DVD copying right or wrong?

[Cipher Jo]

Here's a controversial subject that might spark some interest. Nowadays you can easily own any DVD you want for just $2 including menus, high quality movie, trailers, bonus material the works!

But what do you think, is this right or wrong. DO you think it's okay just to use as a backup for ones you already own or do you think that it's fine to rent one and copy it. I'm curious what people's stances are on this forum.

[SAI]

My friend just got a dvd recorder which we've been using to transfer some videotapes to dvd. DVD to DVD I don't really approve of, piracy, whatever people try and tell you DOES hurt the industry.

[bigred760]

Wrong.

[Korny]

Wrong.

Things like this give people ideas to sell them on. Piracy is just the thing that affects my Dads businesses.

[thedudeman69]

It is totally and completely wrong to copy either a well made movie or a okay made movie, but nevermind how bad a movie sucks, it is still wrong to copy it.

[Cronos]

backing up your collection is fine by me, but its wrong to copy a dvd if you dont own the original copy

[CMAGUS]

I think its fine for personal backups only but not for distributing I know I ripped my kill bill vol1 and 2 and put them together as one film then burned it(I was too lazy to get up and switch discs)but I would never distribute it and it is for my personal use only.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

I think its okay, ONLY as long as you're signed up for something like netflix or nicheflix, because I can just easily put the movie back in my queue and rent it again.

Instead, I just burn a copy and send the DVD back so others can have a chance to watch the movie. It also keeps things flowing very smoothly, for both me and the online rental people.

Does this make sense?

Anyway, If the movie is good and its a good dvd, then I always buy it. Also for movies bigger than a DVD-5, you have to compress them to fit on a regular dvd-r, so you have quality loss. That is, until dual-layer dvd media becomes available cheap.

[ChemicalRomance]

It's cool but VERY VERY bad under one circumstance:

A) You make the copies, and sell them.

That's just stupid and wrong. I think I would only do DVD copying with movies I thought were okay...but don't want to pay a lot of money for. But for movies I like...I enjoyed owning them. Having the box, seeing it from the side on my shelf...the hapiness that comes with owning a movie you really like on DVD.

[dellamorte dellamore]

It's a Moral quandary indeed , one that will become even more confusing when Blu Ray and HD DVD become the norm .

My stance is , buying a movie is like voting , if you support the candidate and his or her stance on certain views , you'll buy his or her product and support their cause .

[MichiganFlynn]

Originally posted by Hot-Handed Fury
I think its okay, ONLY as long as you're signed up for something like netflix or nicheflix, because I can just easily put the movie back in my queue and rent it again.

Instead, I just burn a copy and send the DVD back so others can have a chance to watch the movie. It also keeps things flowing very smoothly, for both me and the online rental people.

Does this make sense?




No it doesn't. You are trying to justify making a copy for yourself. It doesn't matter that you rented it, and wanted to be "nice" and return it so others could rent it. You made a copy of that movie, and it's wrong, plain and simple. When you make a copy of a movie you don't own, there is NO justification, plain and simple.

It doesn't matter what you can always rent it again, why would you bother if you've copied the movie? That makes NO sense, unless you destroy the copy you've made after watching it ONCE (thus justifying your illegial copying). You'll obviously be tempted to keep your copy, and watch it again, destroying your argument. You can rent it from Netflix again, but it's their copy of the movie, and not yours.

Shame on you for such a poor argument. I can fill a car with gas, does that mean I can steal a car, take it for a joyride and return it on full? Of course not.

What happens if Netflix closes down? Will you still justify your argument by saying "i've rented it, I deserve to have these movies now".

Don't pirate movies. Rent the movie from Netflix, enjoy it, then return it and have a clear consience.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Originally posted by MichiganFlynn

Shame on you for such a poor argument. I can fill a car with gas, does that mean I can steal a car, take it for a joyride and return it on full? Of course not.

What happens if Netflix closes down? Will you still justify your argument by saying "i've rented it, I deserve to have these movies now".

Don't pirate movies. Rent the movie from Netflix, enjoy it, then return it and have a clear consience.

LoL, there's a HUGE difference between a federal offense and me simply copying a movie onto a DVD from a service that I'm paying $50+ a month for. The studios & artists are getting paid for their work, as opposed to those fools who just download everything thru bittorrent.

And shame on you for making such a poor analogy. Am I stealing cars here? NO!

Also, I don't know ANYONE who doesn't agree with me that downloading a cd or movie off the internet is wrong. I work with a guy who has burned more than 3000 music cds, and he never goes to the movies anymore; he downloads the shitty cam captures.

