Biggest Sellouts

[CeMeTaRy_GaTeS]

Mine are:
MetallicA
Sugar Ray
Blink 182 (in the beginning they were ok and less poppy)

So who are the biggest sellouts in your opinion

[heretic]

errrrrm LIMP BIZKIT any one? also LINKIN PARK and NICKLE BACK

[Batgirl1979]

I don't agree with Nickelback, I have been listening to them for 3 years now and seen them when they played in small venue's. They were very decent down-to-earth guys. Just wondering why you would think they were Sell-outs?
The rest of the suggestions I agree with and would also add Creed to the list.

----------------------------------------------
F.E.A.R~Fuck Everything And Run

[BakeTheMooCow]

Why do you say these bands are sell-outs? I don't like any of the bands mentioned except Metallica, but I don't agree that any of them are sellouts. Just because they got popular, it means they sold out?

Blink-182 --> Their whole career is based on three riffs. They don't know to play anything else and all their songs from past and present albums sound the same. I think they always sucked.

Limp Bizkit --> A decent first album. A bad second album. A horrible third album. They didn't sell-out. Their music just deteriorated fast.

Linkin Park --> I'm quite sure they have released one album and one remix album. So, how can anyone say they sold out so fast? They're just beginning.

Creed, Nickelback, Sugar Ray --> I haven't heard much from these bands but what I have heard wasn't very good so I can't really say anything about them.

Basically, there's no such thing as selling out. Its only in your mind that a certain band has sold out. A band is not in control of popularity on the charts and air-play on MTV. And a lot of good bands are very popular.

"All you know about me is what I've sold you, dumb fuck.
I sold out long before you ever heard my name.
I sold my soul to make a record, dip shit
And you bought one."

~~ Tool - Hooker With A Penis

[stevereno]

Originally posted by CeMeTaRy_GaTeS

Blink 182 (in the beginning they were ok and less poppy)

So who are the biggest sellouts in your opinion

yeah, ever since i saw there song in a comercial for SPY KIDS 2, i knew it was over

SHIVER ME TIMBERS

[bowieee]

Want to hear my blink 182 story No? well too bad... :)


Im from san diego their home town and I use to go to their shows pretty much every other weekend when they were just a tiny little local band. My name in "real life" is Gene and as a joke a couple friends of mine and I made a Genes my hero t shirt for Mark hoppus and dropped it off at his moms house whos address was on his demo tape since he was still living at home at that time. well anyways at the next show he played about 2 weeks later at a skate park with the dancehall crashers he wore the shirt on stage and said thanks to us saying its one of the coolest gifts hes gotten. The funny thing was it was way to small for him so it looked like a chop top. On to the topic at hand. i dont belive bands sell out. just because they get a larger audience doesnt make their music any less viable. Just appreciated by more pople. now when you start playing shows singing with nysnc *cough* Aerosmith *cough*Cough* then that begins to teeter on the borderline of selling out.

[The Postmaster General]

Originally posted by BakeTheMooCow
I don't like any of the bands mentioned except Metallica, but I don't agree that any of them are sellouts. Just because they got popular, it means they sold out?



metallica has been popular since around 1987, but it wasn't until around 1998 that I say they sold out. them and their little stint as spokesperson against Napster.

Metallica says that napster takes money from their pocket, but they seemed to have forgotten that the reason they got signed is because someone passed a BOOTLEG COPY of their demo to a record executive.

THAT fits the definition of a sell-out.

and yes, their is such a thing as a sellout, hence the existence of the word.

[daddiefatsacks]

yeah i dont understand how Linkin Park sold out???

[Scarface98.9]

no matter what the circumstance, a punk band that gets picked up from a studio will always be labled by the undergorund punk society as a sellout just because they need money

[blankpage]

Green Day,Love there music still.But I still think they sold out.

[Linus*likes*noise]

What Green day?? I'll ahve to disagree with you there, And I would love to know why you think they are sellouts.

I'd say they are one of the only long lasting bands that are "keeping it real" and still playing the music they like because it is fun to paly and the fans dig it, not to apease executive assholes.

The last album's tunes (warning) were those that the band's children picked to put on for christ sake! If anythng they are the complete opposite of selling out.

