Breaking Bad character tournament

[Chillingworth]

Sixteen characters from the best show on the air to determine the best. Or favorite. Or whatevs.

The Contenders: Badger Mayhew, The Cousins, Gale Boetticher, Gustavo Fring, Hank Schrader, Hector Salamanca, Jane Margolis, Jesse Pinkman, Marie Schrader, Mike Ehrmantraut, Saul Goodman, Skinny Pete, Skyler White, Tuco Salamanca, Walter White, and Walt Jr.

What happened:
OPENING ROUND
1. Walter White (6 votes) defeated Marie Schrader (0 votes)
2. Saul Goodman (5 votes) defeated Gale Boetticher (1 vote)
3. Skyler White (3 votes) defeated Tuco Salamanca (2 votes)
4. Jesse Pinkman (6 votes) defeated Jane Margolis (0 votes)
5. Mike Ehrmantraut (8 votes) defeated Hector Salamanca (0 votes)
6. Gustavo Fring (7 votes) defeated Skinny Pete (1 vote)
7. The Cousins (4 votes) defeated Badger Mayhew (3 votes)
8. Hank Schrader (8 votes) defeated Walter White Jr. (0 votes)
QUARTERFINALS
1. Saul Goodman (4 votes) defeated Mike Ehrmantraut (3 votes)
2. Jesse Pinkman (8 votes) defeated Skyler White (0 votes)
3. Walter White (8 votes) defeated The Cousins (0 votes)
4. Hank Schrader (8 votes) defeated Gustavo Fring (0 votes)
SEMIFINALS
1. Jesse Pinkman (8 votes) defeated Saul Goodman (0 votes)
2. Walter White (6 votes) defeated Hank Schrader (2 votes)
THE MAIN EVENT
Jesse Pinkman (5 votes) defeated Walter White (3 votes)

THE WINNER

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/JesseWin.jpg

JESSE PINKMAN, YO!

[Chillingworth]

OPENING ROUND

1.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/WaltVsMarie.jpg
Walter White vs. Marie Schrader

2.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/SaulVsGale.jpg
Saul Goodman vs. Gale Boetticher

3.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/TucoVsSkyler.jpg
Tuco Salamanca vs. Skyler White

4.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/JesseVsJane.jpg
Jesse Pinkman vs. Jane Margolis

[Chillingworth]

1. Walter White vs. Marie Schrader
2. Saul Goodman vs. Gale Boetticher
3. Tuco Salamanca vs. Skyler White
4. Jesse Pinkman vs. Jane Margolis

[JackassFan]

Walter White
Saul Goodman
Skyler White
Jesse Pinkman

[Zeus9]

Walter
Saul
Tuco
Jessee

[ilovemovies]

I'm guessing we're suppose to vote for our favorite character?

Walter
Saul
Skyler
Jesse

[Chillingworth]

I know these match-ups kinda suck, but that's the way brackets go. Walter and Jesse were my top two seeds, and Marie and Jane were numbers 15 and 16. Anyway, I vote:

1. Walter White vs. Marie Schrader - But I do this reluctantly. I seeded Marie at number 16 only because everyone else seems to hate her so much, but I actually like her quite a bit. She's one of those characters who is great on television, but I wouldn't want to actually know, kinda like House. Gregory House is probably my favorite television character of all time, but if I he was an actual person who existed in my world I'd probs hate him. Same thing with Marie. Sure she talks too much and nitpicks at stupid little shit and seems to think everyone should share her tendency to overreact, and those are all the things that would make her unbearable in reality, so actual real people would never get to know the good parts. Like the fact that she seems willing to do literally anything for the people she loves, and can turn from persnickety bitch to genuinely warm human being in a heartbeat, when the chips are down. When Hank has to give up his gun and badge and walks to the elevator, the way it opens and Marie is just standing there like a sympathetic and loyal puppy who wants to nuzzle away your tears, it is honestly an amazing moment. Betsy Brandt is fucking awesome in that scene, as well as when Hank says "I guess I'm just not the man I thought I was" and she wordlessly puts her head on his shoulder. Their interaction throughout One Minute was some of the most endearing and touching relationship stuff (which I usually hate) that I've ever seen, and it was so simple. There was more said in those quiet little moments than hours and hours of most relationship dramas. I think that was the episode where I really started feeling affection for her, and every since then it's seemed like the annoying aspects are just adorable glitches in an otherwise lovable character.
Now, all that being said, Walt is Walt. I'm gonna try not to think that way in future match-ups, letting Walt skate by just 'cuz he's so big a character, but this one's obvious. I'll get more chances to talk about him later.