I'm against piracy, what I'm doing isn't piracy; If I ever stop my netflix or nicheflix membership I'll destroy all my backups. BTW, Netflix has become a huge corporation now; they have shipping centers in almost every state and now Blockbuster is jumping on the bandwagon by starting thier own online rental service.

Lastly, if the DVD is good then I usually buy it; I just rented the series Band of Brothers from netflix, and its so awesome that I just bumped it up to the top of my 'to buy' list.

[dellamorte dellamore]

U know what really annoys me , when i shell out 20 - 25 duckets on a DVD and then , 6 months later the same film is released in an ultimate edition with a couple of more extras and sometimes a DTS track . Now what do i do , spend another couple of bucks to get the extras and a more powerful soundtrack or , uh oh , rent the new version and make a copy , after all i do own the original .


At least with certain films the studio will let you another version is planned so you can make a decision not to buy the first release ( LOTR ) . When they don't give you a heads up , that's really annoying .

[::salty::]

Ive only copied one dvd in my life, and that was the Killer. I couldnt find the DVD anywhere and I didn't have 200 bucks to shell out on the ones on Ebay and Amazon so I copied one from Blockbuster.

Ill destroy it the second I get a real version, and I am searching for one, because the only thing I was able to copy was the film itself.

Im usually against copying DVDs since I like to collect them, but this one time I decided it was worth the $2 dvd rather than the 200 dollars.

Im hoping for a re-release sometime, or at least being able to find a copy under 100 dollars.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Hey ::salty::,

they just released re-mastered copies of The Killer, as well as HardBoiled, A bullet in the head, And the A Better Tomorrow trilogy.

http://www.dvdasian.com/images/6/17598.3.jpg
http://www.dvdasian.com/cgi-bin/dvdasian/17598.html?id=t7u3qVkh

This set is all region, so no region-free dvd player required.

The Criterion DVD that goes for upwards of $100 on eBay probably won't ever be re-released; I sold mine for more than $200 a couple years back. Anyway, there are some Korean R0 Criterion The Killer DVDs floating around out there, but supposedly they're bootlegs.

[Raging Bull080]

Wrong

[dellamorte dellamore]

Ah , it's a time frame issue . You can tape or make copies of all the 8 tracks and casette tapes you want now , and noone will even care an ounce ( you can include LD , Phonographic , and Videodisc in there too , as well as CD I ( Philips format ) ) . So when DVD , this incarnation , falls by the wayside , copy them all you want , it won't matter , because everything will be on micro dvd or whatever the future formats will be ( after HD DVD and Blu Ray ) .

It's already been established that you can legally copy a song off of the radio for personal use ( because of the sound quality ) , so what now happens with Satellite radio , it's digital quality , is it allright to copy that ?

By the way , anyone who pays 200 duckets for some John Woo collection dvd set is a bit bonkers . At least you found the sucker to pay it though .

[MichiganFlynn]

Originally posted by Hot-Handed Fury
LoL, there's a HUGE difference between a federal offense and me simply copying a movie onto a DVD from a service that I'm paying $50+ a month for. The studios & artists are getting paid for their work, as opposed to those fools who just download everything thru bittorrent.

I'm against piracy, what I'm doing isn't piracy; If I ever stop my netflix or nicheflix membership I'll destroy all my backups. BTW, Netflix has become a huge corporation now; they have shipping centers in almost every state and now Blockbuster is jumping on the bandwagon by starting thier own online rental service.


Reread that just a little bit, would you? Copying movies illegially IS a criminal offense, or haven't you been reading the news these days?

Here's what you are trying to justify to me, yourself and anyone reading this:

- By paying a set amount every month, you believe you are entitled to rent any movie, and since you pay that amount every month, you believe that you are entitled to COPY that said movie, and return the original copy, thereby giving others the "favor" of being able to rent it quicker -

Woo woo here comes the clue train! Next stop you! I can't believe anyone would honestly feel they are JUSTIFIED in doing what you are doing. You RENT that movie, you do NOT in ANY WAY OWN THAT MOVIE. You do not have ANY permission to copy that movie AT ALL. You didn't pay for the movie, you paid for the service to RENT that movie. NETFLIX owns that copy of that said movie, NOT YOU.

You have backups that are illegial plain and simple. Don't justify yourself by claiming you pay a set amount per month, thereby you should be allowed to keep that movie forever, or until your cancel your subscription. That's horseshit. I pay a set amount for my cable every month. Now because I pay that amount every month, does that mean i'm justified in splitting my cable so others can enjoy it elsewhere? Of course not, it's theft.

BTW Netflix becomming a huge corporation has NOTHING to do with this conversation. I could give a fuck less if Blockbuster, Denny's or the local mall is jumping on the bandwagon, theft is theft. If you are against piracy, get rid of your copies. You don't own them, they aren't yours. When you buy the DVD, make all the copies for yourself that you want. Then and ONLY then can you truly justify yourself that what you are doing is right.