I think you have a little soul doubt with them dude, and again, I would LOVE to hear why you think they are such sellouts.

All that aside(no hard feelings duder, I just like to hear reasons for ones arguments) I would like to say that Creed is one of the only bands that have been selling out since the beginning.

Their music is generic, re-hash left over from the early nineties and they emit a "god lovin'" auro to make all the religous peolpe like them to. No offence to religous peole but I htink their are better bands to look up to than creed.

Other than that, The lead singer is such a tool, he actually believes he is an important "rock star". With his leather pants and long hair, so freshly washed and combed. It makes me sick to know that this band is selling millions of records while so many great bands have to fight it out in the underground to make a living.

I saw them on SNL a while ago and the lead singer was singing this very bad tune while putting his finger in a gun motion to his head. Are we really supposed to believe this guy is a bleeding artist with big issues??? Come on!!! It is obviously a way to get kids to think "Hey he is disturbed like Kurt or something, he is cool". It is all a fake fuckin' joke and I hope it ends soon, because it is realy annoying to hear these no-talent assholes on the radio.

I urge you all to burn your Creen Cd's and go buy some Weezer or Queens of the Stone Age or something. Please, thjere is real rock out there, and Creed certainly isn't it.

And on a side note, I hope Kid rock jumps off a cliff as well. Another sell out to the bone.

Damn!!

[The Postmaster General]

Originally posted by Linus*likes*noise
And on a side note, I hope Kid rock jumps off a cliff as well. Another sell out to the bone.

Damn!!


yeah - i don't dig the kid, but i give him kudos for his role in joe dirt. that was funny.

[blankpage]

Well I still think the kick arse and still are keepin' it real.But they were doing an interview on VH1 a while back and they said that they sold out.Yeah just going by what I heard.

[The Postmaster General]

i hope this helps...

there is a difference between being a sell-out and getting popular.



when one sells out, the give up what they believe in, what they stand for -- the become hypocritical, and "untrue" to themselves.

Green Day didn't sell out. I'm sure they said that as a joke, or as a "yeah whatever you say" statement. What ideals did Green Day give up with their popularity? None that I can see.


now, Michael Jackson is a jehovah's witness. Yet he wears clothes resembling army wear (war goes against practive of jehovah's witnesses), he engages in violence in many of his videos, and he glamorizes crime (smooth criminal) -- these are all things that Michael Jackson did not stand for until he got paid for it. Michael Jackson was friends with Paul McCartney, and bought Beatles songs and, despite Paul's requests, Jackson sold the songs to be used in commercials. He sold out.


a good example of selling out is The Rolling Stones. For years, they refused to allow their music to be used for commercialism. but when Microsoft made them an offer to use "Start Me Up" for their Windows 95 campaign, The Stones said "no". Then when Micorsoft made a bigger offer (biggest in history), the Stones "sold out".

[CeMeTaRy_GaTeS]

Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
i hope this helps...

when one sells out, the give up what they believe in, what they stand for -- the become hypocritical, and "untrue" to themselves.


Yeah, that is why I think MetallicA solod out. and if you disagree listen to MASTER OF PUUPETS and then listen to LOAD, you'll notice a big difference.

[The Postmaster General]

Originally posted by CeMeTaRy_GaTeS
Yeah, that is why I think MetallicA solod out. and if you disagree listen to MASTER OF PUUPETS and then listen to LOAD, you'll notice a big difference.


i totally agree with you. check my post from 09-26-2002 08:53 PM --

those dudes wouldn't be where they are if it wasn't for bootleg copies of their recordings being passed around. Ulrich even stated this in an 87 article (sorry can't provide more info)

then the fuckers turn around and fight bootlegging.

i remember people saying they sold out when they released a video on MTV (87?), but nah -- i stood by them saying, "It's a cool video"

Then i stood up for them again when the black album was #1 - i said, "people just like the album. that's good for the band."

but the entire napster thing, and worst most -- them changing their style to look more like other bands --- that was nuts, and it wasn't a choice they made -- just overnight -- the new metallica.