2. Saul Goodman vs. Gale Boetticher - Another vote I hate to cast, but I gotta. I liked Gale a lot, and I would've loved to see how his character would fit into the Breaking Bad universe if given time to become more of a part of it. But alas and such. Much as I liked Gale, I like Saul more. He's greasy, he's smarmy, he's a bit of a lowlife, but all that makes him even awesomer. Also, I get the sense that underneath all the chatter he sorta likes Walt and Jesse, and when he calls them "the Three Amigos" it isn't entirely an attempt at manipulation. Mostly, but not entirely. We never really get into Saul's other clients and all on this show, but even if we did I think we'd find Walt and Jesse mean more to him than most and not entirely because of the money. Mostly, but not entirely. Saul seems to like being a part of the team, even if it is for selfish and somewhat greedy reasons, and I dig that about him.

3. Tuco Salamanca vs. Skyler White - I fucking hate Skyler. Now hold on, I did think the "it's a bad plan" scene did wonders for her and made her much more interesting in the context of the narrative, but I still fucking hate her as a character. In the beginning she was an overbearing bitch, but I've seen overbearing bitch characters that I liked because there's a sense that that stems from love. Skyler is not one of them. I see nothing resembling affection in her, there is something missing from her soul. Ultimately she's a selfish flip-flopper who will turn her opinion of a situation 180 degrees the minute it stops going exactly the way she wants it to. She pushed and pushed for a divorce, until she realized how much money was at stake, and then when Walter finally gives in and signs she changes her mind. Why? Because she knew she could regain complete control now by forcing herself into his seedier world, all the while blaming him and saying shit like "you drug us into this Walter." No, lady, he signed the goddamn papers. So using this sort of emotional terrorism she retains her upper hand, until Gus dies. And then all of a sudden I WILL NOT HAVE MY KIDS IN THIS ENVIRONMENT!! Well what the fuck kind of environment did you think it would be, manufacturing drugs and laundering money, you psycho? The minute she has some misgivings, it isn't just "whoa maybe this was a bad idea," it's Walter is a monster who she has to stand up to (ineffectively though it is). By making Walter the enemy, the bad guy, an external force who needs to be resisted, she regains some sort of control even if it's only the passive aggressive "I'll wait for the cancer" type. When Walter decided to turn, he went full measure. Skyler only went as far as she was comfortable, and then redefined the whole paradigm in her illogical little brain.
Tuco, on the other hand, he was pure insanity and I loved that.

4.Jesse Pinkman vs. Jane Margolis - I didn't like Jane either. First of all, I can't stand her face. Something about it annoys me, the way her features are all kind of disproportionate to one another. I immediately didn't like looking at her. Then there was the snubbing Jesse in front of her father thing, which Apology Girl only slightly made up for, and of course when she went off the rails against Walter. I wasn't sorry at all when she died. Now, having said that, she was one half of a moment that made me smile and feel kinda warm and fuzzy, which is rare on this show. When her and Jesse are sitting there watching his unreceptive satellite and she reaches over and takes his hand, that was just incredibly sweet in its innocence and almost moving. I was kinda happy for them at that moment. Also, when rewatching season two, there's that moment when Jesse tells her he's going to smoke some crystal and she should leave and Jane almost does, then pauses with her hand on the door. Even though I don't care much for her, even though I thought she was a sorta doormat character, there's still a part of me that's sad and wants to shout "no Jane, don't do it! Just walk out and come back later!"

Alright, I guess I'm done. At 8pm tomorrow my time I'll call these and post the next ones, even if no one else votes. I'm a little OCD about rules and sticking to the schedule and all when I do these things. Oh yeah, in the event of a tie at the final bell in any match-up, I will retract my own vote to break it. Later on when the matches are important and I feel more strongly about them I might have to consider other tie-breaking options, but 'til then that's the plan to keep things on schedule.

[Chillingworth]

I'm guessing we're suppose to vote for our favorite character?

Vote on whatever criteria you want. Personally yeah, I'm trying to avoid thinking such as "without Walter there would be no show" 'cuz in that six degrees kind of way every match-up becomes a clinical ranking of importance. I'm just trying to pick whoever I like more.

[The Postmaster General]

Walter White
Saul Goodman
Skyler White
Jesse Pinkman

[Zeus9]

3. Tuco Salamanca vs. Skyler White - I fucking hate Skyler. Now hold on, I did think the "it's a bad plan" scene did wonders for her and made her much more interesting in the context of the narrative, but I still fucking hate her as a character.

I agree. There's something "intrinsic" about Skyler that is distasteful.

[Darth Kenshin]

Walter over Marie - closer in my mind than in most other people's, as Marie is a much deeper and more interesting character than most people give her credit for. But Walter is... Walter. Plus, unlike other characters (which I'll get into later), Marie's subplots don't really take the story any where. I like her a lot, though.