Point blank, and this will be it. I could honestly give a shit less what you do. It annoys me to no end however, when people try to justify piracy. It's wrong, and no matter what you pay, if you don't OWN the product, it's not yours. (Ie, Rent, it's not your dam place, and yes they can do whatever they want to it, sad as it might seem).

[dellamorte dellamore]

I wonder if a limit on the amount of times you can view / listen to a movie will be regulated eventually . What about those free rentals you get as a bone every now and then , i ididn't actually pay to watch it , ohhh , i feel so dirty . I'll never accept one of those rent a 100's dvd and get a ' free ' rentals again .

My point is , yes it is wrong , but in time it will be insignifigant , once new formats come to market . No matter , if something is in demand , it will make its duckets . Piracy , screener copies , and some dude in Chinatown NY wont stop the profit margin of a worthwhile film .



You can't steal an image , but as evidenced by some recent films , you can try to capitalize on it .

[Country1969]

I'm against people copying dvds for money.
First I would never want a copy of a dvd in my collection.
I only want the originals.

What's $15.00 for a dvd when you will have it a very long time.


Just like bootleg movies, when you have someone video tape it while theres talking ,shaking picture,etc.

Just buy the dvd movie when it comes out.

[BigSugar]

Given the fact that companies releasing multiple DVDs is becoming an increasing problem, I have a hard time coming down on the side of those who make money off of DVDs. and then you have total assholes like George Lucas who keep screwing around with the movies we love and never shaowing anything but total disregard for his core fans. I have to say, I'm not in favor of piracy, but I'll be damned if doesn't look like the only alternative left to us.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Fine, I guess I'm a pirate then. Yeah, I am trying to justify what I do since I do pay a set amount per month, but if you want to make the issue black & white then yeah okay its piracy.

But, do I turn around and sell my copies for profit? No. IMHO, this issue isn't B & W, and there's a HUGE grey area present.

Anyway, some schmoes like MichiganFlynn are passionately against DVD copying, while the rest of us poor, working class movie fans are sick of movie companies gouging us on 3-4 different "special" edition DVD releases.

When will this practice end?

And think ahead 3-4 years when HD-DVD will be huge and think of how you'll probably want to replace your entire dvd collection with brand spanking new high bit-rate HD-DVDs.

What I really want is a definitive, superbit-rate, 1080i HD DVD copy of a movie that I won't have to replace for at least 10-15 years.

I'm still getting around to replacing my old worn out VHS copies, and now to think that my steadily growing DVD collection will be obsolete come 5-10 years is just insanity.

MichiganFlynn, so tell me, have you ever taped a movie you rented years back onto a VHS, downloaded an mp3 illegally over then internet, or borrowed a movie a friend taped, burned, downloaded?

I don't understand why you're so passionately against this...I was with downloading mp3s because the smaller & independent musicians get royally screwed, but I just want to know why?

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Originally posted by dellamorte dellamore
I wonder if a limit on the amount of times you can view / listen to a movie will be regulated eventually . What about those free rentals you get as a bone every now and then , i ididn't actually pay to watch it , ohhh , i feel so dirty . I'll never accept one of those rent a 100's dvd and get a ' free ' rentals again .

My point is , yes it is wrong , but in time it will be insignifigant , once new formats come to market . No matter , if something is in demand , it will make its duckets . Piracy , screener copies , and some dude in Chinatown NY wont stop the profit margin of a worthwhile film .



You can't steal an image , but as evidenced by some recent films , you can try to capitalize on it .

Hey dellamorte, the studios did try and implement a pay-per-play DVD system about 6-7 years ago, a MISERABLE failure called DIVX.

Divx is now known as a highly compressed video format.

Anyway, a few major studios had a deal w/ circuit city who sold the players & discs exclusively. At the time, regular DVDs were just coming out as well and there was MAJOR confusion amongst regular consumers between divx DVDs and regular DVDs.

With Divx, you had to call in and plug your Divx dvd player into a phone jack and you'd register your player iinto their database, so they could bill you ever time you viewed one of your divx dvds.

Well, thank God this failed because this was a terrible, terrible idea; I'm sure studio execs are still thinking of ways to get us fans to pay each and every single time we watch one of their films.

[Bullet Tooth Tony]

I'll put my hand up and say I've burned a few movies. But...if I want a movie I'd buy it without question.

I'm kind of a hypocrite I don't really agree with it but I do it occasionally. I've burned two movies out of the dozens I've rented.

[JCPhoenix]

Originally posted by Country1969
I'm against people copying dvds for money.
First I would never want a copy of a dvd in my collection.
I only want the originals.

