Sequester 2013 AKA Fiscal Cliff part 2

[Erroneous]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...t-matters?lite

This link above breaks it down pretty good.


$85 billion in cuts years until the year 2021. The federal government is going to spend about $3.8 trillion this year. That's 2%.

Is President Obama seriously telling me the United States is in serious trouble over 2%? Every office and department can't cut expenses by 2%?

Get real and stop wasting our time by trying to once again trying to scare the America people for no good reason.

[creekin111]

Mr. Obama bitched, moaned, and demanded a tax increase on the wealthiest for five years. He talked about the need to reduce the deficit as the justification for this tax increase. He talked about a balanced approach including this tax increase as well as spending increases. Well now he's gotten his tax increase, and it will bring the well over a trillion dollar deficits we've run throughout his presidency closer to a trillion. What's he going to do about the other $1 trillion?

A) cut spending
B) raise middle class taxes
C) admit that he could give a shit about the deficit, and he only wanted higher rates on the top bracket to satiate his leftist supporters?

What's this guy's plan?

I've heard the left bitch about the Tea Partiers, and they made excellent points. Demanding that we solve the problems by turning on a dime is crazy. The problem is that they refuse to admit the obvious - Obama has no answers. The Tea Partiers are advocating radical approaches. I can see how Obama's approach will play out:

Do nothing on spending. Increase taxes on the wealthy. Repeat over and over. When you finally have a) confiscatory taxes on the wealthy, b) a continuing deficit (are any of you aware that confiscating the wealth, not the income but the net worths, of the Forbes 400 would cover the annual Obama deficits for less tan a year and a half?), and c) an economy wrecked by disincentives to work, start increasing taxes on the middle class.

Oh and yes Obama is using fear tactics, but that's ok because he doesn't have an 'R' next to his name. Duh.

[Erroneous]

His plan is to blame Bush, the republicans and hurt everyone in the process all in an attempt to control both sides of Congress in 2014, so he can pass all kinds of laws and plans without any issue. It is nice after a couple weeks of bashing republicans and trying to scare the shit out of everyone, he is finally back in DC trying to workout a deal. It is also amazing how he is threatening everyone and anyone who opposed his opinion and plans. Years from now, Obama will be seen as the worst President ever and that is really something considering the second Bush.

I have never seen a President or party go out of their way to bash a news channel as a whole like they do just because they have a difference of opinion on issues. Every single republican person who steps to the front is immediately demonized and made out to be stupid. I have also never seen the media go almost totally silent and turn a blind eye to all that is going on. These are sad days for America and one day history will not be kind to all these people.

[Erroneous]

Obama created and signed into law all these cuts (sequester).
Then he waits until the last moment to address it.
He goes on the road to bash the republicans, blaming them when he should be in DC.
Now in order to make "fair cuts" he is saying he wants loopholes closed on the rich.
So if he doesn't get the more money (again) from the rich, he won't compromise?
Obama sounds like a 5 year old.

So what he did is think up cuts that hurts everyone and dares the republicans to allow them to come about all in order to get more money out of the rich and then blame the republicans. This is our President. Take no blame.

I guess the $600 billion he got from the rich was not enough. How long before NBC starts running "news" stories telling us how many people have been hurt. By Monday, I will bet they will be pretending the world is ending.

[Roy Batty]

Damn, Obama! He ruined this country for the last century with him forcing the United States in WWI and II, the Cold, Korean, and Vietnam Wars. And of course, the housing market crash.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

Damn, Obama! He ruined this country for the last century with him forcing the United States in WWI and II, the Cold, Korean, and Vietnam Wars. And of course, the housing market crash.

Are you saying nothing is his fault? Why not go back to the war of 1812 and Civil war as well. We had debt from those too.

[creekin111]

Damn, BUSH! He ruined this country for the last century with him forcing the United States in WWI and II, the Cold, Korean, and Vietnam Wars. And of course, the housing market crash.

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Are you saying nothing is his fault? Why not go back to the war of 1812 and Civil war as well. We had debt from those too.

No, I'm merely pointing out that every time something happens, it's a fault of Obama--according to you.

[creekin111]

And what I'd like to merely point out that any time someone blames Obama its never his fault--according to many on here. Yay this game is fun! Sorry couldn't help myself.

[creekin111]

So ANYWAY back to the topic at hand.

We need a budget. Enough of the BS where every few of months we get another doom scenario. Tells us how much you want to spend and on what, and tell us what you want to eliminate, who it will affect, how much it saves us, and show us some pretty charts since I hate reading 1,000 pages of crap. Man the fuck up on both sides and stop trying to make the other side look like shit.