Gale over Saul - I love Saul, but find him sort of cliche. He's just a grimy lawyer, made interesting only because of a wonderful performance. Gale, on the other hand, added something unique to the story, and the plot lines that revolved around him (particularly, the tension of potentially making Walt expendable, and of course Jesse killing him) added much more to the show than anything around Saul. So as characters, they are very close, but Gale, to me, added more dimensions to the story.

Tuco over Skylar - I don't like either character. Tuco was too over-the-top for me and felt out of place for the show, but I guess his insanity was needed to force Walt and Jesse to go the route they went. I find Skylar uninteresting and really just plays off Walt. I respect her intelligence and can't wait to see her conflict with Walt resolved, but when she's on screen I just don't like her.

Jesse over Jane - Jane is very underrated and I like her a lot for the same reason I like Gale: their stories contributed a lot to the development of certain characters and the direction of the story. Jane's impact on Jesse was crushing. But Jesse is the best actor on television, and this show, as many people on these forums have said, has become a battle for his soul. He's the centerpiece right now and we're all rooting for him.

[Chillingworth]

Thanks for voting folks, I was kinda bummed there for a minute but there ended up actually being more than I expected. Groovy. There's a tie in the Tuco / Skyler match-up, so I'll have to retract my vote. Making the results:

1. Walter White (6 votes) defeated Marie Schrader (0 votes)
2. Saul Goodman (5 votes) defeated Gale Boetticher (1 vote)
3. Skyler White (3 votes) defeated Tuco Salamanca (2 votes)
4. Jesse Pinkman (6 votes) defeated Jane Margolis (0 votes)

No surprises there, although Skyler was damn near upset already. So long, Tuco, you are missed you crazy nut. If those match-ups seemed kinda silly, then these next ones are plain goofy. They'll stay up until Monday night around 8pm, at which time we'll move on to the quarters and that's when the good stuff starts. Some of those are gonna be tough already. According to Betsy Brandt's twitter, episode 5 Sunday night is gonna blow all our minds so we might have entirely different opinions of people by that point, who knows. Anyway, next:

5.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/MikeVsHector.jpg
Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Hector Salamanca

6.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/SkinnyPeteVsGus.jpg
Skinny Pete vs. Gustavo Fring

7.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/BadgerVsCousins.jpg
Badger Mayhew vs. The Cousins

8.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/HankVsJunior.jpg
Hank Schrader vs. Walter White Jr.

[Chillingworth]

5. Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Hector Salamanca
6. Skinny Pete vs. Gustavo Fring
7. Badger Mayhew vs. The Cousins
8. Hank Schrader vs. Walter White Jr.

[ilovemovies]

Mike
Gus
The Cousins, I guess
Hank

[Zeus9]

Mike
Skinny
Cousins
Hank

[Frank the Tank]

Mike
Gus Fring
The Cousins
Hank

[JackassFan]

Mike
Gus Fring
The Cousins
Hank
yep

[Darth Kenshin]

5. Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Hector Salamanca
6. Skinny Pete vs. Gustavo Fring
7. Badger Mayhew vs. The Cousins
8. Hank Schrader vs. Walter White Jr.

Mike over Hector - if you had asked me this before Season 5, though, it would be different. Mike was always cool, but felt out of place (a little too good at what he does... fits in more with Jack Bauer than in this show) and also didn't add much to the story. Now, though, he's gone to another level.

Gus over Skinny Pete - no contest. Gus just brings so much to the table.

Badger over The Cousins - neither add much to the story, but Badger at least makes me laugh.

Hank over Walt Jr. - I feel Walt Jr. has been irrelevant since Season 2. Maybe if he gets into a car accident, he'll be interesting again.

[Chillingworth]

I vote:

5. Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Hector Salamanca - Tio was amusing and there were times when I liked his unrefined hatred and combativeness, but Mike is indeed in a whole other league.
6. Skinny Pete vs. Gustavo Fring - I don't think I have to explain this one.
7. Badger Mayhew vs. The Cousins - Badger is probably my favorite of Jesse's original subdealers, and I always get a little happier when he shows up onscreen. The Cousins were awesome and all, but sometimes they just struck me as a little too spooky-badass. Most of the characters on this show feel like real people, but it was like the Cousins stepped out of some other genre or a video game or something where mute identical killing machines with no real depth might belong more. Don't get me wrong, they brought some cool shit when they were there, and served as a springboard for Hank becoming more interesting, but on their own they didn't work very well imo.
8. Hank Schrader vs. Walter White Jr.
I feel Walt Jr. has been irrelevant since Season 2. I concur. Being Walter's oldest son, his namesake fer cryin out loud, you would think he would be much more important than he has been. But he's almost a peripheral character now. I'm sure a lot of that has to do with Walt's surrogate son who has kinda filled a role that maybe Junior never could, and sorta taken his place. Junior seems like just a good kid, sometimes to a fault, and there are moments when I genuinely like him a lot like when Walter was crying and Junior looked like he was about to lose his shit too just out of sympathy, telling Walt "it's okay" over and over. That was an honestly moving exchange, and for a minute when Walt called him Jesse I got kinda mad at Walt. Then when he wakes up the next morning and his glasses are fixed I literally went "awww" and thought man I wish every teen-ager was as goodhearted as Walter Jr. But moments like that are few, and Hank is far too important to even consider voting against here. I'll go into why in later rounds, I don't wanna blow my wad on every character just yet.