What's $15.00 for a dvd when you will have it a very long time.


Just like bootleg movies, when you have someone video tape it while theres talking ,shaking picture,etc.

Just buy the dvd movie when it comes out.

actually, most bootlegs you can get are actual dvds (and dvd quality, sometimes the actual retail dvd and before it comes out), not some guy filming the movie at a theatre, unless the movie just came out recently.

i'm not gonna get into this issue because it's obviously getting quite heated but suffice to say that i have downloaded and burned several dvds but yet I still buy original dvds with the majority of my money. the only reason i burn dvds is because i've pretty much spent the rest of my money on the movie industry anyway and i still don't have enough to get the movies i want cause dvds are friggin expensive - and let's face it, they make money off of me the time i go to see the movie in theatres, they make more money off of me when i buy the first edition of a movie, and then they make more money off of me when they release a special edition.

of all the areas that are black, white or gray, selling bootleg dvds is clearly and obviously the worst and something i would never do. but think about it this way - how many people download mp3s? well it's pretty much the same thing, but for movies. 90% of the people i know download mp3s like crazy so downloading movies is pretty much the same thing just on a slightly different scale.

is it wrong? maybe, but to be honest, i don't really care that much anymore. i'm spending all the money i could possibly on the film industry anyway so it's not like it really matters. but then you also have issues like let's say you see butch cassidy and the sundance kid on tv (as it was on tv the other night) and you tape it. nothing wrong with that right, you're just taping TV. But then you want to see it in better quality so you download a better copy of it. What then, is it suddenly wrong for you to view the better, clearer version of the movie?

OK i got into this when i promised i wouldn't but ah well. p.s. i don't tend to download indie films or smaller films, generally the bigger ones only. Films with small budgets etc are where I start to feel a bit more guilty so I'll generally pay for the dvd if I want it (ex: I know if I like Garden State, Motorcycle Diaries, and the upcoming Saw when I see them (in theatres), those are the dvds I'll definitely be buying whereas if I saw a blockbuster film I'd consider downloading instead).

And just to open up another question, what about older classics? Is it wrong to download/burn older classics that (like I said earlier) you see on TV all the time? It's not exactly like you're screwing someone out of their job, or deducting the pay from the stars (who are probably dead) after all the movies are like 40 years old...

[SykkBoy]

I backup all the DVDs I own and see nothing wrong with that. I also transfer some of my old, rare videos that have a slim chance of ever seeing the light of DVD day (and they are rapidly deteriorating from), but these are all movies that I actually own.

I wouldn't ever sell them or profit from them though.

With some of these fucked up cases, I'm afraid of snapping the disc one day and cracking it, so back them up and watch the backup copy to avoid breaking/ruining the backup copy.

[Cipher Jo]

Some nice points in this thread. I for one, don't believe in selling copied discs. I feel that it is okay to backup your collection though as discs scratch or break with use over a long period of time. I do find it curiously funny how easy it is to do and that people have been doing the same thing with music CD's since the first burner came out.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

I don't think it's right or wrong. I think it's wrong to download a movie that you love, but I also think it's wrong to pay $20 for a damn movie. I personally don't download because I have respect for the people who make great movies.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Definitely lots of interesting & thoughtful views in this thread. I'm also glad this thing(as of yet) hasn't turned into a flamewar.

I read somewhere that some of the older, "classic" films are actually public domain, and don't have an official license-holder(someone please correct me if I'm mistaken). That's why there are so many damn versions of Romero's Night of the Living Dead released on DVD by every no-name company out there.

Anyway, moving on...Think of this: 10-15, even 20 years ago, how did the fans get to see all the greatest underground and indie films? The answer is by trading/buying bootleg, crap quality copies on VHS. Sometimes the ONLY way to see a certain rare flick was to order a 5th generation dub vhs tape through the mail from a very small cult movie seller. I have some fond and not-so-fond memories of ordering expensive(but VERY bad quality) vhs bootleg copies of Jackie Chan(drunken master 2) & jet Li(fist of legend) movies during those pre-DVD days.

Jump to present time, and now we have the wonderful world of internet file-sharing, movie message boards, and online rental places with 10s of 1000s of DVDs.

Its never been a better time to be a movie fan; there are so many movies and DVD releases out there and a lot of us just don't have enough money to double/triple/quadruple-dip on a movie every time a DVD company decides to come out with yet another "special" edition.

My point being, whenever we buy a DVD or go to the theater we're voting with our wallets. IMHO we should only buy the DVD releases that are the 'definitive' versions of the particular movie so the damn studios will get the message that we do not like buying the same movie 3 times.

So, in closing, I'm all for copying the inferior quality version of a movie only if you do buy the final quality release and "vote" for the good DVDs...

