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Lynn7
10-05-2005, 05:56 AM
Bush wants right to use military if bird flu hits

From My Way

Oct 4, 2:50 PM (ET)
By Charles Aldinger

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President George W. Bush asked Congress on Tuesday to consider giving him powers to use the military to enforce quarantines in case of an avian influenza epidemic.

He said the military, and perhaps the National Guard, might be needed to take such a role if the feared H5N1 bird flu virus changes enough to cause widespread human infection.

"If we had an outbreak somewhere in the United States, do we not then quarantine that part of the country? And how do you, then, enforce a quarantine?" Bush asked at a news conference.

"It's one thing to shut down airplanes. It's another thing to prevent people from coming in to get exposed to the avian flu. And who best to be able to effect a quarantine?" Bush added.

"One option is the use of a military that's able to plan and move. So that's why I put it on the table. I think it's an important debate for Congress to have."

Bird flu has killed more than 60 people in four Asian nations since late 2003 and has been found in birds in Russia and Europe.

Experts fear that the H5N1 bird flu virus, which appears to be highly fatal when it infects people, will develop the ability to pass easily from person to person and would cause a pandemic that would kill millions.

"And I think the president ought to have all ... assets on the table to be able to deal with something this significant," Bush said.

He noted that some governors may object to the federal government commandeering the National Guard, which is under state command in most circumstances.

POLICE DUTIES BANNED

"But Congress needs to take a look at circumstances that may need to vest the capacity of the president to move beyond that debate. And one such catastrophe or one such challenge could be an avian flu outbreak," Bush said.

The active duty military is currently forbidden from undertaking law enforcement duties by the federal Posse Comitatus Act.

That law, passed in 1878 after the U.S. Civil War, does not prohibit National Guard troops under state control from doing police work. But, unless the law is changed, it would keep them from doing so if they were activated by Washington under federal control.

While the law allows the president to order the military to take control and do police work in an extreme emergency, the White House has been traditionally reluctant to usurp state powers.

Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman told reporters he was not aware of any current planning by the military to help respond to a flu pandemic.

But he noted that after Hurricanes Katrina and Rita devastated the Gulf region, Bush had asked Congress to consider giving the military control over initial response in dealing with major natural or other domestic disasters.

"Obviously the (Defense) Department has a tremendous amount of capability in a lot of areas. And we are a large force," Whitman said, noting also that the military had deployed field hospitals to Louisiana after the hurricanes.

Health experts are working to develop vaccines that would protect against the H5N1 strain of flu, because current influenza vaccines will not.

And countries are also developing stockpiles of drugs that can reduce the risk of serious disease or even sometimes prevent infection -- but supplies and manufacturing capacity are both limited.

Bush said he was involved in planning for an influenza pandemic, which experts say will definitely come, although they cannot predict when, or whether it will be H5N1 or some other virus.

(Additional reporting by Maggie Fox)
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Good idea- bad idea? IT might not be Bush in charge when Bird Flu hits.

Scorpio24
10-05-2005, 06:05 AM
I'm surprised to find myself agreeing with Bush on anything but I think he has it right on this one.

It's obvious from the wreckage it's left in Asia that this is one scary epidemic. I don't see how you can do anything other than quarntine. I know obviously it is going to upset peoples lives. But better to upset them than to lose them right???

I'm not a big fan of quarntine in most cases. The thought of it makes me feel uneasy. Probably just to many scary films in my youth. But I can't see another solution that will be as safe (for want of a better word) as keeping the infected away from the un-infected.

Lynn7
10-05-2005, 07:51 PM
My grandmother tells of when her daughter was a baby she got Scarlett Fever (I think that is what it was) and public health came to the house and removed my father, my uncle and their father from the house. My grandmother stayed alone with the baby and they somehow marked her door so everyone knew the house was quarantined and they delived milk in certain kinds of containers and each day the nurse would come to make sure my grandmother had washed the house down with some weird disinfectant. My gm still is humiliated about it when she speaks of it!

That Bird fluis scary- I guess we are overdue for an illness that goes about wiping us out. Hope it doesn't do anything or they come up with a vaccine or something.

The Postmaster General
10-06-2005, 11:03 AM
From what I understand, a quarantine would be useless.

