Boxing anyone?

[Brando @$$ Fat]

I think a Bradley win could be very good for boxing. He'll probably never be the name that Pacquiao is, but these passing of the torch fights are absolutely essential to the health of the sport. I guess we'll see if Bradley joins Andre Ward in the next wave of great American fighters, or ends up more like Andre Berto.

By the way, is anyone else getting sick of 24/7? The first two episodes of Pacquiao-Bradley have been atrocious. The first episode was all Pacquiao's camp making lame excuses for why he looked bad against Marquez and how he would've done better had he been a better Christian. (Bullshit, Pacquiao could be the pope and Marquez would still give him style problems). The second episode was more of the same and even more boring.

[Derrida]

Originally Posted by Brando @$$ Fat

Bullshit, Pacquiao could be the pope and Marquez would still give him style problems

LOL

[Derrida]

Bute on the Froch fight:

"Every athlete has to admit defeat. Great champions need to know to lose. I have to learn from this defeat. This is not the end of the world. I don't think that its the end of my career. I need to relax, [the loss] was a great mental load. I need time for my return. On Saturday night, Carl Froch was better," Bute said to the Money Channel.

"Any great athlete must have dignity, to be able to congratulate your opponent. I was the favorite and everyone thought I would win easily. We all thought that, even me. Unfortunately, you saw what happened there. I believe that in five rounds I boxed in only one, for about three minutes. I was totally dominated. After the first round, I was very sure of myself. I told my coach that [ he was] slow. But things changed in the second round."

"I do not necessarily want the belt back, I want to beat Carl Froch. I want a rematch, even if there will be no belt at stake."

http://www.boxingscene.com/bute-i-th...-better--53461

Bute is one classy guy, I've got tons for respect for him for being honest. Can't wait to see him back in the ring.

[Darth Kenshin]

Love Bute's reaction (saw parts of the fight online, and he was absolutely crushed). Much respect to him. Kind of similar to Froch's reaction to losing to Ward: no excuses, respect to the other opponent, see it as a chance to improve yourself (I think Froch mentioned he needed to become a better interior fighter to beat someone like Ward). Class acts all around.

As for Bradley/Pacquiao, I love 24/7. This particular entry hasn't been all that exciting, but I think I'd watch 24/7 anything. I just love the idea. But yeah, these guys aren't all that interesting. Although the dysfunction of the Mayweather family gets old, I always found it entertaining. I like to learn more about the unknown fighters (like Ortiz, Cotto, and now Bradley) but honestly, the De La Hoya/Mayweather one was the best, and they won't top it unless there's a Mayweather/Pacquiao fight.

In terms of who's going to win, I think Pacquiao wins pretty easily. I just don't think Bradley has the kind of power to keep Pacquiao honest. Manny will relentlessly pursue him, and yeah he'll get caught a couple times (not sure if Manny fought a guy as slick as Bradley before) but ultimately, unless your counters can stop Manny from coming in, he's going to catch you. I think Manny knocks him out, to be honest.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

I agree Darth in that I'm picking Manny to win. I think the judges will be more impressed by him than Bradley, who doesn't hit hard enough and looks a little zany at times. However, I think he's mentally tougher than anyone Pacquiao has fought in recent years, with the exception of Marquez. Dude has the right mentality for a top level fighter.

Three years ago I think Manny would've destroyed him. Bradley's style reminds me of Hatton's, in that he's always looking to come in and destroy with little fear of the consequences. We all know how that fight turned out. While Manny can still punch, I don't think he has that one punch knockout power anymore.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

That was a lousy decision. Was it because Bradley threw more? Pacquiao has benefitted from gift decisions before, but none of those were as bad as this "loss" tonight. I thought he won 8 rounds, and that was generous. He didn't beat Bradley because of all that born-again crap, he's just clearly a better fighter.

HOWEVER, I thought the broadcast WAY overcalled it for Pacquiao. Also, I put no faith in Compubox numbers because it's such a technologically crude system. (Basically, it's guys behind a keyboard physically counting the punches that land. It's horseshit). Bradley landed a lot of small punches and I think some of Pacquiao's punches may have been incorrectly scored as landing blows. Still, that was a lousy decision and we've had way too many of those this year.