[dellamorte dellamore]

This is where i differ somewhat . In a weird way , some films got free publicity and exposure Because of illegal copies floating around the internet .


Don't think for a second that a Shaun of the Dead or Dead and Breakfast would have caused as much a stir as they have if it wasnt for people that have seen those films because of copies they may have gotten off the internet . I'm not saying i have done so , and i'm not saying it's right if someone does , but , hold your melons , some films actually benefit from " illegal " exposure . It creates a buzz and gets people talking , it's like spreading rumors . In a sick way , the whole file sharing thing is like free advertising . Yeah , they may lose a couple of bucks , but the bucks they lose will most likely be offset by the buzz that's created if people take a liking to the film , and spread the word .

It's like ordinary , everyday lunkheads are taking back the exclusive , elitist perch that critics have . We ( not me , in general ) , can see the film around the same time some film festival pinhead reporter gets to see it , and let it be known if it's worthy of attention , or if all the insulated praise is a smokescreen created by the studio that bought the rights to a particular film .



One thing that really gets me is that the studios are mooaning about piracy . It's not as big a prob as they make it seem . As evidenced by record breaking DVD and ticket sales , the pirates , downloaders , and people that engage in one or the other , are a small minority .



I do agree though , that the scumbag selling horrendous copies of Passion of the Christ on some corner of NYC , so he can finance his gang activities , is a despicable individual . And on VHS , no less , get a life you cretin . At least invest in a DVD burner :D .

[MichiganFlynn]

Originally posted by Hot-Handed Fury
Fine, I guess I'm a pirate then. Yeah, I am trying to justify what I do since I do pay a set amount per month, but if you want to make the issue black & white then yeah okay its piracy.

But, do I turn around and sell my copies for profit? No. IMHO, this issue isn't B & W, and there's a HUGE grey area present.

Anyway, some schmoes like MichiganFlynn are passionately against DVD copying, while the rest of us poor, working class movie fans are sick of movie companies gouging us on 3-4 different "special" edition DVD releases.

When will this practice end?

And think ahead 3-4 years when HD-DVD will be huge and think of how you'll probably want to replace your entire dvd collection with brand spanking new high bit-rate HD-DVDs.

What I really want is a definitive, superbit-rate, 1080i HD DVD copy of a movie that I won't have to replace for at least 10-15 years.

I'm still getting around to replacing my old worn out VHS copies, and now to think that my steadily growing DVD collection will be obsolete come 5-10 years is just insanity.

MichiganFlynn, so tell me, have you ever taped a movie you rented years back onto a VHS, downloaded an mp3 illegally over then internet, or borrowed a movie a friend taped, burned, downloaded?

I don't understand why you're so passionately against this...I was with downloading mp3s because the smaller & independent musicians get royally screwed, but I just want to know why?

You misunderstand everything i've stated. I only replied to your post because you were trying to justify yourself in what you were doing.

Want to know my stance:

I could give a shit less what people do. If you honestly want to rent movies and copy them, go right ahead. It's not my business, and you'd do it whether or not someone told you it was wrong (you do it anyways, right?). My beef with you specifically was because you tried to act like what you were doing wasn't wrong, when it clearly is.

I don't make the laws, and yes in your case, I might do the exact same thing. However, I know what i'm doing is wrong, and if something ever happened, I would be ready to accept the consequences, and not have a lawyer find an excuse.

The fact is you just don't understand something. It doesn't matter that you haven't sold any copies for profit. It's the fact you've COPIED something that isn't yours, it's just that simple. If you bought the DVD, then copied it, that DVD broke over the years, yes you'd be justified in having that copy still, because you paid for the DVD, not the service to rent the DVD. Does that make sense?

There is NO grey area, it's clear as day. If you copy a DVD, for profit or for personal use, and you don't own the original copy, it's stealing and that's the end of the story.

Like I said before, I could care less if you copied every DVD in the world for your personal use. Just as long as you admit you know what you are doing is wrong. There is no justification for copying something that isn't yours.

And yes, I totally agree on your stance that hard working people are forced to buy 3-4 different versions of DVD's just to get the version they want. It's sick what the studios do, and it's disgusting that DVD's will likely be replaced in the next 5 years, if not less. We are paying BILLIONS to the movie studios for their movies, and as soon as they can chug out a new format and get everyone to buy new copies, the better for them.

However to say that your justified because "they'll be outdated in 3-4 years" is bullshit. Like i've said a hundred times, (and i'll continue to say so) there is NO NO NO NO NO NO NO justification in copying a product you do not own.

