Official MLB Discussion Thread

[Erroneous]

Bert Blyleven is not a hall of famer. He is not even close. It is just sad just, because he is well liked and people or himself petitioned for him or hiimself for years until he got the votes.


The guy had 250 losses and not 300 win despite pitching for 22 years.
He won 20 games once and he lost 17 that year too in 1973.
I watched him play, he was not feared. He was a #3 at best.
So he had a lot of strikeouts.
Just look at his numbers and tell me those are the numbers of a hall of famer.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...lylebe01.shtml


If he gets in, so should Schilling, Pettitte, Mussina and a host of others.


I was also super surprised that Yogi Bera did not get in on the first ballot. The man was not only the best catcher of his generation, he was compared to many hitting catchers on a regular basis until the 2000's.

Look at his numbers.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...errayo01.shtml

15 time All Star when it meant something.
3 time MVP and this is when Pitchers did not have the Cy Young, so it was harder to win then.
He was also second MVP twice, third once and 4th once. And he did play with Mickey Mantle. So for 7 years, he was considered to be one of the best playing.

10 World Series.

What the fuck were those people thinking????? No way Bert gets in if these people were still voting.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Bert Blyleven is not a hall of famer. He is not even close. It is just sad just, because he is well liked and people or himself petitioned for him or hiimself for years until he got the votes.


The guy had 250 losses and not 300 win despite pitching for 22 years.
He won 20 games once and he lost 17 that year too in 1973.
I watched him play, he was not feared. He was a #3 at best.
So he had a lot of strikeouts.
Just look at his numbers and tell me those are the numbers of a hall of famer.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...lylebe01.shtml


If he gets in, so should Schilling, Pettitte, Mussina and a host of others.


I was also super surprised that Yogi Bera did not get in on the first ballot. The man was not only the best catcher of his generation, he was compared to many hitting catchers on a regular basis until the 2000's.

Look at his numbers.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...errayo01.shtml

15 time All Star when it meant something.
3 time MVP and this is when Pitchers did not have the Cy Young, so it was harder to win then.
He was also second MVP twice, third once and 4th once. And he did play with Mickey Mantle. So for 7 years, he was considered to be one of the best playing.

10 World Series.

What the fuck were those people thinking????? No way Bert gets in if these people were still voting.

Never saw him play so I can't comment on what he was like I know because of the day and age back then now with internet and everything I guess every stat can be broken down nowadays this was I believe his 14th time on the ballot so and I know from reading last year when he came close there was alot of debate on wether he's a hall of famer or not but I never saw him pitch so....

As for Alomar glad he got in it should have happenned last year the first and only player that will have a blue jays cap in the hall of fame and the best 2B I ever saw play like I said it should have happenned last year but Ill take him and Gillick going in this year at the same time.

And if the voting results mean anything anybody that is caught or is suppected of perfoirmance enhancing drugs or steroids is never getting in.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Never saw him play so I can't comment on what he was like I know because of the day and age back then now with internet and everything I guess every stat can be broken down nowadays this was I believe his 14th time on the ballot so and I know from reading last year when he came close there was alot of debate on wether he's a hall of famer or not but I never saw him pitch so....

As for Alomar glad he got in it should have happenned last year the first and only player that will have a blue jays cap in the hall of fame and the best 2B I ever saw play like I said it should have happenned last year but Ill take him and Gillick going in this year at the same time.

And if the voting results mean anything anybody that is caught or is suppected of perfoirmance enhancing drugs or steroids is never getting in.

I did not even know Alomar was a Padre to start his career. I thought he came up as a Blue Jay. I watched him play. He was the best second baseman for well over a decade.