[fixedMind]

The death-throws of a necrotic sport. DEAD TO ME.

[Derrida]

Good to see Manny is still champion... wait what? FUCKING BRADLEY WON?!

I had it 9 rounds to 3 in favour of Pacquiao (and I'm being generous to Bradley). What fucking fight were the judges watching? I mean if they were watching a replay of Pacquiao-Marquez III then I would have agreed with the outcome. But Bradley? How do you take the title off the champ when you haven't beaten the champ?

The most telling part - Bradley's post-fight interview with Kellerman. Even Bradley said he would have to go back and watch a tape of the fight just to see he won. The winner doesn't feel like he won...

I'm racking my brain to come up with an answer how the judges got it so wrong. Were they as some cynics suggest paid off by Arum so he could keep Manny fighting in-house fighters only (and avoid a possible Mayweather confrontation)? I know Arum can be devious but would he be this blatant?

Once again boxing has to suffer in the hands of corrupt and/or incompetent officials...

[SS-Block]

The sport needs to be cleaned decades ago. The Arums and Don Kings of this world, the "inept" refs and officials needs, all need to get the fuck out.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by fixedMind

The death-throws of a necrotic sport. DEAD TO ME.

I still love it.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Derrida

I'm racking my brain to come up with an answer how the judges got it so wrong. Were they as some cynics suggest paid off by Arum so he could keep Manny fighting in-house fighters only (and avoid a possible Mayweather confrontation)? I know Arum can be devious but would he be this blatant?

Once again boxing has to suffer in the hands of corrupt and/or incompetent officials...

That's the baffling part to me as well. Corruption seems highly unlikely because Pacquiao was the one who got robbed, and he's the superstar. Usually it's the more connected fighter who gets the gift. Bradley is basically unknown outside of hardcore circles. I don't think Arum would personally sabotage his favorite moneymaker, either. I've never seen a fight ringside, so I don't know if it's hard sometimes to see the action or what. I think the more likely explanation is that the judges who aren't corrupt/politically connected are just wholly unqualified. I mean, who aspires to become a professional boxing judge? That's setting the bar really low for oneself.

On a separate note, that was a really impressive performance by Pac. Probably his best since Cotto. He looks faded at this point and nothing like the guy he was three years ago, but his timing and technique were excellent. Marquez and Floyd are the only guys in the world capable of beating him at this point.

[Darth Kenshin]

Originally Posted by Derrida

Good to see Manny is still champion... wait what? FUCKING BRADLEY WON?!

I was watching this at a Buffalo Wild Wings with a couple of friends. Place was packed. Everyone there thought Pacquiao destroyed him. I even had the following conversation with someone near me:

Me: I don't know if the $8 million is worth this kind of beating
Other Guy: Well, it's more like $4 million, once his wife takes half after divorcing him for embarrassing the family

When the scores were announced, the place went nuts. Pretty sure people were throwing things at the tv.

Originally Posted by Derrida

How do you take the title off the champ when you haven't beaten the champ?

That's what confuses me the most. They say to take a championship, you have to BEAT the champ. Bradley certainly did not do that.

Originally Posted by Derrida

The most telling part - Bradley's post-fight interview with Kellerman. Even Bradley said he would have to go back and watch a tape of the fight just to see he won. The winner doesn't feel like he won...

I thought the most telling part was watching Bradley's wife. She looked like her kids were about to grow up without a father. She was terrified, and for good reason.

Originally Posted by Derrida

I'm racking my brain to come up with an answer how the judges got it so wrong. Were they as some cynics suggest paid off by Arum so he could keep Manny fighting in-house fighters only (and avoid a possible Mayweather confrontation)? I know Arum can be devious but would he be this blatant?

I wouldn't put it past him. He even said after the fight that they're (Top Rank) going to make a ton of money on the rematch. It's a joke.