And i've copied tons of MP3's over the years. I've downloaded movies, porn, material that isn't mine etc etc. At least I admit what i'm doing is wrong. I subscribe to Netflix myself, and if I copied any DVD, at least i'd have the dignity to admit what I was doing is wrong.

So do me a favor. Don't act like what you are doing is right. No matter how much you have to pay for something, you don't have any right to steal it, that much is plain and simple. Yes it sucks there's a ton of different versions out there. Yes it sucks a new format will come out soon enough and replace all our old DVD's in a matter of months. Yes it SUCKS that DVD's will forever be horrifically overpriced and we can only buy so many at time, knowing other things are (hopefully) more important in our lives. It's the way things are, and if you don't like it, there's other options.

And hey, i'm all for doing what you want to do. Like I said earlier, if you want to copy something, be my guest. Just never act like you are doing the world a favor by making that copy for yourself.

And that's my problem with anyone who tries to justify themselves. Spending a 100 bucks on a DVD burner does not allow you to copy movies because your justifiying it as "well I paid for the burner, I might as well see if it works".

(If you still don't get it, copy all you want. Just never justify as "well the studios make shitloads of cash, one copy won't hurt them" It's that kind of shit that has the RIAA up everyone's ass these days).

[RavenBlade]

I do this with my movies, but not for profit.

I rip the dvd, work on it, and make an mp3
file out of the soundtrack, cut them into
10 minute parts, so you may have
about 30 chapter stops in mp3 format,
so you can choose where you want to listen
to it while driving your car, wait, maybe it's
.wav format, cant remember as it's been
a while since I have done this.

But it's fun for long drives, if you don't have
a portable dvd player, you get to listen to it,
and though my favorite one was Halloween Ressurection,
if you were to do that, you could eliminate Busta Rhymes,
and insert your own actor into his role. Ok, maybe
the voice will stay the same as Busta's but that's where
your imagination comes into play, it could be friggin
Neil Patrick Harris with a gruff voice, well you get the idea.
It's like a movie on C.D.

But this isn't what you were looking for, and I surmize
that I will get those blank stares.

In Short, I don't think backing up your dvd's is wrong,
you need to protect your investment.

Raven

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Originally posted by MichiganFlynn
You misunderstand everything i've stated. I only replied to your post because you were trying to justify yourself in what you were doing.



LoL, Dude I understand everything you're saying.

Yes, according to the law, copying DVDs you didn't purchase is illegal. I guess I didn't make it clear in my posts because I'm trying to address a different issue. I do understand what I'm doing is against the law, and its a shame the studios' lawyers had DVDXCOPY shut down.

And I never said what I was doing was right, just that I'm not outright stealing the movies by dl'ing and burning, and I can easily rent the DVD again, so why the hell not burn it? It definitely saves me the wait.

Anyway, yeah its piracy, most of us acknowledge that its wrong, but do we do it anyway? Hell yeah we do.

In a court of law of course there isn't a grey area(innocent or guilty, but coming from the point of view of a consumer, IMO there is a huge grey area especially when these companies are consistently screwing us over.

My wish is that once we buy one copy of an intellectual property, we'd be able to trade it in for the newer version if/when it becomes available, either for free or at a big discount.

[Slim_JGE]

Yeah, it's piracy. But it really makes no difference to me. If people wanna download movies, songs... whatever, it honestly doesn't bother me one bit. I buy a riDONKulous amount of DVDs cuz I'm a collector and I like to have the whole package (cover art, inserts, collector packaging, disc art, etc. etc.). I would buy them anyway; and if one broke I would re-buy it. A burned copy would bother me and appear (to me) like a blemish on my collection. Yeah, I know that's stupid, but I'm anal that way.

[dellamorte dellamore]

Yeah , im sick like that too , i want the complete package also . I'll even keep any stickers that may be on the outside of the package , the security tags , and i'll even make a fine slice on the bottom and top of the case so i can keep that little white sticker with the movie's name on it . Like i said before though , i do want the definitive version of certain films , but there is no such thing anymore , there will always be another version somewhere down the line .

[MichiganFlynn]

Originally posted by Hot-Handed Fury


In a court of law of course there isn't a grey area(innocent or guilty, but coming from the point of view of a consumer, IMO there is a huge grey area especially when these companies are consistently screwing us over.

My wish is that once we buy one copy of an intellectual property, we'd be able to trade it in for the newer version if/when it becomes available, either for free or at a big discount.

It's too bad something like that couldn't happen. Like a 50% discount for anyone who's owned the original copy of a movie. (Keep the receipt, get half off).

I too am sick of multiple double dips, which is why I refuse to buy another version of a movie. These days however, you can usually tell what's going to be double dipped or not, and when they do, it's usually something you don't want (POTC anyone?).