I wanted to make sure and get my vote in before tonight's ep 'cuz now Aaron Paul's tweeting about how crazy it's gonna be too. I considered worrying about the build-up, and how I might be disappointed, but then I remembered what show this is.

[Darth Kenshin]

I concur. Being Walter's oldest son, his namesake fer cryin out loud, you would think he would be much more important than he has been. But he's almost a peripheral character now.

Yeah. By no means do I dislike him, but as you said, his significant moments are few and far between.

Side note: one thing I appreciate about great television shows is the ability to just push certain characters into the background. The Wire (my favorite drama ever) didn't have a real storyline for McNulty during Season 4, so instead of forcing one to keep him involved (he was the main character for the first 3 seasons) they just pushed him to the side and didn't miss a beat. It's a testament to how great the show is and how deep the roster is.

Same for BB. I feel the big plot moment for Walt Jr. was Walter earning his respect. Once Walt Jr. dropped the "Flynn" thing and started to appreciate his father and actually show that he loves him, I thought he became less relevant. So why force him into the story? There's enough going on in the show. Walt Jr. isn't needed, and if they gave him a subplot just to give him screen time in the past couple of years (like, say, having a girlfriend) it would just detract from the show. Now, there's a reason for him to have screen time, but the last 2 seasons, he wasn't prominent, and he certainly wasn't missed in my eyes.

A lot of TV shows could learn from this (Lost and Heroes immediately come to mind).

[DrJellyfingers]

Mike
Gus Fring
Badger
Hank

[Gordon]

Mike
Gus Fring
Badger
Hank

This.

[Chillingworth]

We have our second tie in the Badger / Cousins match-up, so once again I'll retract my vote. Results:

5. Mike Ehrmantraut (8 votes) defeated Hector Salamanca (0 votes)
6. Gustavo Fring (7 votes) defeated Skinny Pete (1 vote)
7. The Cousins (4 votes) defeated Badger Mayhew (3 votes)
8. Hank Schrader (8 votes) defeated Walter White Jr. (0 votes)

So on to the quarters.

QUARTERFINALS

1.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/1-MikeVsSaul.jpg
Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Saul Goodman

2.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/2-JesseVsSkyler.jpg
Jesse Pinkman vs. Skyler White

3.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/3-WalterVsCousins.jpg
Walter White vs. The Cousins

4.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/4-GusVsHank.jpg
Gustavo Fring vs. Hank Schrader

[Chillingworth]

1. Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Saul Goodman
2. Jesse Pinkman vs. Skyler White
3. Walter White vs. The Cousins
4. Gustavo Fring vs. Hank Schrader

[Zeus9]

Saul
Jesse
Walter
Hank

[JackassFan]

Mike
Jesse
Walter
Hank

[Film Fan BeAm2k]

Saul
Jesse
Walter
Hank

This

[Darth Kenshin]

Mike
Jesse
Walter
Hank

Yeah. This.

Hank/Gus is a real tough one. Gus added so much tension to the show, not to mention I felt he was the best actor out of the entire supporting cast. But he just wasn't around long enough. Hank's body of work and his development (so many ups and downs) make him the pick for me.

[ilovemovies]

Mike (VERY tough!)
Jesse (also pretty tough!)
Walt (the only easy match in this round)
Hank (toughest one yet! although Saul vs Mike was extremely tough)

[The Postmaster General]

Saul
Jesse
Walt
Hank

[Chillingworth]

I am so torn on match-up number one that I'm dreading casting a vote. It's easily the toughest so far for me. Most of these I can look at and just know who I'm gonna vote for (including Gus / Hank, which I'll get into in a minute), but Mike / Saul is one that I'm still, even as I write this, vacillating on. To be more thorough and hopefully make my votes more quantifiable, I'm gonna break each character down into some categories. In order to solidify these categories before I get to the match-up I'm having such trouble with, I'm gonna vote backwards from the order I posted them in. So I vote:

4. Gustavo Fring vs. Hank Schrader
Likability: You know, I'm not even sure what "likability" means in this context. Is it who I'd like to hang out with more? If so then Hank wins by a landslide. Is it who commands more respect and is more intriguing? Gus takes that. So I guess I'll define likability as who I like watching more on the screen, who I'm glad to see walk into a scene. That's to Hank. Gus was an outstanding character who I enjoyed the shit out of, but never once rooted for. Hank I did, do, and probably will root for right until the end, even though good things for him equal bad things for Walter.
Morality: This is kind of a weird category to include, but it's the one that most wins this for Hank imo. Great as Gus was, and as interesting as he was, Hank is the only real good guy in the main cast. When considering the characters on this show that is the thing that defines him, that makes him separate from the rest. Hank is the guy I would trust to watch my kids, if I had kids, and that is so much an integral part of him that it becomes its own category.
Acting: Gus takes this, but I think that's less about acting ability than it is about the characters themselves. Dean Norris does just as good a job as Esposito did, but doesn't have as much room to shine as an actor because of the confines of Hank's personality. Hank is a very straight-forward person without much subtlety to him, even when he's shouting about minerals and there's clearly some psychological shit going on.
Impact on the series: Hank. He introduced the idea of cooking meth to Walter, he's been at odds with just about every other character at some point or another, and he's come close to ending everything a couple times. The scene where Hank traps Jesse and Walt in the RV remains one of the most tense and nerve-racking in the series for me. I know Gus came close to ending everything too, by almost ending Walter, but that was more of an immediate threat specific to season four (and three's finale). Hank is a danger that's been looming since the pilot. If this show were a person, Gus was a gun pointed at its head, while Hank is a cancer that isn't immediately life-threatening but you know will become so any minute now.

3. Walter White vs. The Cousins
Walter by a landslide on all fronts.

2. Jesse Pinkman vs. Skyler White
Likability: Dur. I've already expressed my hatred for Skyler so I won't rehash it.
Morality: Jesse takes this category, which is odd since he's the one who deals drugs and has killed people. But I get the sense that any morality Skyler has is more self-serving in nature, while Jesse is the exact opposite. I can easily see Jesse laying down his life for someone else, like willingly trading his life for another's, and the only way Skyler would do that is for her kids. When the chips are down I think Jesse would jump in front of a bullet for a complete stranger out of instinct alone, while Skyler would probably yank someone in front of her.
Acting: Jesse, easily. I know Anna Gunn has done a wonderful job, especially in some stand-out scenes, and her role has been more or less a thankless one on this show. But Aaron Paul has been nearly mind-blowing at times with his acting ability.
Impact on the series: Jesse again for the clean sweep. If in some alternate universe Skyler had divorced Walter days before his 50th birthday, I can still imagine him going into the meth business. Without Jesse, though, it would have ended with no more than a passing curiosity for Walter and an eventless DEA ride-along.

Now for the tough one.
1. Mike Ehrmantraut vs. Saul Goodman
Likability: Fuck. By my own definition, I think I enjoy watching Saul more, but why? Because of his wit and his energy, and those are just superficial things. In the immediate moment, Saul is just fun to watch. Mike, on the other hand, has become absolutely instrumental so watching him is just as interesting only in a whole other way. Mike is a smoldering character, not one who immediately jumps off the screen at you but who's almost an acquired taste, who becomes easier to appreciate with time. Ultimately I'm just gonna ask myself this: what would I do if the writers called me up right now and said "one of these two characters has to die next episode, which one will it be?" As much as I hate to say it, and I mean really HATE to say it, I would answer Saul. So Mike wins this category in a way. But Saul wins it in another way. Fuck it, I'm gonna call this one a draw.
Morality: Mike. Again, an ironic answer, but it depends on your definition of morality I suppose. What I consider morality is Mike standing up for his guys in prison, giving them his word and absolutely meaning it. I think there's no length Mike wouldn't go to to keep his word once given. Saul is the opposite, in that even though he's not a killer (that we know of) I still wouldn't trust his word one iota. Also, if Saul felt his life or freedom were endangered by certain parties he probably wouldn't hesitate to have them killed, and even though he wouldn't pull the trigger himself that's still murder in a way.
Acting: Saul is easily one of my favorite characters, but there are other actors that could have played the role sufficiently. Mike, it seems to me, became more important as the series progressed because of Jonathan Banks. I have no way of knowing this, but I really believe if anyone else had played him he would never have become so large a figure. It isn't attention-grabbing like Odenkirk's, but Banks' unique and subtle acting ability has made that character. However comma, Odenkirk lights up any scene he's in and while others could've played him, I don't think they could've played him as well. Still, Mike takes this one very very narrowly.
Impact on the series: Fuuuck. Looking at things systemically, Saul should win this in a step-by-step examination. They never would've met Gus, they would've never had a in-road to the seamier side of things, they would've never had a guy who knows a guy, et cetera. Hell, the very first words we hear out of Mike's mouth are "Saul Goodman sent me," so it seems almost obvious that Saul should win this. But somehow, he still doesn't. Saul is almost like a plot device at times, a way for the writers to get certain things done when they need done, but outside of that his impact has actually been minimal. Mike's relationship with Jesse in season four drastically changed everything, and he's since become a part of the show's fiber in a way Saul never was. He's important because of his character, not just his ability to make phone calls and introduce people, and it seems that he'll likely be a crucial part of the show's conclusion. It's Walter, Jesse, and Mike who are the show's main ingredients now, in that order. Saul is probably sixth or seventh on that list. So again, Mike wins.