Honestly, this is the worst judges' scorecards I've seen in professional boxing. There have been more controversial outcomes, but normally coming from referees. I had it 10-2 Pacquiao.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

What I hate most about the controversy over this decision is that it gives idiots who don't watch boxing an excuse to continually attack it. Fans who don't watch guys like Froch, Ward, Donaire, Martinez, etc, will continue to say that boxing is dead when in reality we have great fights all the time. The sanctioning bodies are shit, the state commissions are shit, and the judges are shit, but the fighters themselves are fucking badasses. Mayweather-Pacquiao didn't happen? Oh well. We also had Salido-Lopez, Froch-Bute, Khan-Peterson, and other great fights over the last six months. ESPN isn't talking about that because those guys are too obsessed over how Peyton Manning looks in fucking PRACTICE.

I know I'm a hardcore fan and that separates me from a lot of people, but I'm sick of people who don't have access to the sport continuously bitching about its demise. People will occasionally watch boxing to feel masculine, but they don't get it the way real fans do. Stay away from boxing if you don't understand it. I don't watch baseball but I didn't bitch about it when guys were on steroids. Shut the fuck up about boxing if you only expose yourself to its weak points.

[SS-Block]

Its not that there aren't good fighters and fights, but for some/most boxing is a gambling sport. One or two high profile clear wrong decisions make all events in the sport too untrustworthy to bet on. I think this is the source for the anger and why people say the sport is dead to them.

[Darth Kenshin]

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/120620...y-rematch.html

[Darth Kenshin]

Originally Posted by Brando @$$ Fat

Mayweather-Pacquiao didn't happen? Oh well. We also had Salido-Lopez, Froch-Bute, Khan-Peterson, and other great fights over the last six months. ESPN isn't talking about that because those guys are too obsessed over how Peyton Manning looks in fucking PRACTICE.

Couple things about that. First off, that's kind of the issue. Whenever boxing gains some momentum, something like this happens and completely derails it. I got a few of my friends into the sport because of the Super Six. Then they watch something like this, and it just enrages them.

Secondly, until boxing gets more exposure, ESPN won't care about it. The sport alientated its fanbase (need at least HBO and Showtime to watch anything decent, with the real big guns on PPV) entirely. And that's another issue with the outrage. People are paying $70 to watch this on PPV just to see a BS decision? It's kind of upsetting.

Bottom line is, nowadays, with all the media exposure and the 24/7 sports world, sports in general have become much more star-based. Pacquiao, you can argue, was the biggest name in boxing. It's a big deal when he loses. It's like that in other sports, too. NBA Finals ratings are better when there is a superstar playing. Why? Because casual fans care about superstars. So casual fans care about Pacquiao and they may not care about Carl Froch, just like a casual NBA fan will tune in to the finals to watch Lebron vs. Durant but might not have if it were Duncan vs. KG.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Those are all fine points, but I'm just sick of people who don't know anything about the sport giving me an earful for still liking it. The casual sports media basically insults the intelligence of every real boxing fan by constantly questioning its status as a real sport, using examples like Pacquiao-Bradley as proof that it's on the decline and it doesn't matter anymore. It's like Homer Simpson giving a lecture to a real nuclear safety inspector.

[jaw2929]

Brando, I can clearly see you're passionate about Boxing and that's cool. But like Darth was saying, why would someone wanna pay $70 for a Boxing PPV only to witness a horse-shit fixed decision like the Pac/Bradley one? Shit, all of those people that say wrestling fake & fixed? Well looks like Boxing is too (unfortunately). And I WANTED to be a new fan and get into the lesser known fighters. But I would've been so fucking PISSED if I plunked down that amount of money to see the PPV only to see a blatantly WRONG decision be rendered like that.

I think it's great you like the sport and don't misinterpret this as me "giving you shit" for liking it. But if shit is fixed like that and stupid decisions by judges are going to continue to be made... Well I might as just solely focus on the WWE, because at least they ADMIT that it's pre-determined and I'm under no false illusions.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by jaw2929

I think it's great you like the sport and don't misinterpret this as me "giving you shit" for liking it. But if shit is fixed like that and stupid decisions by judges are going to continue to be made... Well I might as just solely focus on the WWE, because at least they ADMIT that it's pre-determined and I'm under no false illusions.