Most DVD's out right now are usually the only version that will be released anyways. It's just the old copies that are annoying, specificially with George Romero films.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

The upcoming POTC dvd is a shameless attempt by the studios to make even more money off of unsuspecting movie fans.

At the very least, they could've remastered the DVD(get rid of that ugly edge-enhancement), and improved the pretty weak DTS track.

There's one other thing that drives me nuts: Sometimes the R2 Japan & R3 Korea DVD releases of American films are FAR superior to our R1 releases.

I have the Japanese Kill Bill DVD and not only does it contain the uncut version, but it has a much better transfer as well.
The japanese also have the 3 Jurassic Park movies in Superbit, and they blow the american releases out of the water.

And recently I rented the R3 korean Fight Club dvd from Nicheflix, and its DTS is one of the best(and LOUDEST) tracks I've heard in awhile. The dts track on the region 1 release sucks balls! Even the Korean disc's Dolby Digital 5.1 track is better than the american DTS track.

So, we've got all this double dipping among R1 releases AND quite a few superior DVDs being released in other regions....madness.

[CriticalBill6966]

I don't do it since I don't have the equipment to, but I don't see what the big deal is as long as you don't sell them for your own profit.

The music bussiness made such a big deal about internet downloads but I could just as easy make 30 copies of one CD and give it out to my freinds.....yet they don't say or do anything about it. Last time I turned on the radio I heard new music by a new artist and if copying music hurt the industry as much as they made out....you wouldn't see new music being made.

I don't think it hurts the bussiness at all. If you look over the last few years you can tell more and more people are spending money and going to the movies or buying DVDs.

Hardcore collector's like myself would still purchase the movies they love and want simply for Box Art and sleeve incerts. It doesn't hurt anything in the long run, Holloywood would still be cranking out movies.

[dellamorte dellamore]

May have to spring for those JP superbits , because , i agree , the REG 1 DTS tracks is not as clear and powerful as it could be .

It is odd that other regions get the better releases , and on the first release , we Reg 1 suckers get drips and drabs with multiple releases that don't even measure up to one Reg 3 release .

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Originally posted by dellamorte dellamore
May have to spring for those JP superbits , because , i agree , the REG 1 DTS tracks is not as clear and powerful as it could be .



Sadly the JP Superbits are OOP, but sometimes can be found at a ridiculous price on eBay. Nicheflix does have the JP3 SB for rent, but the first 2 have long been 'lost'.

There are some sellers on eBay who do have some JP Superbit DVDs, but those are all bootlegs. eBay is overrun with bootleg DVDs...

[rilocay]

Well, its wrong when its not back up's id say but in this case i'd let it the slip (not just causeim doing it).

My friend has copied me Kill Bill Volume 1 when it came out fro rental because a) you couldnt buy it till 8 or so months later and b) im going to get that big collection thats gonna happen, so unitl then id rather svae my dosh and definatly get that release of the 2 volumes.


Now what do you think of that? Its for a good cause in my opinion. But then x this by every dvd and i see how theres the problem.

[The Heart Collector]

It's wrong, which doesn't mean I'm going to stop doing it.

[Adornado]

Originally posted by The Heart Collector
It's wrong, which doesn't mean I'm going to stop doing it.

Bingo.

[bourahioro]

Originally posted by Slim_JGE
Yeah, it's piracy. But it really makes no difference to me. If people wanna download movies, songs... whatever, it honestly doesn't bother me one bit. I buy a riDONKulous amount of DVDs cuz I'm a collector and I like to have the whole package (cover art, inserts, collector packaging, disc art, etc. etc.). I would buy them anyway; and if one broke I would re-buy it. A burned copy would bother me and appear (to me) like a blemish on my collection. Yeah, I know that's stupid, but I'm anal that way.

I a totally with you on this one.... If I can't have the whole package, I don't fucking want the movie on my shelves!! I remember not to long ago, a friend of mine came to my place and left ghost ship...they told me I could keep it (I thought the movie sucked, but anyway) and I was like, no way...it was just the disc...no case at all, no insert...nothing. I am completely obsessive/compulsive about my DVDs I have 121, and they were all bought, no copies, personally I don't give a fuck what other people do, whether it be copying DVDs, porn, music...doesn't matter, but as far as I am concerned, copying anything makes a person's "collection" incomplete.

[Jim H]

Copying movies illegially IS a criminal offense, or haven't you been reading the news these days?

Last I checked, copyright violation is a CIVIL offense.

[FT13TH Addict]

Originally posted by Hot-Handed Fury
And shame on you for making such a poor analogy. Am I stealing cars here? NO!



Even if you are stealing a 50 cent candy bar, stealing is stealing.