Goddamn, that was exhausting. I came into this leaning toward Saul, and I'm doing this begrudgingly and almost against my will, but I vote Mike.

[ilovemovies]

I think it's a pretty good bet that the final match will be between Walt and Jesse.

[MistAh BlistAh]

Saul
Jesse
Walter
Hank

^This

[Darth Kenshin]

I think it's a pretty good bet that the final match will be between Walt and Jesse.

Probably, perhaps foreshadowing the end of the actual show.

But it's still fun (at least for me) to see how you guys view the other characters. For example, I thought I was the only person who would vote Hank over Gus when I first saw the match-ups. I'm surprised to see how much support my boy Hank is getting.

Grantland.com did an NCAA tournament style bracket with characters from The Wire. Everyone knew Omar was going to win (even President Obama, on a podcast with Grantland.com, said Omar would be the favorite), but it was still fun to see how much love/respect guys like Bodie or Bubbles got.



4. Gustavo Fring vs. Hank Schrader

Impact on the series: Hank. He introduced the idea of cooking meth to Walter, he's been at odds with just about every other character at some point or another, and he's come close to ending everything a couple times. The scene where Hank traps Jesse and Walt in the RV remains one of the most tense and nerve-racking in the series for me. I know Gus came close to ending everything too, by almost ending Walter, but that was more of an immediate threat specific to season four (and three's finale). Hank is a danger that's been looming since the pilot. If this show were a person, Gus was a gun pointed at its head, while Hank is a cancer that isn't immediately life-threatening but you know will become so any minute now.


This was by far the hardest one for me, mainly because the character's impact on the series is the most important aspect in my mind. You could make a strong case that no one has had a more significant impact on this series than Gus. Not even the main characters. His mythos created this entire world and made everything possible. His significance is felt even after he died (seen by the guys struggling to build an empire anywhere near his).

Ultimately, I went with Hank because of how much the character has developed. He's had a lot of ups and downs: marital issues, obviously the accident, the mental anguish after shooting Tuco, what happened in Arizona, etc. Hank has been through so much as a character. Gus was this larger-than-life figure whose shadow was over everything and he added so much tension to the show, but the character didn't really go anywhere. No emotional connection.

That's where the show, in my mind, really dropped the ball. Evil characters, no matter how larger-than-life they may be, can still allow us to get emotionally involved. Not to bring everything back to The Wire, but Stringer Bell and Avon Barksdale are perfect examples of this... their Shakespearean brotherly battle was just a thing of beauty and one of the best developed conflicts in the history of fiction (yeah, it's a bold statement, but I stand by it). I would've liked more from Gus' character.

[Chillingworth]

This was by far the hardest one for me, mainly because the character's impact on the series is the most important aspect in my mind. You could make a strong case that no one has had a more significant impact on this series than Gus. Not even the main characters. His mythos created this entire world and made everything possible. His significance is felt even after he died (seen by the guys struggling to build an empire anywhere near his).
You make some very good points about Gus. It seems like the show became a whole other thing in the third season from what it had been before, and that was thanks to him. It was also due in part to Jesse's shift, but it was mostly Gus. Before that they were just two dudes cooking meth in an RV, and then all of a sudden there was this huge sprawling empire they were a part of. Hnn. Perhaps I underestimated Gus in the "importance to the series" category, and maybe overestimated Hank a little too. Still, my vote wouldn't have changed.