My problem isn't with you. We're cool. My problem is with people like Mike Wilbon and Tony Kornheiser and all the idiot talking heads who say we shouldn't care about boxing because it's not as relevant as Andrew Luck's combine performance. My problem is with people who never cover the sport, know nothing about it, and act like they're Bert Sugar.

Oh, and I don't regret the money I paid for the PPV. I fucking hate PPV and wish it would die, but I've been able to use my very limited income wisely enough to ensure that I can catch the fights I want to see. Some people aren't fortunate enough to do that, and I'm grateful. We got to see a couple of cool knockouts on the undercards, but of course nobody is going to report THAT.

[Darth Kenshin]

Originally Posted by Brando @$$ Fat

My problem isn't with you. We're cool. My problem is with people like Mike Wilbon and Tony Kornheiser and all the idiot talking heads who say we shouldn't care about boxing because it's not as relevant as Andrew Luck's combine performance. My problem is with people who never cover the sport, know nothing about it, and act like they're Bert Sugar.

Wilbon and Kornheiser host one of ESPN's most popular shows. They're not going to talk about boxing unless it involves Pacquiao or Mayweather because the casual sports fan who watches PTI doesn't give a crap about Andre Ward. And don't lump Kornheiser in with Wilbon. Kornheiser admits when his knowledge is limited and often defers to other people's opinions in matters he doesn't truly grasp. Wilbon, however... well, let's just say I agree with you on him.

And now, there is going to be a probe into the Bradley fight. Honestly, now that I've thought about it, this kind of controversy might be just the thing needed to get a Mayweather/Pacquiao fight. Let's just say the ruling isn't overturned. Now, the only remaining hang up (the 50/50 split) is no longer an issue, because Pacquiao's name has lost some luster. But if Pacquiao destroys Bradley in the rematch, even though he can't demand 50% of the purse any more, people's interest in the fight will come back strong and we could see it next May. Yes, I'm stubborn. In case you didn't notice, I REALLY want this fight to happen.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Darth Kenshin

Wilbon and Kornheiser host one of ESPN's most popular shows. They're not going to talk about boxing unless it involves Pacquiao or Mayweather because the casual sports fan who watches PTI doesn't give a crap about Andre Ward. And don't lump Kornheiser in with Wilbon. Kornheiser admits when his knowledge is limited and often defers to other people's opinions in matters he doesn't truly grasp. Wilbon, however... well, let's just say I agree with you on him.

Kornheiser usually does defer to the experts but he has said some totally uneducated things about boxing. I used to watch that show, but I'm the kind of person who likes expert opinions and facts even on the sports I like.

You're totally missing my point. They don't HAVE to cover the Super Six or who the top bantamweights are. When you only cover Mayweather and Pacquiao, who fight three times a year combined, you aren't entitled to call boxing a dead sport when something fucked happens. Period. Boxing is in the weird position where all information and journalism is being pushed to these extreme niche outlets. It really hurts the sport when the only people in the mainstream who are willing to cover it are totally ignorant of what actually happens and only want to say bad things about it. Is a lot of that self-inflicted? Absolutely. But it's infuriating that 99.999% of boxing fans know more about boxing than the media figures who are willing to express a half-assed opinion anyway.

Tennis has also fallen out of favor with the mainstream, but do you see people saying it's a useless dead sport? No. In fact, the talk shows never mention tennis because it's an unpopular sport that also has its shit together. They can't praise it, but they can't blast it, so they ignore it altogether.

[Darth Kenshin]

Originally Posted by Brando @$$ Fat

You're totally missing my point. They don't HAVE to cover the Super Six or who the top bantamweights are. When you only cover Mayweather and Pacquiao, who fight three times a year combined, you aren't entitled to call boxing a dead sport when something fucked happens. Period.r.

I know what you're saying, but you're missing my point. When they call boxing a "dead sport" they don't mean no one watches, or should watch, boxing. They're talking in terms of mainstream audience. Bottom line is, casual fans pay attention to Pacquiao fights, they see something like this happen, and it completely turns them off. In that regard, the talking heads are right. They don't have to know about boxing to have that type of common sense.