[stampede331]

I think it was hot handed fury who made this statement, but I'll reitterate the point I believe he was making; their is nothing wrong in burning a copy of a dvd which I rent because it's just an easy and available method to watch a movie I'd be able to obtain anyways, since I belong to a service which supplies any movie within a relatively quick period of time. As long as I'm subscribing to this service, I'm essentially just keeping my rentals yet not discontinuing the service which I continue to pay for. I know of someone who does something similar so I understand to a degree what you are saying.

[MichiganFlynn]

Originally posted by Jim H
Last I checked, copyright violation is a CIVIL offense.

Check again.

[Jim H]

Originally posted by MichiganFlynn
Check again.

I can't find any clear links.

http://www.3m.com/meetingnetwork/presentations/pmag_copyright_criminal.html

It's small comfort to know that copyright law is primarily civil law, not criminal law

That was the best I saw, but hardly a particularly good one. I'm not really a google master.



It has been my understanding that copies are civil infractions, and selling is criminal. Care to point to something that says different?

[Hot-Handed Fury]

I'm pretty sure its a federal offense, since all the copyright warnings are issued by the Federal Bureau of Investigations.

Just an educated guess...

[dellamorte dellamore]

Don't forget Interpol , whoever that shadowy organization is , are they still in business .

[Hot-Handed Fury]

Out of sheer boredom, I popped in a DVD to check the FBI warning:

FEDERAL LAW PROVIDES CIVIL AND CRIMINAL PENALTIES FOR THE UNAUTHORIZED REPRODUCTION, DISTRIBUTION, OR EXHIBITION OF COPYRIGHTED MOTION PICTURES, VIDEO TAPES AND VIDEO DISCS(TITLE 17 UNTIED STATES CODE SECTIONS 501 AND 506)

THE FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATIONS INVESTIGATES ALLEGATIONS OF CRIMINAL COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT (TITLE 17 UNTIED STATES CODE SECTIONS 506)

[Cipher Jo]

You hear that FBI!

[TheDeadWalk]

Not really caring if its wrong.

If the piece of shit was good enough, I'd buy it.

Plus it saves on cost when you have a 10 year old girl in the house who wants to re-rent Freddie Prinze Jr.'s "HEAD OVER HEELS" every fucking weekend! I'm saving myself millions, I don't really care because blockbuster got a dime from me already. Not to mention all of the Lindsay Lohan/Hilary Duff/Disney film X prototypes that come out every 3 months that she keeps on demand, that winds up in me saving oodles of noodles. My burning of these movies may help hurt the industry, but their pieces of trash help hurt my wallet, so they can suck on me balls, cause I'm breakin the laws.

The films that earn themselves into my original collection get there.

[robcro]

Being an aspiring filmmaker I hope that if I get the opportunity to make a half decent film I do not get screwed out of royalties.

However, jumping onto the other side of the fence I'd like to play the devil's advocate:

1)I, too, am tired of waiting for a favorite movie to come out on dvd, you rush out to buy it on the first day, and then six to twelve months later the 'special' or 'deluxe' or 'extended' addition comes out. Why must we be ripped off two or three times with a certain title?!

2)Talk about titles: the Criterion collection. Where does this pompous film society get off charging a film fan an arm and a leg for a favorite movie? All titles are $40 and up! Am I to spend over $50 on 'The Last Temptation Of Christ' just because I'm a Scorsese fan?! The Criterion collection is the Tommy Hilfiger of films, extorting film fans just because they have their name printed on the cover.

Having said that, I conclude it is deemed alright to copy a dvd if

1)you have bought the 'original' version of your favorite film, and

2)if the Criterion collection is holding your favorite film for ransom!

[Cipher Jo]

I hear you there! I have a friend that's spent $400 on Criterions but in order to own all of them, he's copying some.

[Hot-Handed Fury]

http://www.criteriondvd.com/

This place has great prices and free shipping, and some titles are as low as $20(most I've seen are around $28).

[vanick216]

Let's say you go to the movies and pay $8.00 for a ticket and you enjoy the movie and plan on buying the dvd.It doesn't seem wrong to me if you download the movie you payed $8.00 to go see and then plan on spending $20.00 on the dvd.This way you have the movie to watch until the dvd comes out and the studio is getting $28.00 out of you.


I also agree that the studio rips people off with different versions.When I do pay for a dvd I want it to be the best and only version.


Here is an example of good and bad double dips:The Lord of the Rings comes in the theatrical release and extended edition,but none of the extras are the same they are all different on each release and you get about 45 minutes of new footage.That was a good example.Now the hellboy dvd came out and had alot of extras however the Director's cut has a longer movie but all the same extras except a new commentary.So why buy almost the same thing if it were all new extras I would buy it but i'm not.That was the bad example.