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View Full Version : Piratebay founders sent to jail


Pentangeli
04-17-2009, 12:29 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8003799.stm


A court in Sweden has jailed four men behind The Pirate Bay (TPB), the world's most high-profile file-sharing website, in a landmark case.
Frederik Neij, Gottfrid Svartholm Warg, Carl Lundstrom and Peter Sunde were found guilty of breaking copyright law and were sentenced to a year in jail.
They were also ordered to pay $4.5m (£3m) in damages.
Record companies welcomed the verdict but the men are to appeal and Sunde said they would refuse to pay the fine.
Speaking at an online press conference, he described the verdict as "bizarre".
"It's serious to actually be found guilty and get jail time. It's really serious. And that's a bit weird," Sunde said.
"It's so bizarre that we were convicted at all and it's even more bizarre that we were [convicted] as a team. The court said we were organised. I can't get Gottfrid out of bed in the morning. If you're going to convict us, convict us of disorganised crime.
"We can't pay and we wouldn't pay. Even if I had the money I would rather burn everything I owned, and I wouldn't even give them the ashes."

The damages were awarded to a number of entertainment companies, including Warner Bros, Sony Music Entertainment, EMI, and Columbia Pictures.
However, the total awarded fell short of the $17.5m in damages and interest the firms were seeking.
Speaking to the BBC, the chairman of industry body the International Federation of the Phonographic Industry (IFPI) John Kennedy said the verdict sent out a clear message.
"These guys weren't making a principled stand, they were out to line their own pockets. There was nothing meritorious about their behaviour, it was reprehensible.
"The Pirate Bay did immense harm and the damages awarded doesn't even get close to compensation, but we never claimed it did.
"There has been a perception that piracy is OK and that the music industry should just have to accept it. This verdict will change that," he said.

The four men denied the charges throughout the trial, saying that because they did not actually host any files, they were not doing anything wrong.
Speaking on Swedish Radio, assistant judge Klarius explained how the court reached its findings.
"The court first tried whether there was any question of breach of copyright by the file-sharing application and that has been proved, that the offence was committed.
"The court then moved on to look at those who acted as a team to operate the Pirate Bay file-sharing service, and the court found that they knew that material which was protected by copyright but continued to operate the service," he said.
A lawyer for Carl Lundstrom, Per Samuelson, told journalists he was shocked by the guilty verdict and the severity of the sentence.
"That's outrageous, in my point of view. Of course we will appeal," he was quoted as saying by Reuters news agency. "This is the first word, not the last. The last word will be ours."
Political issue
Rickard Falkvinge, leader of The Pirate Party - which is trying to reform laws around copyright and patents in the digital age - told the BBC that the verdict was "a gross injustice".
"This wasn't a criminal trial, it was a political trial. It is just gross beyond description that you can jail four people for providing infrastructure.

"There is a lot of anger in Sweden right now. File-sharing is an institution here and while I can't encourage people to break copyright law, I'm not following it and I don't agree with it.
"Today's events make file-sharing a hot political issue and we're going to take this to the European Parliament."
The Pirate Bay is the world's most high profile file-sharing website and was set up in 2003 by anti-copyright organisation Piratbyran, but for the last five years it has been run by individuals.
Millions of files are exchanged using the service every day.
No copyright content is hosted on The Pirate Bay's web servers; instead the site hosts "torrent" links to TV, film and music files held on its users' computers.

shoe1985
04-17-2009, 01:05 PM
So, they don't host the files, but they do provide a search engine to lead to illegal files? Why not remove the coding to those files? They are going to lose because of this.

Homyrrh
04-17-2009, 01:38 PM
First lesson in not getting convicted of similar charges: don't name your site Pirate Bay.

the clever guy
04-17-2009, 02:03 PM
First lesson in not getting convicted of similar charges: don't name your site Pirate's Bay.


Before I started using that site, I thought it was a site for Pirate costumes, rum, and cannons. Boy was I wrong!

Yeah, naming a site where your main thing is pirated movies, music, and software...shouldn't be named 'Pirate Bay.'

Vong
04-17-2009, 04:15 PM
I applaud these guys, for standing up against their court ruling, which really is beyond bullshit.

Even if the Pirate Bay goes down, just like Suprnova and other popular torrent sites before them, more will take its place. You can't stop the internets!!

Jon Lyrik
04-17-2009, 04:18 PM
Yeah, you're not going to win against the massive swath of pirating internet users. This is about as winnable as the Drug War, and yet far more passive on either side.

The concept of intellectual property is bullshit anyway.

Mopar Fanatic
04-17-2009, 05:40 PM
Once something is on the internet it never goes away. TPB may be shut down but there are probably a thousand (random number) other places to get the same material.

The only way to slow this all down is for the federal government (dictatorship) to come in and start regulating the internet (which is what they want to do).

So what is the end result? Bigger, more powerful federal government. Hey, does anyone else see a recurring theme here?

Pentangeli
04-17-2009, 06:55 PM
Yeah, I think the general consensus is right, more sites will form. Or alternatively, simply more customers for Isohunt and Mininova.

Pentangeli
04-17-2009, 07:01 PM
So, they don't host the files, but they do provide a search engine to lead to illegal files? Why not remove the coding to those files? They are going to lose because of this.

Exactly, they don't have anything to do with file content. All they offer is a place for members to host files, and providing a link to these files. Similar to youtube, which also hosts copyrighted material. Will Youtube be attacked? you can bet your bollocks to a barn dance they wont.

shoe1985
04-17-2009, 09:43 PM
Once something is on the internet it never goes away. TPB may be shut down but there are probably a thousand (random number) other places to get the same material.