There are many who don't like that the voters will pick and choose who they vote for to get into the Hall of Fame in regards to roids. I don't have an issue with that and that is how is should be. If it is clear that some cheated, they should not get it. Guys having career years in their late 30's and have gained major lbs prob cheated. If you look at some teams (Rangers and Orioles) in the mid 90's, you can litterally see the roids on some of the hitters based on numbers alone.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

I did not even know Alomar was a Padre to start his career. I thought he came up as a Blue Jay. I watched him play. He was the best second baseman for well over a decade.

There are many who don't like that the voters will pick and choose who they vote for to get into the Hall of Fame in regards to roids. I don't have an issue with that and that is how is should be. If it is clear that some cheated, they should not get it. Guys having career years in their late 30's and have gained major lbs prob cheated. If you look at some teams (Rangers and Orioles) in the mid 90's, you can litterally see the roids on some of the hitters based on numbers alone.

Yeah he was we aquired him and Carter for McGriff and Tony Fernandez its known as the trade that put us over the top for us to win our 2 world series its kind of fitting that him and Gillick are both going in together

Best example of that is Brady Anderson 1 time 50 HR guy never came close to that in any of his other seasons. I think it will be interesting in a couple years when Clemens and Bonds come up and see how the voting will go after that.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Yeah he was we aquired him and Carter for McGriff and Tony Fernandez its known as the trade that put us over the top for us to win our 2 world series its kind of fitting that him and Gillick are both going in together

Best example of that is Brady Anderson 1 time 50 HR guy never came close to that in any of his other seasons. I think it will be interesting in a couple years when Clemens and Bonds come up and see how the voting will go after that.

I think Bonds should go in, but make him wait like 10 years or after he is death. I don't want to see him give a speech. Maybe the effects of the roids will kill him early. He was a hall of famer before he juiced

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

I think Bonds should go in, but make him wait like 10 years or after he is death. I don't want to see him give a speech. Maybe the effects of the roids will kill him early. He was a hall of famer before he juiced

I think he was too people who saw him in San Francisco at the end tend to forget when he was with Pittsburgh he could steal bases and was a gold glove OF

but if Palmero gets barely over 11% and his career stats are hall worthy I wonder how many will vote for Bonds and Clemens.

Even Jeff Bagwell who has hall worthy number and is suppected of using PEDs(never proven though) didn't get in this year but I think he will.

In fact it's so bad Jeff Blair who writes for the Globe and Mail in Toronto has a hall vote and returned it empty voting for no one because of the steroids and suspicion of PEDs.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

I think he was too people who saw him in San Francisco at the end tend to forget when he was with Pittsburgh he could steal bases and was a gold glove OF

but if Palmero gets barely over 11% and his career stats are hall worthy I wonder how many will vote for Bonds and Clemens.

Even Jeff Bagwell who has hall worthy number and is suppected of using PEDs(never proven though) didn't get in this year but I think he will.

In fact it's so bad Jeff Blair who writes for the Globe and Mail in Toronto has a hall vote and returned it empty voting for no one because of the steroids and suspicion of PEDs.

Palmerio is dirty. You can litterally see when he started doing it. Look at his teammates in Balt and Texas. He was totally juicing.

Bagwell has said some odd stuff lately and people are taking it as he did it too. Plus, he is half the size he used to be when he played. Both not good to voters.

[hoojib127]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Palmerio is dirty. You can litterally see when he started doing it. Look at his teammates in Balt and Texas. He was totally juicing.

I dunno -- you'd think a guy who's admitted to using Viagra would have no problem admitting to have taken anything else after that.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

I dunno -- you'd think a guy who's admitted to using Viagra would have no problem admitting to have taken anything else after that.

Nice

[Erroneous]

Thanks for the memories, Andy. I hope you change your mind and come back. Andy should make the Hall of Fame!

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Thanks for the memories, Andy. I hope you change your mind and come back. Andy should make the Hall of Fame!

Great pitcher I think he will it might take a few tries because of the win total but I think he belongs.

Yankees are in big trouble with that pitching staff after Sabbathia eek!!!!! Burnett was awful last year and Hughes was awful in the 2nd half of the year.

