voting against my own self-interest and the benefit of the American people. Submitting to the "lesser of two evils" thinking is just accepting the bullshit system that those evils put into place.

Nader and Bob Barr will be on the ballot so people will have options if they are not happy with the two major party candidates.

[Homyrrh]

It's that kind of defeatist thinking that prevents a third party candidate from being elected, and little else. If you don't see yourself properly represented by the Democrats or Republicans, then vote third party. I'm voting for Nader because otherwise I'd be voting against my own self-interest and the benefit of the American people. Submitting to the "lesser of two evils" thinking is just accepting the bullshit system that those evils put into place.
It's great and idealist to vote for Nader if that's your conviction. I'd vote for him too if it was possible for him to win...

Defeatist or not, idealists often fall to their realist champions.

[QUENTIN]

I'm not under the impression that Nader has a shot. But vote for anyone else and my vote doesn't count. I'd argue that if you really don't feel represented by McCain or Obama, then don't vote for them. If you don't like the two-party system, vote outside of it and the more people are willing to do that, the more a third party or fourth will be a viable option with a realistic chance.

It wasn't so long ago that Ross Perot got 19% of the popular vote.

[MadsenOMC]

I think Beck is an idiot, but aside from that, a lot of what he says is ridiculous. For example, I am a husband and father. I strongly believe in the importance of family. It is absurd to suggest that that is a conservative principle.

[SpoonMan999]

I'm not under the impression that Nader has a shot. But vote for anyone else and my vote doesn't count. I'd argue that if you really don't feel represented by McCain or Obama, then don't vote for them. If you don't like the two-party system, vote outside of it and the more people are willing to do that, the more a third party or fourth will be a viable option with a realistic chance.

It wasn't so long ago that Ross Perot got 19% of the popular vote.

Ross Perot also dropped a fuck-ton of money on his campagin.

[Homyrrh]

I think Beck is an idiot, but aside from that, a lot of what he says is ridiculous. For example, I am a husband and father. I strongly believe in the importance of family. It is absurd to suggest that that is a conservative principle.
He said that's what a conservative believes, along with th blueness of the sky and the brightness of the day.

[SpoonMan999]

He said that's what a conservative believes, along with th blueness of the sky and the brightness of the day.

Yes, he never said it was an exclusive belief, merely this is something true Conservatives value.

[MadsenOMC]

Yes, he never said it was an exclusive belief, merely this is something true Conservatives value.

It is something human beings value.

[SpoonMan999]

It is something human beings value.

Not all human beings value family, many people resent their families or even despise them. You're blowing his statement way out of proportion.

[MadsenOMC]

Not all human beings value family, many people resent their families or even despise them. You're blowing his statement way out of proportion.

Maybe, but it was merely one example of many. I just generally disagree with Beck and don't think much of him.

[SpoonMan999]

Maybe, but it was merely one example of many. I just generally disagree with Beck and don't think much of him.

So, he's an idiot for that? Because he doesn't think like you?

I guess Hom is an idiot as well, though I think Hom is the most intelligent and tolerent person posting on this board?

[MadsenOMC]

So, he's an idiot for that? Because he doesn't think like you?

What the hell man? I never said that. I never even inferred it. I have no idea where you got that from. I never said "he doesn't think like me therefore he is an idiot." Go back and read my posts, slowly and carefully. I believe statements he has made show a lack of intelligence, like the infamous "prove to me you are not a terrorist" comment to the Muslim congressman from Minnesota.

I guess Hom is an idiot as well, though I think Hom is the most intelligent and tolerent person posting on this board?

We'll just have to agree to disagree here.

[SpoonMan999]

I think Beck is an idiot, but aside from that, a lot of what he says is ridiculous. For example, I am a husband and father. I strongly believe in the importance of family. It is absurd to suggest that that is a conservative principle.

You called him an idiot and then mentioned that you disagree with him and don't think much of him. You didn't provide any other reasoning so this was how I interpreted it. I personaly don't pay much attention to who's writing what on the CNN site so I'm not aware of anything else he's written.

[MadsenOMC]

You called him an idiot and then mentioned that you disagree with him and don't think much of him. You didn't provide any other reasoning so this was how I interpreted it. I personaly don't pay much attention to who's writing what on the CNN site so I'm not aware of anything else he's written.

Well now you know.

[Homyrrh]

So, he's an idiot for that? Because he doesn't think like you?

I guess Hom is an idiot as well, though I think Hom is the most intelligent and tolerent person posting on this board?


We'll just have to agree to disagree here.

Why don't I just suggest the reasonable insertion of "one of" prior to Spoon's statement and call it fair, square, and over. After all, there's only a solid half-dozen or so that post daily in this forum anyway.