Apparently with our population, travel habits and the way this virus spreads -- by the time it came to the point that a quarantine would make sense, it would be too hard to contain (people who travel in and out of the country, etc.)

The World of the day is a far cry from the day of Scarlett Fever -- they didn't have Orbitz, Travelocity, or cars that can cross state lines in a single trip.

They need to spend more speech regarding treatment, and less on how they are willing to mobilize the troops, or just making things scary for no real cause.

Scorpio24
10-06-2005, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by BubbaStrangelove
From what I understand, a quarantine would be useless.

Apparently with our population, travel habits and the way this virus spreads -- by the time it came to the point that a quarantine would make sense, it would be too hard to contain (people who travel in and out of the country, etc.)

The World of the day is a far cry from the day of Scarlett Fever -- they didn't have Orbitz, Travelocity, or cars that can cross state lines in a single trip.

They need to spend more speech regarding treatment, and less on how they are willing to mobilize the troops, or just making things scary for no real cause.


Where as thats a good point. I still feel that quarantine is something that has to be used to fight something like this.

Yes it would be great to be able to get a medicine for this epidemic but I should imagine that rersearch of this type is already going on in labs all over the world.

I understand what you're saying, about the sheer number of people on the move, and that it would make it nigh on impossible to track them. But as long as it isnt impossible I really can't think of another resolution. If this did hit and they didn't have a cure what would you do? I for the life of me can't think of anything. And although the death toll was massive in Asia it is widely regarded that the numbers could have been much higher if they hadn't ordered the quarantine. From what I remember the goverment out there tried to hide it was even happening at first. Then it became public to the world they had to act. Once they began to do somthing it started to wind down. And this in an area already infected for days/weeks.

And as for making it scary for no real concern - If people are in an area where there is an outbreak and they are worried about the troops. They are seriously under estimating the scaryness of this epidemic.

The Postmaster General
10-06-2005, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by Scorpio24
Where as thats a good point. I still feel that quarantine is something that has to be used to fight something like this.

Yes it would be great to be able to get a medicine for this epidemic but I should imagine that rersearch of this type is already going on in labs all over the world.

I understand what you're saying, about the sheer number of people on the move, and that it would make it nigh on impossible to track them. But as long as it isnt impossible I really can't think of another resolution. If this did hit and they didn't have a cure what would you do? I for the life of me can't think of anything. And although the death toll was massive in Asia it is widely regarded that the numbers could have been much higher if they hadn't ordered the quarantine. From what I remember the goverment out there tried to hide it was even happening at first. Then it became public to the world they had to act. Once they began to do somthing it started to wind down. And this in an area already infected for days/weeks.

And as for making it scary for no real concern - If people are in an area where there is an outbreak and they are worried about the troops. They are seriously under estimating the scaryness of this epidemic.



Yeah, but in Asia things run a bit differently. You don't have as many people showboating around the nation

There's no good reason to not have a quarantine - don't get me wrong. Going through the motions never hurts anything. I don't think it's the presence of military that makes it scary. It's the idea that there is no smaller solution - that's what seems scary. One time a policeman told me that it's never like in the movies where the cops run to duty with their lights blazing.

Sort of my point is that the leader of the free world's biggest point is that we'll use the military to combat a health problem. He didn't talk much about them working on cures -- which they are, full force. It's almost like someone telling you not to worry about an intruder, because if they show up you'll put a bullet in their nutsack. Okay, that's cool, fine, and dandy, but can't we spend a little more time not fleshing out the worst case solution and, I don't know - make it known that prevention is a major concern. It's all very reactive and not proactive. And with whomever came up with that speech - It's totally whacked to me, because it comes off as being proactive about being reactive.

My biggest criticism with this administration is that they sort of wait too long on things, and it bugs me because they are making this big plan to wait until we need mass quarantines, and.... Ah hell, I'd be better off trying to make a joke out of this whole thing, because it mostly just bums me out thinking about it.

It's a bad sign for me when I'm second thinking my flu shots because of the possibility of cross infecting, or something. I've watched too many episodes of Seinfeld - imagine someone like Kramer causing the samples of the safe vaccine getting switched with the bird flu samples. Geez, I know, man - not going to happen. Yeah, because we'll call in the troops. Woo!