BTW I know its been a couple weeks but I loved the Vernon Wells deal to the Angels we got a decent OF in Juan Rivera and turned Napoli into a good reliever in Frank Francisco and saved 86 million as the Angels are payin all but 5 million I never thought we could get rid of that contract.

I will say Wells was a class act all the way and always loved him in Toronto great defensive player and good hitter and never complained the contact kind of was a stinger for us even he admitted he wasn't worth it during last year I like what Anthopolous is doing stock piling prospects and young players that may very well make us a really good team in a couple years.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Great pitcher I think he will it might take a few tries because of the win total but I think he belongs.

Yankees are in big trouble with that pitching staff after Sabbathia eek!!!!! Burnett was awful last year and Hughes was awful in the 2nd half of the year.

BTW I know its been a couple weeks but I loved the Vernon Wells deal to the Angels we got a decent OF in Juan Rivera and turned Napoli into a good reliever in Frank Francisco and saved 86 million as the Angels are payin all but 5 million I never thought we could get rid of that contract.

I will say Wells was a class act all the way and always loved him in Toronto great defensive player and good hitter and never complained the contact kind of was a stinger for us even he admitted he wasn't worth it during last year I like what Anthopolous is doing stock piling prospects and young players that may very well make us a really good team in a couple years.

We shall see. There was nothing wrong with Burnett's arm. If he gets his head right...... 17 wins easy. Hughes is young. I think he will continue to grow into a very good pitcher. Price sucked in the playoffs. He is young too. Pitchers grow. They also have a few vets they are going to try out (all will most likely fail) and a few very young pitchers. Will mostly likely make a trade for an arm or two. It will be nice to have a season like this.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

We shall see. There was nothing wrong with Burnett's arm. If he gets his head right...... 17 wins easy. Hughes is young. I think he will continue to grow into a very good pitcher. Price sucked in the playoffs. He is young too. Pitchers grow. They also have a few vets they are going to try out (all will most likely fail) and a few very young pitchers. Will mostly likely make a trade for an arm or two. It will be nice to have a season like this.

17 wins is a huge if considering his history he has the huge contract so he can perform however he likes he dosen't have the motivation of a contract year

Also on the Pettitte hall argument I think he has a decent chance the things that work against him is he never won a Cy Young, his ERA is pretty high its close to 4 which considering those in the hall and trying to get in and then there's of course the PED connection.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

17 wins is a huge if considering his history he has the huge contract so he can perform however he likes he dosen't have the motivation of a contract year

Also on the Pettitte hall argument I think he has a decent chance the things that work against him is he never won a Cy Young, his ERA is pretty high its close to 4 which considering those in the hall and trying to get in and then there's of course the PED connection.

He will not get in on the first try, but maybe. Depends on how history thinks of him in a few years and who else is on the ballet. He did play and succeed while playing most of his career in the hardest division during the roid era. Has to count for something.

Plus, if Bert Blyleven gets in, so shoudl Mussina and Pettitte and Jack Morris for fucks sakes. Jack is Hall of Fame!

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

He will not get in on the first try, but maybe. Depends on how history thinks of him in a few years and who else is on the ballet. He did play and succeed while playing most of his career in the hardest division during the roid era. Has to count for something.

Plus, if Bert Blyleven gets in, so shoudl Mussina and Pettitte and Jack Morris for fucks sakes. Jack is Hall of Fame!

Agree on Mussina and definatley agree on Morris. Mussina's win total is really high 270 I believe so that has to count for something even if he didn't win a Cy Young award.

Morris a lot of writers are down on his overall ERA numbers and his supposed attitute during his career to reporters which some of them are on the balloting for the hall of fame. I think he belongs I just see it in about 7-8 years when no one starts getting in when no one votes on anybody that did steroids or is suppected or taking steroids or any PED

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Agree on Mussina and definatley agree on Morris. Mussina's win total is really high 270 I believe so that has to count for something even if he didn't win a Cy Young award.