SELL OUTS!


i will say it -- they are the biggest sell outs I can think of.

i give em 10 years before they are doing shows in vegas

[Benny]

Creed ("My Own Prison" had some decent songs on it, now all of their songs are dull and sound the same)

Metallica (Their whole Napster fuss made me really despise them, plus I knew they'd sold out back in '96 when they cut their hair short)

Aerosmith (I still love their music, but Steve, stop trying to pretend you're still your daughter's age!)

Green Day ("Dookie" is an incredible album but now their songs are just too bland for my taste)

Blink 182 (They had a video that made fun of boy bands, while at the same time, they were turning into one)

Sugar Ray (They too made some pretty good songs in their early years but now all the little 8-year old girls love them and their songs sound the same)

Smash Mouth (Walkin' On the Sun is pretty cool, but after I heard that "All Star" song for the zillionth time, I felt like shooting someone)

[Mikey2Dope]

About 2 months ago I did a rant on another message board on my thoughts on Sellouts which is long and I'm too lazy to re-type it so this is what I wrote:

After reading a lot of message boards and talking to teenagers I know at work I've come to a conclusion: a lot of people are idiots. I'm so sick of hearing/reading "_____ punk band sold out cause they now have their videos and music on the radio" all the while the band is playing the same music that these "fans" used to enjoy cause they weren't popular(which makes you an ignorant jackass IMO). I guess people might have their own view of a what a sellout is but here is mine: "A sellout is someone that signs a big record contract and then totally changes their music style to what that record producer wants to hear or changes their music style 100% so they can attract a new fanbase." It just pisses me off when I hear people say bands sold out because they,1)play videos on MuchMusic and MTV 2)they play their songs on the radio 3)they just signed a big record contract. I asked a bunch of skaterboarders the other day at work why they thought Sum 41 were sellouts and their answer: "Dude did you see them on MuchMusic?!?" "Yeah so? "Man they're on MuchMusic!" That was basically the jist of their argument. I'm not saying everybody is like that but they're a lot of people like them out there. People who do not judge them for musical content but their status in pop culture. These guys did not quit their day jobs to become broke. I know of not one musician who doesn't want to be big. It's why it's the career path they took. It's like the people who called Metallica sellouts because they cut their hair that makes cringe(which is about the truly saddest thing I've ever heard). I mean if you're listening to music cause of how the band looks then yeah good for you but most people don't(well that might explain Britney Spears). My point is if you're calling a band a sellout cause they're on tv/radio and not because of the musical content you need to give your head a shake. It don't bother me if my favorite band shows up on Friends or even an awards show just as long as they're playing the same music I like to listen to.

The band I do think is a sellout the most is Sugar Ray. If you listen to what they used to put out and listen to them now it's sickening.

[Jewbo]

a great man once said "u sell out the second u release a record" that man was richey edwards. doubt if 90% of u will have heard of him but he was in the manics till he went missin. anyway point is thats sum wise words.

[Jason Voorhees]

Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
i hope this helps...

there is a difference between being a sell-out and getting popular.



when one sells out, the give up what they believe in, what they stand for -- the become hypocritical, and "untrue" to themselves.



Thank you, I hate this type of discussion; It usually end up becoming ridiculous as the line between popular and sellout is blurred.

Linkin Park are not sell outs; they have one album. They are a pop-rock band, they are popular, they are not sellouts.

Metallica, are indeed sellouts; As mentioned earlier juxtaposition Master of Puppets with Load, Big difference eh? They changed their thrash metal sound to appeal to a more mainstream commercial audience; That's selling out.

If Cannibal Corpse released an album tomorrow that went to number one-yet was just as virulent and destructive as their previous efforts-Would you consider them sellouts? Or just somehow miraculously popular?

I just hate it when a band gets popular without compromising their sound and are still unjustly labeled sellouts.

[Another Cliche Schmoe]

Green Day,Love there music still.But I still think they sold out.

You are now on my "people to kill" list. :p just kiddin. but green day did NOT sell out.