Otherwise, I still think he did well in compounding the concervative belief system into a nutshell. In no way did he exclude any other category of thought. Honestly, however, I'm an adherent to this pattern of thought and I despise my parents' for reasons than transcend all political or economic boundaries. It's actually a matter of logical and rational thought.

It's actually an intriguing thread in light of the one THC had going about the disparities and discrepancies revolving around ideological and party lines.

[MadsenOMC]

I am somewhat familiar with Beck, and I do believe that he is excluding other categories of thought. I believe he is saying these are conservative views. It isn't like he's the only one saying that. Conservatives have been claiming that they're the family values crowd for a long time now, for one example. I think he's saying these are conservative values and the values of a true conservative.

[SpoonMan999]

He never says anywhere in there that democrats/liberals don't value family, and democrats/liberals say the same kind of stuff about conservatives...some people just hate anyone with a diferent line of thought.

[MadsenOMC]

He never says anywhere in there that democrats/liberals don't value family, and democrats/liberals say the same kind of stuff about conservatives...some people just hate anyone with a diferent line of thought.

Like I already said, I don't hate him because he has a different line of thought. My wife and I don't have the same line of thought on everything. It's just what I believe about him based on what he has written and what I have seen of his show. It's just my opinion.

[SpoonMan999]

Like I already said, I don't hate him because he has a different line of thought. My wife and I don't have the same line of thought on everything. It's just what I believe about him based on what he has written and what I have seen of his show. It's just my opinion.

I didn't say you did, merely stating how many people do and how I made that mistake, as I've seen it happen a lot.

[mel1ssa]

With the political system the way it is creating a third party is a waste of time. No thirdy party candidate will ever be elected because we've become too comfortable in this two party system.

actually, the time will come. consider the fact that obama is a serious candidate for presidency, juxtaposed to 20 or 30 years ago, and this should tell you that tides change. (not to mention a year ago when hilary was the 'chosen' candidate). and look at the platform he is running on...

all we need is for someone to be an eloquent speaker and tell america how much change it needs and the public gets dewy-eyed and starts fainting. an independent could do the same thing (money should not be the hurdle it once was. think of the way obama is raising money -- online and receiving small donations -- and very successfully at that).

the independent must not be 'green'. the independent must not be a specialist, devoted to one agenda. the independent must have little background and have an influential persona.

there is a formula here which IMO makes it an absolute possibility that someone could do it. we're not there yet, but i believe the time will come. i don't think this is idealistic, and i'm not saying it because it's what i want. i just think that someone will figure this out and set the wheels in motion.

[Badbird]

LOL.

I just love how McCain "isn't conservative enough" for some people.

The guy is pro-war to the hilt; anti-abortion; pro-abstenence only education; pro-big business, etc.

You know, as far as I'm concerned, O'bama isn't liberal enough for me, but that doesn't mean I'm not gonna vote for him.

Obviously the ideal situation would to have multiple legitimate parties, but that's just not gonna happen in the current political environment, no matter how much Nader and Barr and Perot preach to the choir. I mean, we've had the libertarian party for a long time and it's accomplished squat.

And by the way, Glenn Beck is a tool.

[MadsenOMC]

I just love how McCain "isn't conservative enough" for some people.

The guy is pro-war to the hilt; anti-abortion; pro-abstenence only education; pro-big business, etc.


I've been saying this for a while now. He is hardly the maverick the media has made him out to be. He's very conservative.

[Homyrrh]

I've been saying this for a while now. He is hardly the maverick the media has made him out to be. He's very conservative.
Not the most conservative, like Romney or the oft-forgotten Alan Keyes, but a pretty concrete conservative.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

There are worse things than having to choose between the lesser of the two evils. We could live in a horrible world where the fringes make up countless third parties which do nothing more than horribly divide the vote. Then you end up getting one extreme no matter how the numbers turn out. This would make it possible for Focus on the Family to churn out a candidate who's even worse than Bush. President Dobson, anybody? This is why we should be more reluctant to embrace third parties. Party mindedness will always exist no matter how many parties there are. We'll always have people like Sean Hannity and James Carville who take party platforms as political gospel. A country without parties would be better.

In this election, people are going to look at people like Bob Barr and Ralph Nader because they don't agree with their own candidate enough. The problem with this is that a lot of people will still have to come to terms with who they're voting for. Barr was not a Libertarian when he was in Congress, and his own political philosophy did a complete 180 in only a few years. Nader will have to spend more time getting on the ticket than campaigning because he's an independent and isn't as rich as Ross Perot. Every candidate has an enormous downside. That's how it always is.

[MadsenOMC]

Barr was not a Libertarian when he was in Congress, and his own political philosophy did a complete 180 in only a few years.

Yeah talk about flip-flopping. I read an article about him (and the GOP's fear of his candidacy) a few days ago. In recent years he's drastically changed positions on a number of issues. His political philosophy has definitely done a complete 180.