Obviously, die hard boxing fans will continue to watch the sport. But boxing will never capture a truly mainstream audience if all (or at least most) of it's prominent events are riddled with controversy.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Darth Kenshin

I know what you're saying, but you're missing my point. When they call boxing a "dead sport" they don't mean no one watches, or should watch, boxing. They're talking in terms of mainstream audience. Bottom line is, casual fans pay attention to Pacquiao fights, they see something like this happen, and it completely turns them off. In that regard, the talking heads are right. They don't have to know about boxing to have that type of common sense.

Obviously, die hard boxing fans will continue to watch the sport. But boxing will never capture a truly mainstream audience if all (or at least most) of it's prominent events are riddled with controversy.

I still think it's an unfair criticism. Forget some of the awful decisions and controversies that casual fans haven't been exposed to, how much in-ring controversy has there been in the careers of Pacquiao and Mayweather? They've both been more or less dominant to the point that judges don't really matter. You can count the three Marquez fights, but those were legitimately debatable decisions that maybe SHOULD have gone to him but didn't. You can count Mayweather's KO of Ortiz, but that was more of a bizarre circumstance. This is the first time one of them either robbed or got robbed. I don't think a casual media personality who only follows those two fighters has enough to blatantly declare "boxing is dead," unless said personality also happened to catch Williams-Lara or Diaz-Malignaggi, which is of course highly doubtful.

[Darth Kenshin]

Originally Posted by Brando @$$ Fat

I don't think a casual media personality who only follows those two fighters has enough to blatantly declare "boxing is dead," unless said personality also happened to catch Williams-Lara or Diaz-Malignaggi, which is of course highly doubtful.

My interpretation (and I could be wrong) of those statements is that they mean boxing is dead to the mainstream audience, which could be quite dramatic, but if you talked to a casual fan after the Mayweather-Ortiz fight or particularly the Pacquiao/Bradley fight, you could hear his/her disgust.

Anyway, Chavez/Lee tonight. As coddled as Chavez Jr. has been, I have to say I'm a big fan of his. Love the way he fights. He's always exciting, and has tremendous instincts. I don't know much about Lee, but I know he's much bigger than most of Chavez' tough opponents. Should be a solid fight. Plus, the prospect of Chavez/Martinez in the fall (if Chavez wins) is certainly tantalizing and apparently a real possibility now.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Darth Kenshin

Anyway, Chavez/Lee tonight. As coddled as Chavez Jr. has been, I have to say I'm a big fan of his. Love the way he fights. He's always exciting, and has tremendous instincts. I don't know much about Lee, but I know he's much bigger than most of Chavez' tough opponents. Should be a solid fight. Plus, the prospect of Chavez/Martinez in the fall (if Chavez wins) is certainly tantalizing and apparently a real possibility now.

Well, it's been a long, slow process, but I think I'm a believer in Chavez Jr. now, at least as a top 2-3 middleweight. (Lee is a good fighter but WAY too easy to hit, so I won't go crazy). I don't think Chavez Jr. is quick enough to beat Martinez, but it won't be an easy fight. He's a hard kid.

Boxing certainly won't be dead if the son of a beloved legend can continue fighting at a really high level!

[Darth Kenshin]

Solid performance from Chavez Jr. last night. Gotta say, I was impressed by how big the guy looks even fighting Andy Lee, who is a pretty big middleweight in his own right. I think Chavez can give Sergio Martinez quite a run for his money just because of the size disparity. I can see it being similar to the Ricky Hatton/Kosta Tszyu fight, with Chavez just smothering Martinez' power punches, bludgeoning him over the course of 8 rounds, and taking control of the fight at the end. Only difference is there's no way Martinez would quit. And, of course, Martinez has quite the speed advantage. However, even with a speed advantage, sometimes bigger guys are still able to impose their will on a fight (like Cotto did to Mayweather).

I think Chavez would beat pretty much any other middleweight fairly easily, and the previous discussion about a Chavez/Alvarez epic Mexican showdown is pointless because Chavez would crush the kid. He has to fight Martinez, and he has the potential to be the kind of crossover star boxing really needs since Floyd and Pacquiao, as great as they still are, are way past their primes (I still argue Floyd peaked at 135 and Pacquiao peaked at 122).