[PapaJupe2k]

Hmmm, I'm not going to get into a sellout/popular discussion with you all, because there is nothing I could say that hasn't already been said. I just have a little "feel good" story for all the schmoes in dispair out there over their favorite band "selling out". I'm probably the only KISS fan on this board, so I doubt anyone will dispute this with me.:D Once upon a time, around 1980, my favorite band KISS began to self destruct. Two of the original members had plans for a solo career (yeah right Peter Criss), and left to persue their own dreams and aspirations. The next few years and albums were a tough time for them, as they went through three guitar players, and the band just generally lost focus. Gene Simmons was more interested in a movie career than music and they really suffered, putting out such poppy albums as Animalize, Crazy Nights, and Hot in the Shade. A tradgedy in 1989 was like a wakeup call to group, as drummer Eric Carr died of cancer. They could either pack it in or get back to their roots, and they did the latter. Revenge in 1992 was a dream come true for KISS fans as they recaptured 1970's magic and it led to the sucessful reunion tour and Psycho Circus album. So don't dispair schmoes, even though it may look bleak for your favorite bands at the moment, anything is possible.:)

[Cesare]

Originally posted by BakeTheMooCow
Why do you say these bands are sell-outs? I don't like any of the bands mentioned except Metallica, but I don't agree that any of them are sellouts. Just because they got popular, it means they sold out?

Blink-182 --> Their whole career is based on three riffs. They don't know to play anything else and all their songs from past and present albums sound the same. I think they always sucked.

Limp Bizkit --> A decent first album. A bad second album. A horrible third album. They didn't sell-out. Their music just deteriorated fast.

Linkin Park --> I'm quite sure they have released one album and one remix album. So, how can anyone say they sold out so fast? They're just beginning.

Creed, Nickelback, Sugar Ray --> I haven't heard much from these bands but what I have heard wasn't very good so I can't really say anything about them.

Basically, there's no such thing as selling out. Its only in your mind that a certain band has sold out. A band is not in control of popularity on the charts and air-play on MTV. And a lot of good bands are very popular.

"All you know about me is what I've sold you, dumb fuck.
I sold out long before you ever heard my name.
I sold my soul to make a record, dip shit
And you bought one."

~~ Tool - Hooker With A Penis


I couldn't agree more. There is nothing wrong with making money, especially if you have already paid your dues. :D

[The Postmaster General]

Originally posted by Jason Voorhees
Linkin Park are not sell outs; they have one album. They are a pop-rock band, they are popular, they are not sellouts.

LMAO!!!

I had no idea they only had one album out. that does make the idea that they sold out sort of funny - like people are claiming that they were big fans before an album ever came out, and that their only album was... whatever.


cool story, papa2k!


another thing is that there is a difference between selling out and making some bad albums.


like I said, the line stands where the band turns its back and forgets where it came from.

[DynamiteDan]

The minute a band signs to a record company, it is a sell out..
A band must face a dilemma at some point.
Do we sign to a record company, make promo videos, give interviews etc, in order to sell records, and make some cash OR
Do we keep playing to the same 100 people in the local club who will (eventually) get sick of us anyway?

Lets face it, you probably wouldnt have heard of ________ without them 'selling out'

[The Postmaster General]

while i am amused at the notion that every signed band is a sell-out in the simplest terms, i find the notion to be way to simplified to be true.

consider this -- why do people get into music? a) they like making music, and b) they want to get heard

so how is getting a record deal selling out? the band is doing what it wanted to do. does any musician really play music so that no one can hear it? no.

u can't say every single signed band out there is a sell-out. if someone cuts their hair, or takes on a different style at the will of the company, then sure....


sell-out is a highly overused word.


do people who go to college to be doctors "sell-out" when they get hired to a hospital. No. They are fullfilling their dream.

Does a doctor "sell-out" when he pushes aside his personal ethics to make extra cash - yes.

(and yes, non-musicians are capable of selling out -- my ex-boss is the biggest sell out I've ever known. Bigger than Metallica!)

So...

if EVERY signed band is a sell-out, then there is no need for the word sell-out, since it is a relative term. But the word does exist, so there are bands that are sell-outs, and bands that are not.

anyway - I think Metallica has gotten the most votes so far.



PS - it irks me to hear people accuse bands like Aerosmith of being sell-outs because they "cleaned up" and got off drugs. That's a sick thought. (although I oft feel that the drugged Aerosmith had more great songs, but I applaud personal POSITIVE decisions made by artists.)

[DynamiteDan]

I didn't mean my sell-out theory to be negative , rather to explain to some people that EVERY group has to do something that they and their audience will consider a sell-out at some point, when they have signed a record contract...