I'm shocked that Gus didn't get one vote, absolutely shocked. I never would have called that. What's also surprising is Saul beating Mike. Well, technically it's a tie but I'm gonna have to withdraw my vote, so Saul wins. I read a lot of reviews / blogs about this show and the comments in said blogs and et cetera, all told probably hundreds of opinions every week, and the prevailing one seems to be that Mike is universally loved almost on the level of Walter and Jesse now. That's why I seeded him at number three, while Saul was seeded sixth (behind Hank and Gus). Anyway, the results:

1. Saul Goodman (4 votes) defeated Mike Ehrmantraut (3 votes)
2. Jesse Pinkman (8 votes) defeated Skyler White (0 votes)
3. Walter White (8 votes) defeated The Cousins (0 votes)
4. Hank Schrader (8 votes) defeated Gustavo Fring (0 votes)

I thought if either of the bookend bouts would be a blowout, it'd be Mike shutting out Saul. Lulz. I suck at predictions, I guess. So, moving on to the semi's.

SEMIFINALS

1.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/JesseVsSaul.jpg
Jesse Pinkman vs. Saul Goodman

2.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/WalterVsHank.jpg
Walter White vs. Hank Schrader

[Chillingworth]

1. Jesse Pinkman vs. Saul Goodman
2. Walter White vs. Hank Schrader

[MistAh BlistAh]

Jesse Pinkman
Walter White

[ilovemovies]

Jesse
Hank

Yep, I actually like Hank more than Walt, though I wish he get in on the action finally. I know it's probably a slow build up. But he's got to finally get on Heisenberg's ass!

[Darth Kenshin]

What's also surprising is Saul beating Mike. Well, technically it's a tie but I'm gonna have to withdraw my vote, so Saul wins. I read a lot of reviews / blogs about this show and the comments in said blogs and et cetera, all told probably hundreds of opinions every week, and the prevailing one seems to be that Mike is universally loved almost on the level of Walter and Jesse now.


Hard to say anything bad about Mike, and I think if you re-did this after this season (where Mike is so much more involved than in the past) the results might change.

Anyway, my votes:

Jesse over Saul. Easy for me. I think I voted against Saul in each round.

Hank over Walter. Not easy at all. Both are interesting, we're emotionally invested in both, and both are very important to the story (I think the resolution will come down to Hank vs. Walter). However, I think Hank's humor is just so necessary and appreciated in this show and, at least for me, always hits the mark (unlike Saul, who gets on my nerves). But man, it's a brutal call.

[fixedMind]

Jesse
Walter
obviously

[Zeus9]

Jesse
Walter

[JackassFan]

Jesse
Walter

[Film Fan BeAm2k]

Jesse
Walter

[Chillingworth]

I vote Walter and Jesse. As much as I like Hank, and as far as he's progressed, he's still mostly a one-dimensional character. He started out as kind of a caricature, an almost goofily alpha alpha male, and I didn't like him as much. But Hank has gotten cooler with time. That scene the other week where the boss-man informed him of his promotion, when said boss-man asked "where are we on the Fring case?" Hank replies "just working through the grief." I loved that. He still has the same sense of humor but the way that scene played, his focus and his gravity have increased incredibly. Compare that scene to the one where he talks to his people about Combo back in season two, and he's almost a different person. Much easier to take seriously not just as a character, but as a threat to Walter (and Mike and Jesse by extension). All that being said, it's also easy now to consider Walter a threat to him, and that was just a ridiculous notion until recently. Walter has become more alpha than Hank in a lot of ways, if not in the puffy-chest fist-fight way. Hank is the good guy, but that makes him constrained as a character which is not quite as interesting and awesome as an unrestrained Walter. So the results:

1. Jesse Pinkman (8 votes) defeated Saul Goodman (0 votes)
2. Walter White (6 votes) defeated Hank Schrader (2 votes)

So, to the surprise of absolutely no one, that leaves Walt and Jesse for our final. This one is easily the toughest possible match-up, and for the first time I honestly have no clue how you guys are gonna vote, or how I will. I need to do some thinking. This will end Thursday night, around this time.

THE MAIN EVENT


http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/WalterVsJesse.jpg


Walter White vs. Jesse Pinkman

[Darth Kenshin]

We should also have a bronze medal match between Saul and Hank

[MistAh BlistAh]

Jesse Pinkman yo!

[Zeus9]

Walter White Sr.

[ilovemovies]

Jesse

[Film Fan BeAm2k]

Walter White

[JackassFan]

Jesse

[Darth Kenshin]

Walter is more interesting, but I like Jesse more. So... Jesse

[Gordon]

Jesse, bitch.

[Chillingworth]

We should also have a bronze medal match between Saul and Hank

When we started this thing I seriously considered making it double elimination, which would have resulted in cool-ass matches like Hank vs Mike and Marie vs Skyler. But I figured folks would probably lose interest if it went on too long, so elected not to. Now I kinda wish I would've, 'cuz it would be interesting to be able to rank them according to you guys' opinion. I've seen other tourney-type things here where people add points and subtract them and stuff, but I don't really get how they work. Maybe if someone were to do something like that for this show it'd be killer, and plus give me a chance to finally understand how those go when the rules are explained. I would certainly participate. But unfortunately this is the only thing of its type that I know how to do, is with the seeding and brackets and all.