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Hatton-Tszyu is a really interesting comparison. There are a lot of similarities there. Martinez is getting up there in years and looked vulnerable in his last two fights against average guys. Could he suddenly show his age mid-fight the way Tszyu did against Hatton? Like Hatton, Chavez Jr. is a guy with not a lot of skill, but a lot of toughness and heart. Chavez Jr. might be the guy who makes Martinez look old. If not him, then maybe Peter Quillin, who I also think fits well in the middleweight picture.

My biggest concern for Chavez Jr. isn't that he'll lose to Martinez, but that he won't be able to make 160 anymore. Maybe he'll stay at 160 a little longer if he stays disciplined, but he's a young man and at some point he'll have to move up to 168, which is basically a lion's den. He won't be able to overpower those guys the way he did Andy Lee and Peter Manfredo.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Victor Ortiz is finished. I find it hard not to empathize for the guy, despite his past shenanigans. His career as a meaningful fighter is over now.

Josesito Lopez isn't anything amazing, but I really dig how the guy fights. He's going to be a pain in the ass for anyone not on the top of their game.

[Darth Kenshin]

I honestly never heard of Josesito Lopez.

I feel bad for Victor, as a fight with Alvarez would've made him a lot of money and would've been great for fans. Plus, it's the kind of fight Ortiz would look good in: a slugfest, as opposed to being outclassed and frustrated by someone like Mayweather.

I don't want to rule Victor out yet. He can go the Zab Judah route and keep popping up, and since he's young, maybe he can get meaningful fights down the road. I love his style and hate that he had to quit like this (there will be more stigma attached to him quitting than any other fighter, given his history).

As for Lopez... he fought a pretty solid fight. Kept coming, and took some monster shots from a guy I thought could be the strongest in the welterweight division. That kind of tenacity will make him a tough opponent for any one, but I'm not sure where he goes from here. Ortiz has a rematch clause, so I guess that'll be the next step, assuming Ortiz wants to exercise it.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

http://espn.go.com/boxing/story/_/id...-lopez-rematch

Apparently Ortiz is going for the rematch. I'm not sure how I feel about that. On the one hand, he appeared to have the upper hand in that fight before he quit and I still might pick him to win a rematch barring anything flukey. But who the fuck knows with Victor Ortiz? I'll continue to watch his fights because the outcomes are just so wild and unpredictable.

Will we ever see Ortiz-Berto II? Think about it: had Berto not tested positive, we might be talking about making the third fight of a great trilogy instead of the possible end of Ortiz' career.

[Darth Kenshin]

So Alvarez agreed to fight Lopez September 15. Makes sense, since he beat Ortiz, but I'm surprised that they didn't change the date now that a lesser-named opponent is involved. Same night as Chavez/Martinez seems like bad business, especially since most Mexicans (at least I assume) would rather watch Chavez take on the lineal champion than watch Alvarez, as much as they love him, fight a nobody.

I wonder if that means Ortiz will change his mind about the rematch. If Alvarez beats Lopez, does Ortiz even care enough to fight him again?

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Darth Kenshin

So Alvarez agreed to fight Lopez September 15. Makes sense, since he beat Ortiz, but I'm surprised that they didn't change the date now that a lesser-named opponent is involved. Same night as Chavez/Martinez seems like bad business, especially since most Mexicans (at least I assume) would rather watch Chavez take on the lineal champion than watch Alvarez, as much as they love him, fight a nobody.

Agreed. I wouldn't call Lopez a "nobody" in terms of his fighting ability, but as far as name recognition goes, his is non-existent. I actually think Alvarez-Lopez will be a really competitive and fun fight, but Chavez Jr.-Martinez has a powerful backstory and real high-stakes drama. The son of the greatest Mexican fighter ever trying to step out of his father's footsteps against a dangerous and feared middleweight champion. This kind of thing simply doesn't happen very often. These are two A-side guys and Josesito Lopez, despite being a very live underdog, is the definition of a B-side.

This petty squabbling over a Mexican holiday weekend is really pitiful and makes the sport look bad. Just when it seems like boxing might have a major crossover event not involving Pacquiao or Mayweather, it seems more likely that we'll get something diluted and compromised. Whatever. I'll just DVR Alvarez-Lopez and buy Chavez Jr.-Martinez.