There is no need for 100 job programs, environmental agencies, or whatever the hell there is. But the issue is jobs and that's the problem when you start a program. There really isn't a way to not cut billions of trillions of spending without getting rid of jobs which is political suicide. Its guaranteed there's going to be superfluous jobs/wages and waste. If a politician can't justify a social program they'll make up a reason out of thin air for it to exist just so they can save the jobs they create. Of course who cares who pays for it, we have "jobs"!

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

No, I'm merely pointing out that every time something happens, it's a fault of Obama--according to you.

LOL Well, he is the one in charge. When is the history of man does or did the person who is the leader or boss not get the credit good or bad? Obama never and I mean never takes any blame. He took plenty of credit for Bin Laden, but he called the squester dumb and blamed republicans. Obama signed this into law. He is the leader. He is the President. It is his fault. Comes with the territory. He should man up and blame himself for signing it.

Originally Posted by creekin111

And what I'd like to merely point out that any time someone blames Obama its never his fault--according to many on here. Yay this game is fun! Sorry couldn't help myself.

History will show how much fault he gets and it will be a lot.

Personally, I say we should impeach him for all the lies he told about this sequester. He, not any tv channel or news agency made many speeches saying how if the sequester was allowed to come about the USA would end. He was very clear. I can find the canned speech he told several dozen times all over the country. Now, he comes outs and says it is not doom and gloom or so bad after we are all fine come Monday. This is not how a leader leads. This is not how a President leads. No other President has done what he has done. It is sickening. It is also sickening how too many people in the media and liberals give him a pass. We don't grade on a curve here.

FYI His approval rating dropped from 51% to 45% in 3 days. Look for this to drop. That is huge. History will be unkind to the liberal media as well.

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by creekin111

And what I'd like to merely point out that any time someone blames Obama its never his fault--according to many on here. Yay this game is fun! Sorry couldn't help myself.

Originally Posted by Erroneous

LOL Well, he is the one in charge. When is the history of man does or did the person who is the leader or boss not get the credit good or bad? Obama never and I mean never takes any blame. He took plenty of credit for Bin Laden, but he called the squester dumb and blamed republicans. Obama signed this into law. He is the leader. He is the President. It is his fault. Comes with the territory. He should man up and blame himself for signing it.

I'm not making excuses for Obama, I'm just suggesting there's more to our government than it's "commander-in-chief"; there are two other branches after all. I think the main issue on these boards--specifically in the politics thread--it's less about discussing alternatives or some level of bipartisanship, and more about another fuck up by the Obama Administration.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

I'm not making excuses for Obama, I'm just suggesting there's more to our government than it's "commander-in-chief"; there are two other branches after all. I think the main issue on these boards--specifically in the politics thread--it's less about discussing alternatives or some level of bipartisanship, and more about another fuck up by the Obama Administration.

I am sorry if I was not clear. I did not mean you or anyone on this site. I mean people in general.

You are right about it is more than just the President, but no one blamed anything on the Democratic congress in Bush's last two years. It was all Bush's fault. Fair is fair. The buck stops at Obama and he needs to stop blaming others. Watch video below

http://video.foxnews.com/v/220400242...=2114913880001

No one can say anything negative or partisan abotu Brit Hume. The man is beyond reproach. This President is not acting Presidental at all. He should be removed if he does not change.

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

I am sorry if I was not clear. I did not mean you or anyone on this site. I mean people in general.

You are right about it is more than just the President, but no one blamed anything on the Democratic congress in Bush's last two years. It was all Bush's fault. Fair is fair. The buck stops at Obama and he needs to stop blaming others. Watch video below

http://video.foxnews.com/v/220400242...=2114913880001

No one can say anything negative or partisan abotu Brit Hume. The man is beyond reproach. This President is not acting Presidental at all. He should be removed if he does not change.

I'm sorry, but I'm not going to watch a video put together by Fox News just like I wouldn't watch a video made by MSNBC. The conclusion is Obama is not going to be blamed or kicked out of office, it's just that simple.

[creekin111]

He's not going to be blamed for what? Who's not going to blame him? Me? Erroneous? I can't blame him for completely disobeying his oath of office? Says who? lol

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by creekin111

He's not going to be blamed for what? Who's not going to blame him? Me? Erroneous? I can't blame him for completely disobeying his oath of office? Says who? lol

I was referring to blaming that could potential materialize into political action that would involve him getting impeached. You can 'blame' him all you want, it's not going to do anything but comfort you for the next four years.

That is until if Clinton runs which she'll then get the blame.

[creekin111]

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

The conclusion is Obama is not going to be blamed or kicked out of office, it's just that simple.

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

I was referring to blaming that could potential materialize into political action that would involve him getting impeached. You can 'blame' him all you want, it's not going to do anything but comfort you for the next four years.

That is until if Clinton runs which she'll then get the blame.