So, I vote for Walter. I know I said I was gonna vote for whoever I liked more, but I didn't at that time realize what a tricky concept that is. It's really easy to forget watching the show now how these characters started out, and judge them pretty much as they are. But on the other hand, it's easy to mistake what's new and what isn't. I read a review recently that referred to Jesse's "newfound morality and regard for life," or something to that effect, and thought man this reviewer doesn't know Jesse very well. That regard for life has always been there, it was just hidden under the bluster and preening of what was basically a petulant child for the first two seasons. Jesse hated the idea of killing Krazy 8, and I think if the coin-flip hadn't worked in his favor he would've found some other way out of it. Or a better example is from season 2, when Spooge and his skank have knocked Jesse out and he is in genuine mortal danger with these two wack-jobs. Lying there pretending to be unconscious was his only safety measure. But when Skank starts to tip the ATM over, Jesse immediately yells "no!" and starts to his feet with absolutely no thought of what's going to happen to him as a result. Under his "bitch"s and "yo"s Jesse has always been a mostly good kid, although very misguided. It's a lot easier to see these traits in New Jesse, who's much more composed and mature in his bearing, but they've always been there.

Walter is almost the opposite. Walter is a guy who spent fifty years abiding by the rules and giving lip service to things like morality and civic responsibility, but I don't think they ever really meant all that much to him. It seems to me that Walter was always selfish, which gave way to bitterness and anger and frustration at what he considers not just wasted potential but a wasted life. Not to get all biographic, but that is a character type I can understand. So when Walter White finally gets what he feels is coming to him, even though it means misery and possible death for those around him, I am on his side. The first few episodes of season five kinda pushed me to the limit in that regard, when Walter became beyond arrogant and more sorta smug. I fucking hate smug people. But beginning with his birthday speech when Skyler went all pool-party, he's since become rehumanized a little bit. Obviously he still isn't brimming with humility or anything, but he seems less full of himself now and more just confident. I dig that. There is a part of me that wants to see Walter White win, no matter the cost, even if that means betraying and hurting every single person around him including Jesse.

The ideal ending for me would be to see Jesse go off and live happily ever after doing something he likes, and Walter becoming what Gus used to be only a little less stoic about it. But then again, probably the only reason I say that is 'cuz I know it isn't gonna happen. An ending like that would be satisfying in one way, but disappointing in another because I, like everyone else, am just waiting for everything to blow up in his face. However comma, this isn't out of any disdain for the character or his outlook, it isn't out of any desire for karmic justice or anything like that, it's just 'cuz I know it's gonna equal some damn good TV'ing. My "ideal" ending might actually feel mediocre if it played out that way. I expect the ending to be just that: an ending, not necessarily to Walter's life (although that's likely) but to Heisenberg's, one way or another.

Anyway, I've rambled. What I meant to say was that Jesse is a guy who I would like to hang out with. Walter is a guy I would like to be. Sure he's become amoral, but that must be an incredibly freeing perspective. Sure he's got a high opinion of himself right now, but isn't that a little justified? Walter at his best (or worst, depending on your point of view) isn't just someone I like, he's someone I admire. He's like my avatar, a way to vicariously live the life of substance I wish I had (bad substance though it is). I read a review once that summed it up brilliantly, and damn I wish these were my words but they aren't: "We are all, in the private kingdom of our desires, Walter White: obedient creatures quietly, desperately, awaiting the chance to unchain our vicious animal selves." --Steve Almond. They're not my words, but it's an idea I understood long before I read them, an explanation of Walter's appeal that I could never quite enunciate myself. That is why I vote for Walter.

Now, all that being TLDR'd, Walter loses. Lulz. I'm mildly surprised at the result but not too much so. It was a foregone conclusion for all of us that it would come down to these two, and though I figured Walter would probably win I knew Jesse was a live second seed. I'm gonna post the results and official-type stuff in the next post to officially end this official-like, 'cuz it feels like I should do it that way. There is no logic attached to this, but whatevs. I'll throw in the brackets too, which I've been filling in as we went, so you guys can see how I seeded it. This has been fun and all and I hope you guys dug it.

[Chillingworth]

The results:

Jesse Pinkman (5 votes) defeated Walter White (3 votes)

THE WINNER

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/JesseWin.jpg

JESSE PINKMAN, BITCH

And here are the brackets:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/EnderDeschain/BBTourney/BracketsFinal.jpg