[Darth Kenshin]

Couple things going on in the boxing world:

1. Another W for Klitschko. I gotta say, even though I don't think he's an all-time great, his reign is certainly going to rank with the best. Also, physically speaking, he's just tremendous. I've never seen a big heavyweight as quick and athletic as he is. He's a marvel to watch. I don't know who's going to give him a good fight, but I love watching him.

2. Nonito Donaire might be the most talented fighter in the world, but every time I watch him, he looks bored. He stalks for huge knockout punches. Then, when this fight against Mathebula felt like it was getting close (the judges never felt it was close apparently, but Donaire's corner did), they told him to start boxing. That was 11th round. He threw a beautiful combination, broke Mathebula's tooth, and dominated the last two rounds. I want more boxing from Donaire. I know in those lighter weight classes, people tune in for action. Bantamweights will never have the recognition of great welterweights or middleweights. Just look at Pacquiao, who peaked as a fighter in lower weight classes, but didn't become a huge name until beating Oscar. So I understand Donaire wants to look good to generate interest. But sometimes he takes it too far (almost to a level of Naseem Hamed). When it comes to boxing ability, he could be the 3rd best fighter in the world behind Floyd and Ward.

3. I think I've mentiond this before, but kudos to Floyd Mayweather for his insistence on improved drug testing. I know it looked like an excuse to not fight Manny, but with all the recent bouts being cancelled due to PED usage, I'm happy he brought it up. I don't think I ever realized how many boxers were juicing.

4. I love Kelly Pavlik. I really do. But I don't see him becoming a serious contender again. I don't think he can make 160 any more, and 168 is just so stacked that I feel any top contender would waste him. It's too bad, because he's fun to watch and has a lot of heart.

5. After going back and forth on this, I really want Pacquiao to fight the Bradley rematch, even though he was robbed, instead of Marquez again. Best case scenario for boxing: Pacquiao beats Bradley convincingly in November, Mayweather takes an easy bout in December, then the two face each other in May. Could be possible, as the loss to Bradley (as BS as it was) really hurt Pacquiao's leverage in negotiations. Maybe now he takes the fight for $40 million.

6. As much as boxing gets crapped on for lousy matchmaking and controversial outcomes to major fights, I'm extemely excited for Martinez/Chavez and Ward/Dawson. I think Chavez (with his looks and heritage) and Ward (with his technique) could carry the sport in the future. Down the road, a possible showdown between those guys could be the biggest fight in the world.

7. Seriously, Golden Boy, get off that September 15th date for Alvarez. He's another guy who can be a huge star. Don't hurt the sport by putting two of the best rising stars (in terms of popularity) in different fights on the same night. And I'm sick of the back-and-forth between Chavez and Alvarez for Mexican supremacy. I don't see them fighting any time soon (Chavez just looks too big) so just shut up.

8. Speaking of back-and-forth, it's weird to see Sergio Martinez taking so many blatant shots at Chavez. I mean, telling Chavez Sr. to take a picture of his son's face because he won't be recognizable after the fight? Wow. Personally, I think Martinez is jealous. He's a great boxer and a good looking guy, but never attained cross-over appeal and really needs the Chavez fight to become more popular. Meanwhile, Chavez was a huge star before he accomplished anything. I can't wait for this fight. I might be more excited for it than Ward/Dawson.

9. Froch and Bute will fight their rematch after interim bouts. I finally saw the fight. Froch is one of my favorite fighters. Bute looked incredibly stiff, but I like his attitude after the loss. I think the next fight will be quite the brawl.