Re: Aerosmith - I don't think most people are on about the fact that they have kicked the drugs. Personally I think their post 1990 music sounds like a Pepsi commercial - especially 'I dont wanna miss a thing'. There again, they are using songwriters such as Desmond Child and Diane Warren!

[Jason Voorhees]

Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
sell-out is a highly overused word.

Well said. These bands would be crazy to admit that they don't want to reach as many people as possible with their music. Why would they even make it if you don't want people to hear it? So I don't blame these acts for trying to get on the radio, in magazines, etc. It's just when their sound is altered to sell more records...

Oh and about Linkin Park: They have the one album, and a remix of that, Which I don't think counts as a second cd. Also, If I hear someone yelling ''sellout'' over a remix cd, then I feel sorry for them...

[Grebdron]

Gotta disagree with you on Metallica, Bubba. I don't think they necessarily sold out. Is it possible that they just grew up? I think they are progressing as artists. I tend to prefer their older music myself, but still enjoy alot of their new stuff. My favorite band ever, Rush, have also changed their musical style and looks over the years, and I've never heard anybody call them sellouts. I think it is possible that when you've been making music for over 20 years, your own tastes will change. That goes for songwriting, too. The things that matter to you when you're 40 are very different than the things that matter to you when you're 20.

[The Postmaster General]

i think metallica are sell-outs because in the late-80s they did an interview in a magazine (rip! or something) saying that they were having trouble getting heard, and then cut a demo. the demo wasn't getting out much until a BOOTLEG copy made it's way to an exec. Then they went on to something of the effect that they owed their popularity to the people who ran copies of their demo.

Then, what? 20 years later they are the spokesband against the war on Napster. What did Lars say? "It's stealing?"

love for money is at the root of all sell-outs.




I hear what you're saying Dan. You're right about Aerosmith's comping out over the years, but I was actually directly refering to those who complain about bands cleaning up.

[Jason Voorhees]

Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
love for money is at the root of all sell-outs.

Indeed, not to mention it's the root of all evil as well, or so goes the old saying...

[Tarman]

Metallica didnt sell out they just got old.But then again Slayer has been around just as long and there still tearin it.Limp Biscuit are the biggest sell outs.I saw them when nobody new here they were when they opened up for Korn and they tore the place up.If Korn isnt careful,they will be following their tracks.

[Tarman]

Did I spell Limp Bizkit wrong in my other statement Oops
Oh well they still SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SeperateSelf]

I understand Bubba's sentiment about Metallica selling out because of the Napster fiasco, but I'll never undertand all this "Metallica sold out because they cut their hair" or "Load is such a fucking sell-out album because they started being more commercial". As Joblo says: Fuck that noise.

I don't care if Load/Reload are more commercial albums than Metallica's old thrash/speed stuff. In my not-so-humble opinion, Load is the best album they've put out. Better than the Black album. Better than Master of Puppets. Better than any of them, and I own them all and have listened to each one countless times. Who gives a fuck if a band puts out a more commercial album? If the songs are even better than their other stuff I don't see the fucking problem.

I know a lot of people think Load/Reload really suck, but I also think some people won't give these albums a chance because they think they're sold-out. Oh well, it's their loss if they will let something so silly keep them from enjoying great music. :rolleyes:

P.S. Hero of the Day is Metallica's best song ever!

[Grebdron]

Originally posted by SeperateSelf
I understand Bubba's sentiment about Metallica selling out because of the Napster fiasco, but I'll never undertand all this "Metallica sold out because they cut their hair" or "Load is such a fucking sell-out album because they started being more commercial". As Joblo says: Fuck that noise.

I don't care if Load/Reload are more commercial albums than Metallica's old thrash/speed stuff. In my not-so-humble opinion, Load is the best album they've put out. Better than the Black album. Better than Master of Puppets. Better than any of them, and I own them all and have listened to each one countless times. Who gives a fuck if a band puts out a more commercial album? If the songs are even better than their other stuff I don't see the fucking problem.

I know a lot of people think Load/Reload really suck, but I also think some people won't give these albums a chance because they think they're sold-out. Oh well, it's their loss if they will let something so silly keep them from enjoying great music. :rolleyes:

P.S. Hero of the Day is Metallica's best song ever!