Morris a lot of writers are down on his overall ERA numbers and his supposed attitute during his career to reporters which some of them are on the balloting for the hall of fame. I think he belongs I just see it in about 7-8 years when no one starts getting in when no one votes on anybody that did steroids or is suppected or taking steroids or any PED

Mussina will get in after several tries. He did succeed during the roids era in the hardest division in baseball. That has to count for something. Hope he goes in with an O's hat though.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Mussina will get in after several tries. He did succeed during the roids era in the hardest division in baseball. That has to count for something. Hope he goes in with an O's hat though.

If he gets in(I think he does personally it might take about 5-10 tries) it will be an O's hat the best years of his career were with them and he played for them longer

[Erroneous]

CC having a great season and opting out would be a great thing for the Yankees. Let someone else sign him and suffer at the end of the contract. I love CC, but he has including this one 4 years left tops. Then a hard crash down. The contract he has now is perfect. Any longer and it is the Lee contract and I did not like that one either. This is the post roid era. After 35 is a toss up on the down side of career not the career years it was just a few juiced years ago. 35 is the new 40. 40 is the new 50. 32 is the new 35.

[hoojib127]

Can't blame him -- I mean, who can live comfortably on merely $23 million a year?

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

Can't blame him -- I mean, who can live comfortably on merely $23 million a year?

No offense, but comments like this annoy me. Put yourself in his position. You are going to to the same exact thing and maximize your earning potential. That is exactly why I love The Herd on ESPNradio. He always puts things into normal life situations. It is not the point that $23 mil is not enough. The point is if you can get $25 or more years, you do it.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

No offense, but comments like this annoy me. Put yourself in his position. You are going to to the same exact thing and maximize your earning potential. That is exactly why I love The Herd on ESPNradio. He always puts things into normal life situations. It is not the point that $23 mil is not enough. The point is if you can get $25 or more years, you do it.

If its a Scott Boras agent of course the player will do it every one of his agents do that and I'm not sure if Bora represents him. The thing is he could do it and know the Yankees with their rotation right now desperately need him and meet whatever price he can get.

[hoojib127]

See, I've never understood this mandate that if you're among the best at what you do, you HAVE to make more than any of your peers no questions asked. You're already financially set for life at least twice over, so what the fuck do you care about what other guys are making if you're already at the top? Unless you have a serious gambling and/or spending problem, his trying to go for any more booty at this point can only be about ego and nothing else. : ?

[horrorfreak13]

Adam Wainwright done for the year. Wow and with Pujols maybe leaving next year it really sucks to be the Cardinals doesn't it?

[ericdraven]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Adam Wainwright done for the year. Wow and with Pujols maybe leaving next year it really sucks to be the Cardinals doesn't it?

Yeah. Your onlly good pitcher is that Carpetner fella.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

See, I've never understood this mandate that if you're among the best at what you do, you HAVE to make more than any of your peers no questions asked. You're already financially set for life at least twice over, so what the fuck do you care about what other guys are making if you're already at the top? Unless you have a serious gambling and/or spending problem, his trying to go for any more booty at this point can only be about ego and nothing else. : ?

Sometimes there is a lot of pressure put on by your union to take a bigger contract. Theys ay it is good for the game (players).

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by ericdraven

Yeah. Your onlly good pitcher is that Carpetner fella.

They seems to be able to make great pitchers out of crap. They should try to pick up the Met's Perez on the cheap.

[hoojib127]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Sometimes there is a lot of pressure put on by your union to take a bigger contract. They say it is good for the game (players).

Yeah, so that mediocrities like the Cubs' Carlos Silva can somehow make $10 million a year or more.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

They seems to be able to make great pitchers out of crap. They should try to pick up the Met's Perez on the cheap.

A pitcher that hasn't pitched past the 6th inning in like what 3 years I doubt that.