The only way to slow this all down is for the federal government (dictatorship) to come in and start regulating the internet (which is what they want to do).

So what is the end result? Bigger, more powerful federal government. Hey, does anyone else see a recurring theme here?

So, protecting the rights of companies is considered dictatorship? They own the material, not you or me, and if they want to sell it for a fee, you pay it or go without. I don't understand why anyone thinks they should get something for free when it is owned by someone else. Maybe we should let these industries die, and if you want music, movies, or even tv, it will be free. Can't wait to see what is released, and the quality.

Exactly, they don't have anything to do with file content. All they offer is a place for members to host files, and providing a link to these files. Similar to youtube, which also hosts copyrighted material. Will Youtube be attacked? you can bet your bollocks to a barn dance they wont.

Youtube has agreements in place with copyright holders. These torrent sites do not. Which is why they are not being attacked. Also, Youtube has taken all material from a record company already, but I believe they came to an agreement, so they went back up. See, if you play by the rules, there is no trouble.


Like I mentioned in another thread, this is a movie site with many people wanting to get into the business. How do you expect to get into the business if you steal from it? Why should they give you a job? If anything, people should be supporting this ruling, so they will have a job in the future, and then future filmmakers will have a job.

Do you work for free? Maybe you should if you think pirating other people's property is ok. If you disagree with my opinion, explain to me why it is ok to steal someone else's work? Saying that it is ok because they are rich doesn't cut it. Just because they have money from investing into someone's creative voice does not mean it is right to take from them. They worked to get where they are, maybe you should do the same.

Vong
04-18-2009, 01:03 AM
Do you work for free? Maybe you should if you think pirating other people's property is ok. If you disagree with my opinion, explain to me why it is ok to steal someone else's work?

This would be true if you physically stole or ripped the software yourself and distrubuted it on the net. The Pirate Bay only provided people access to the information. They themselves did not pirate what is offered. They are basically a middle-man between the internet public and the thousands of torrents offered on it. As internet users, we share no blame with those who commit the act of piracy. We never committed the act, we are only taking advantage of someone else who did.

If you robbed from the rich and gave to the poor (ala Robin Hood), would you arrest the poor for possessing the rich's money? Why would you? They are not to blame for stealing the money. They are merely passer-bys that were given the money. Same is applied to downloaders on the web. We are merely passer-bys on the world wide web that are given the opportunity to see or use something that was "obtained" through pirarteering. You didn't have to obtain it. You have a choice whether or not to download it.

The Postmaster General
04-18-2009, 01:36 AM
There's a law against receiving stolen goods, so yeah the poor would be charged with a crime.

Cosimo
04-18-2009, 01:47 AM
tis a sad sad day, free the people

outsyder
04-18-2009, 03:27 AM
I wonder if book publishing companies will go after those teachers who have been photocopying book chapters for years. Bloody criminals, stealing knowledge.

shoe1985
04-18-2009, 09:43 AM
I wonder if book publishing companies will go after those teachers who have been photocopying book chapters for years. Bloody criminals, stealing knowledge.

This is actually legal. If it is being used for educational purposes, it is ok. I believe it is ok for teachers to do (I know it is ok for teachers to do it as long it is related to school), but not for students to do, but could be wrong on that.


tis a sad sad day, free the people

Free the people? From what? This is illegal, and it should be controlled. If these torrent sites were filtering out illegal files, they would have no problem with any copyright holder. What happens on their engine is going to be their fault because they what was going on, and did nothing to stop it.

Vong
04-18-2009, 10:35 AM
This is actually legal. If it is being used for educational purposes, it is ok. I believe it is ok for teachers to do (I know it is ok for teachers to do it as long it is related to school), but not for students to do, but could be wrong on that.

It is actually very illegal for teachers to copy material from books without paying for it. You can't say something is ok just because it's educational. That would be like saying if I find educational value in the movie X-Men Origins: Wolverine I shouldn't be arrested for taking a copy from the producers.

shoe1985
04-18-2009, 10:39 AM
It is actually very illegal for teachers to copy material from books without paying for it. You can't say something is ok just because it's educational. That would be like saying if I find educational value in the movie X-Men Origins: Wolverine I shouldn't be arrested for taking a copy from the producers.

In college, we were taught from a lawyer, who was my professor and was also a DA at one time before going by to the other side, in a business class I had related to Law, that if a teacher is using the material in the class, not outside of class, it is 100% legal. If the teacher is distributing it outside of class, the teacher, not the school, would be in trouble.

Now, if a student went and copied a textbook without asking the publisher, they can get in trouble.

It is a double standard, but I don't make the laws.


I found a great article/link about this discussion with teachers, which can get them into trouble, but they should know what they can and cannot do:
Link (http://www.edutopia.org/copyright-rules-teachers)

Mopar Fanatic
04-21-2009, 05:47 PM
So, protecting the rights of companies is considered dictatorship? They own the material, not you or me, and if they want to sell it for a fee, you pay it or go without. I don't understand why anyone thinks they should get something for free when it is owned by someone else. Maybe we should let these industries die, and if you want music, movies, or even tv, it will be free. Can't wait to see what is released, and the quality.

As far as I can tell, Pirate Bay doesn't host any material. There are plenty of legal file sharing applications for which it can be, and is, used. This seems to me a little like sending the executives of GM to prison because a Chevy was used in a drive-by shooting. And you can say, "Oh, well they are called Pirate Bay... so obviously there is intent..." but so what? If GM made the Chevy Driveby, would it be right to send their executives to prison because some non-white used the car to murder people?

Since they were not hosting anything illegal, it seems to me that the government is here claiming jurisdiction of all sharing of information. That is not good.