I'm right with you on this one, SS. load is a kick ass album. I listened to it almost non-stop when it came out. And Hero of the Day rocks. I'm a huge fan of things like Ride the Lightning, Master, Kill 'em All, etc. But Load is probably a better album than all of them. I actually found the black album to be somewhat subpar. IMHO they are the second best band ever. My favorite being Rush.

[SeperateSelf]

Wow, I thought I would be totally alone in this one. Glad to know someone else enjoys Load as much as me.

And what a coincidence, Metallica is also my second favorite band. My favorite being Soundgarden. :p

[El Bracamonti]

when you think of sellouts, tenacious d has to come to mind

[noisy_brut]

Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
i think metallica are sell-outs because in the late-80s they did an interview in a magazine (rip! or something) saying that they were having trouble getting heard, and then cut a demo. the demo wasn't getting out much until a BOOTLEG copy made it's way to an exec. Then they went on to something of the effect that they owed their popularity to the people who ran copies of their demo.

Then, what? 20 years later they are the spokesband against the war on Napster. What did Lars say? "It's stealing?"

love for money is at the root of all sell-outs.




I hear what you're saying Dan. You're right about Aerosmith's comping out over the years, but I was actually directly refering to those who complain about bands cleaning up.


First of all - there is a difference if the band goes and circulates the demo tape themselves, and when someone goes and puts the polished finished product on a service that millions can download in the click of a mouse.

Metaillca is one of the few bands that actually do still encourage tape traders to record and trade their Live shows. They are one of the few bands that set up "Taper Section" seats for fans to bring in Audio and Video equipment to tape their shows.

It is the copywritten material they are concerned about...and it is probably because they are one of the few bands that actually OWN the copyrights to their own music. They spent years suing Elektra so that THEY could have SOLE CONTROL of THEIR music. When they sued Napster, they did nothing different than when they sued Elektra. Also notice that they did NOT go after the people who traded the LIVE shows.

I'll admit I don't particularly like the Load/Re - Load stuff but they are a band that has always gone against the grain and taken chances... and suing Napster and recording with an Orchestra as well as changing their sound when they were already had one of the biggest followings are three HUGE chances for a band like them to make. If they REALLY were "all about the money" they could have just re-done Re-Ride, Re-Master and Kill 'Em All again, have all the fans just eat it up and buy, buy, buy.

One band that I can think of that completely changed their sound but no one mentions (is it because they got heavier?) is Pantera. They used to be glam. Then when glam died and Thrash got bigger (the Cowboys From Hell era) they switched heavier. The pictures from the first two albums with everyone's (especially Phil's) hair teased to the sky are hilarious.

[Jason Voorhees]

Originally posted by noisy_brut
One band that I can think of that completely changed their sound but no one mentions (is it because they got heavier?) is Pantera.

That's exactly why. It's not considered ''selling out'' if your sound becomes heavier, darker, or basically less commercial.

[Grebdron]

Originally posted by noisy_brut
First of all - there is a difference if the band goes and circulates the demo tape themselves, and when someone goes and puts the polished finished product on a service that millions can download in the click of a mouse.

Metaillca is one of the few bands that actually do still encourage tape traders to record and trade their Live shows. They are one of the few bands that set up "Taper Section" seats for fans to bring in Audio and Video equipment to tape their shows.

It is the copywritten material they are concerned about...and it is probably because they are one of the few bands that actually OWN the copyrights to their own music. They spent years suing Elektra so that THEY could have SOLE CONTROL of THEIR music. When they sued Napster, they did nothing different than when they sued Elektra. Also notice that they did NOT go after the people who traded the LIVE shows.

I'll admit I don't particularly like the Load/Re - Load stuff but they are a band that has always gone against the grain and taken chances... and suing Napster and recording with an Orchestra as well as changing their sound when they were already had one of the biggest followings are three HUGE chances for a band like them to make. If they REALLY were "all about the money" they could have just re-done Re-Ride, Re-Master and Kill 'Em All again, have all the fans just eat it up and buy, buy, buy.

One band that I can think of that completely changed their sound but no one mentions (is it because they got heavier?) is Pantera. They used to be glam. Then when glam died and Thrash got bigger (the Cowboys From Hell era) they switched heavier. The pictures from the first two albums with everyone's (especially Phil's) hair teased to the sky are hilarious.