That injury I think that makes the Brewers the favourites now. Their top 2 Grienke and Marcum could do some real damage this year. I really like Marcum this year there he could really have a great season pitching in the NL he had really solid number this year pitching against the AL East.

[Erroneous]

I really did not want Cliff Lee to sign with my Yankees. Today he said the Rangers were his second choice, because he thinks the Yankees are too old.

Paging Mr Lee. The team you are on now is older than the Yankees. The Phillies are the oldest team in the game. True they will shed some age when they a couple contracts are up, but so will the Yankees. The Yankees have a younger outfield and younger bullpen. The Yankees are pretty young less for Posade (last year), ARod, Jeter and Rivera (all hall of famers). AJ is 34 and that is basically it. The rest of the team is under 32 with a lot of young talent coming up. In two or three years, he will be an old man on an old team stuck with the long contract he signed, Howard and Utley signed and Doc too.

Be quiet Mr Lee and try to win a World Series this year now that all the pressure is on the Phillies.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/rosters...age/order/true

[Bourne101]

So the season has finally started. There were some solid games yesterday. Who is everyone predicting to win each division?

AL East- Boston
AL Central- Chicago
AL West- Texas
AL Wild Card- New York
NL East- Philadelphia
NL Central- Cincinnati
NL West- San Francisco
NL Wildcard- Atlanta

Boston seems like the team to beat in the AL East. However, all biases aside, the Yankees bullpen is fucking sick. They may have overpaid for Soriano, but that doesn't take away from that fact that their bullpen is outstanding. The bottom of their order is Posada, Granderson and Martin... not too shabby. Their rotation is clearly their biggest problem, but we'll see how that works out. CC and Hughes are gonna give you 18+ wins, Burnett looked like a whole new pitcher in Spring Training, and Nova is a hell of a young pitcher. The one I'm most worried about is Garcia.

Boston's definitely going to be tough. Their line-up is nuts, and while their rotation has a few iffy spots, it's certainly solid and if everyone stays healthy it will be one of the best in baseball. Texas lost a great pitcher in Lee, but before they got him last year they were still on pace to take the division. I don't see anyone topping them in the West this season.

I'm not overly familiar with the AL Central, but I've been hearing good things about Chicago. Minnesota will be solid as always. Philly is the easy choice in the NL East, but watch out for Atlanta.

[AspectRatio1986]

My beloved Phillies had an exciting opener today...I'm really bummed that Utley is gonna be out for awhile, he's by far my favorite player in the league.

[hoojib127]

So long, Manny... don't let the syringe poke you on the way out.

[countchocula]

"That's just Manny being Manny!" = "Man, that guy's a prick!"

[John@$$]

1-7


Early in the season but this still doesn't look good for my Sox.

[adamjohnson]

Originally Posted by John@$$

1-7


Early in the season but this still doesn't look good for my Sox.

7-1

Looks pretty good for my Rangers.

[hoojib127]

Originally Posted by John@$$

1-7


Early in the season but this still doesn't look good for my Sox.

It's looking like the '08 Tigers all over again. No sports team can live up to that amount of hype.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by John@$$

1-7


Early in the season but this still doesn't look good for my Sox.

losing 16-5 last night WOW!!!!!!! unreal Texas looks really good to start the year too.

[Erroneous]

Mets lol WOW!

Cleveland WOW 13-5

Philly 11-6 Hmmmm

NL Central HMMMM HMMM


Rockies 13-5 starting how they usually finish

Boston 6-11 good stay bad please

[Erroneous]

Yankee fan here. Yanks have lost 6 straight to this day. They should have won today against Tampa, if the dumbass manager would learn to pull Burnette before he imploids and gives up the lead. What a dumbass! We needed a win in the worst way and he threw it away, by not bringing out the hook in time.

[silentasylum]

I got my ticket

A's vs. Yankees on Memorial Day

1:05pm