10. Kind of unrelated, but I find it funny how the media handles Manny Pacquiao. Yes, his loss to Bradley was controversial, but so many major outlets still have him ranked 2nd P4P. In past rankings, even after controversial decisions, the loss would bump someone down, and somewhere in the description it would be mentiond that the loss was nonsense. This is particularly true of Dan Rafael of espn. But the media treats Pacquiao with kid gloves. I wish they were more consistent.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Darth Kenshin

8. Speaking of back-and-forth, it's weird to see Sergio Martinez taking so many blatant shots at Chavez. I mean, telling Chavez Sr. to take a picture of his son's face because he won't be recognizable after the fight? Wow. Personally, I think Martinez is jealous. He's a great boxer and a good looking guy, but never attained cross-over appeal and really needs the Chavez fight to become more popular. Meanwhile, Chavez was a huge star before he accomplished anything. I can't wait for this fight. I might be more excited for it than Ward/Dawson.

There probably is a little jealousy on Martinez' part, and some of it is understandable. Like you said, he had to take the hard road while Junior has luxuries that aren't available to most fighters. Martinez was fed to Margarito before he was ready, while Junior's people gradually tested how high his ceiling was. Until the Rubio fight, he was going through the motions. However, I think something clicked for him during that Rubio fight. He realized that the more he imposed himself on his opponent, the more he could take the fight away from the center of the ring. Andy Lee tried really hard to keep the fight in the center of the ring, but Junior just kept overpowering him into the ropes. None of Martinez' recent opponents, with the exception of Williams in their first fight, have been able to do this to him, so maybe this will be Junior's calling card. That said, I think Martinez will be too much athlete for him. I have my fingers crossed, though. Mexican fighters are my favorites.

I'm really excited for Khan-Garcia tonight. Logic says that Khan will either win a decision or stop him late, but you never know with Khan. I thought he got ripped off against Peterson and deserved to win the fight, but he looked awful in those middle rounds. He doesn't always look impressive. He needs the right kind of style in front of him to look good, and from what I saw in his fight against Morales, Garcia's style is hard to characterize.

Also, not to get too far off topic, but does anyone else think it's odd that JuanMa is basically seen as a finished fighter, while Gamboa is destroying his career through inactivity and pulling out of big fights? Two years ago, this was the third biggest fight that wasn't being made in boxing, only behind Pac-Floyd and Wlad-Vitali. It seems like an afterthought now.

[Darth Kenshin]

I don't know what Gamboa is thinking or who is advising him, but he's blown a lot of opportunities. I don't know what's next for him or where he goes from here, and it's amazing how little I care, given his talent.

As for Lopez, he's another guy that was just exposed. I don't want to completely write him off, as he's only 29, but it's hard to teach an old dog new tricks. And it's also quite clear that he has some fundamental issues with his technique.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Does any elite fighter in boxing have a weaker chin than Amir Khan? He makes JuanMa Lopez look like Carl Froch.

[Darth Kenshin]

When I first saw the punch, I thought Khan would be fine. Seemed like a punch that just hit him in the right spot (any one who has boxed knows when you get jarred in the ear, your equilibrium gets screwed up) but I thought he'd get over it in between rounds.

Nope.

Not sure what to make of Khan. Incredible speed, fairly hard puncher, good instincts, but bottom line is he's a bit soft. I still think he'd give a lot of great fighters without huge punching power some trouble (like Tim Bradley) but the luster is certainly gone. He was once mentioned as an opponent for Mayweather down the road. Not gonna happen.

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Adrien Broner is a really good young fighter, but he has no business being cocky after failing to make weight. That's the least professional thing a fighter can do. That shit drives me nuts.

I'd never heard of Keith Thurman until tonight but I was really impressed. He made a tough Mexican fighter with a strong chin just go over to his corner and quit. Can't remember the last time I saw that.

[Dirtyfrog]

not a big fan of boxing but i admit i'll watch if its Lucian Bute or Jean Pascal. Both are locals and whenever they get in a fight , we have news coverage of that so it's hard to ignore

[Brando @$$ Fat]

Originally Posted by Dirtyfrog

not a big fan of boxing but i admit i'll watch if its Lucian Bute or Jean Pascal. Both are locals and whenever they get in a fight , we have news coverage of that so it's hard to ignore

That's cool. I really like Bute. He got annihilated by Froch but handled the defeat with a class and grace that you don't see often. I like Pascal now, which wasn't always the case, and hope he beats Cloud in his next fight.

Keep on the lookout for a guy named Adonis Stevenson. He's another Canadian on the way up. Massive puncher.