Very well said. I'm in agreement with almost everything. But Load was very good. Glad someone else is sticking up for Metallica. The orchestra album was also very good.

[noisy_brut]

Originally posted by Jason Voorhees
That's exactly why. It's not considered ''selling out'' if your sound becomes heavier, darker, or basically less commercial.

I think it would be considered selling out if you change what you're doing to mimic what is popular at the time, in your particular genre. At the time when glam metal crap like Poison and Motley Crue were on top, that's what Pantera looked and sounded like, then that scene stopped being popular in the late 80's with Guns N Roses and Metallica's ...And Justice For All. This is when they changed their whole sound, look and attitude.

I never disaggreed that Metallica didn't sell out, I think they started going south when Cliff died, and while Justice is a great album, it is not as strong as Master. Black album is where they kind of sold out. And I say kind of there because a lot of other Metal bands stripped down their sound and created shorter songs at the same time.

At the same time they did the one of the best LIVE performances supporting LOAD on MTV Europe. If anyone remembers they were going to perform King Nothing in a ring of fire, and they rehearsed it with a ring of fire on stage. MTV saw this and told them they couldn't have the fire. So to protest, they sent on the stage and performed on LIVE TV Last Caress and So What. That redeemed them a lot in my book.

But I do disagree with the whole "they suck because of Napster" argument.

[loserkid]

I really don't know what the big deal is with selling out
hell, I'd do it too, most people are in the music indutrie to get popular, and to get popular, you really need to seel out, if you sign to a major label or anything, you sold out, you sold out to the puplic right at that moment, selling out isn't really changing your music, or acting different, that can come mostly from just growing up, that's wut really happen to green day, they grew up, they arn't as hard anymore because they arn't 16 years old, they have kids for christ's sake. selling out is really just (let me put this in the simpliest words)letting the rest of the world hear your music, because you aint gonna be heard if you don't sell out. if a band stays true to it's same music, yeah that might be cool, but how do you know that they actually want to play that music. There are bands out there that are p[laying only what the record industry told them to play. Lets use radiohead as an example...the did the music that everyone wanted to hear(to you that would be selling out) but that is what gave them credibility to make what they want to make(kid A and amnesiac) if they never "sold out" at the start, they would of never have had those records come out I think, no-one would know who they are.
ok, I'm done with my rant, I'll just end it with a nice little ending
Selling out is not a bad thing, selling out is just getting your music heard, let a band do what they want, it is their lives that they live, not yours, they can't impress everybody and if they try to impress anybody it should be theirselves, so let off the bands for doing what they want to do and enjoy the music for what it is, music......thank you and good night

[tbone]

I don't see how you can call Nickelback and Creed sellouts Bakethemoocow if you never listen to them. Creed has sold out a bit, but there has been no bigger sellout than Blink 182. Limp Bizkit comes pretty close though.

[The Postmaster General]

There is something to be said for the SEX PISTOLS 1996 reunion tour....

[NuclearMisfit]

I dont really necessary think there are "sell outs", its just music, if you like it listen to it, I have a wide collection of music in my cd collection from Poison to Sinatra to Metallica to Tons of metal albums, its all good to me, I dont really like pop groups or pop music.

[neco82]

Saying that Metallica are sell-outs only because they cut their hair short is one of the stupidest things I have ever heard. Come on, those guys are almost pushing fifty now, do you still expect them to run around in smelly black clothes with hair up to their shoulders drinking all the time and making drunken asses of themselves?

They've matured, that's all. Yes, their music has changed, it's nowhere near as good as their old stuff, but that doesn't mean it's complete crap... I own both Load albums and I find them pretty decent to listen to... Metallica has so much money and such a long career they can do whatever the hell they want... if you don't like the change, then don't listen to them.

One thing though, as people, these guys are giving the worst image possible... the whole overexposed Napster mess made Lars come off as a greedy asshole, Kirk as a fag (not to mentione he dresses like a pimp), and James as a wimp. They really should have concentrated on music instead of burying their reputations like that... so good thing Jason left, he was the best thing in that band and he could have become something worse.