Thanks for clearing that up Roy and I will continue to rightfully blame him for many things he has done and is continuing to do . Strange though I never even mentioned the word impeached until this sentence. I only mentioned the part about nobody blaming him. I'm also not sure why you would think Biden as president would give me any comfort lol

Discussing whether or not he should be impeached is a totally different conversation than will he be impeached. And I think it is important to discuss the reasons why he would be justified for impeachment and the reasons why its impossible with the way our current government is set up.

[Roy Batty]

Originally Posted by creekin111

Thanks for clearing that up Roy and I will continue to rightfully blame him for many things he has done and is continuing to do . Strange though I never even mentioned the word impeached until this sentence. I only mentioned the part about nobody blaming him. I'm also not sure why you would think Biden as president would give me any comfort lol

Discussing whether or not he should be impeached is a totally different conversation than will he be impeached. And I think it is important to discuss the reasons why he would be justified for impeachment and the reasons why its impossible with the way our current government is set up.

I'm not denying your right to blame him, I was simply saying Obama, collectively, is not going to be blamed for everything as some had tried to do already. I'm not speaking about you specifically besides when I said you can blame him all you want, it just won't lead to anything besides possibly satisfying your disgust of the guy

And the impeachment came up in response to Erroneous saying he should be removed, not because of anything you said.

[electriclite]

I just wanna know why Congress didn't pull the plug on the sequester like they told the press they would, because it was so onerous and debilitating to even consider letting it come into effect?

They did say that they were the ones who voted on the bill that created it, so therefore they're the ones who could pull the plug on it.

Or maybe, once again, members of government are turning everyone's future and well-being into one big game of "Whose Cock is Bigger?"

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by Roy Batty

And the impeachment came up in response to Erroneous saying he should be removed, not because of anything you said.

http://www.impeachobamacampaign.com/

http://www.wnd.com/2013/02/you-asked...a-impeachment/

There are a few things going around about this, but they are never going to get it to a vote based on what they are trying to impeach him for. I think he should step down. I feel Obama is lying on a daily basis to the American people and coming up with all these man made crisis events that do not add up to much to do about anything. I believe he and the democratic party are in the pocket of many main stream media news companies. I believe he is trying to put as many people on government programs as humanly possible to ensure they vote democratic. I believe the media and democratic party and esp Obama himself are out to demonize republicans, rich people and anyone who opposes his view. Worst of all, I believe Obama does not and has never acted Presidential. He started off his first term by apologizing to other countries. Now he is just bent on hurting the people and blaming the republicans to try to win control over the house and senate in 2014. Also, a president takes does not blame others good or bad when something happens in and around his admin while he is in office. Who got the blame when someone is Bush's admin did something stupid? Bush was blamed. What happens when it happens to Obama? Nothing at all.

[electriclite]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

http://www.impeachobamacampaign.com/

http://www.wnd.com/2013/02/you-asked...a-impeachment/

There are a few things going around about this, but they are never going to get it to a vote based on what they are trying to impeach him for. I think he should step down. I feel Obama is lying on a daily basis to the American people and coming up with all these man made crisis events that do not add up to much to do about anything. I believe he and the democratic party are in the pocket of many main stream media news companies. I believe he is trying to put as many people on government programs as humanly possible to ensure they vote democratic. I believe the media and democratic party and esp Obama himself are out to demonize republicans, rich people and anyone who opposes his view. Worst of all, I believe Obama does not and has never acted Presidential. He started off his first term by apologizing to other countries. Now he is just bent on hurting the people and blaming the republicans to try to win control over the house and senate in 2014. Also, a president takes does not blame others good or bad when something happens in and around his admin while he is in office. Who got the blame when someone is Bush's admin did something stupid? Bush was blamed. What happens when it happens to Obama? Nothing at all.

The entire political an idealogical right is blaming Obama. Where do you think that impeach Obama website came from? Disappointed liberals? The same as liberals were calling for the impeachment of Bush with the whole Iraq war and WMDs debacle. It is not as you would like to believe all quiet on the "down with Obama front". From the ridiculous, frivolous to actually pertinent, everything and the kitchen sink has been lobbed at the man and his administration in an effect to get something to stick. And if the Bush administration is any indicator (spoiler alert) it's not gonna happen, not in any meaningful way.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by electriclite

The entire political an idealogical right is blaming Obama. Where do you think that impeach Obama website came from? Disappointed liberals? The same as liberals were calling for the impeachment of Bush with the whole Iraq war and WMDs debacle. It is not as you would like to believe all quiet on the "down with Obama front". From the ridiculous, frivolous to actually pertinent, everything and the kitchen sink has been lobbed at the man and his administration in an effect to get something to stick. And if the Bush administration is any indicator (spoiler alert) it's not gonna happen, not in any meaningful way.

The WMDs were in Libya. Or at least the somewhat nuclear program was. But that is another story.

I thought I was pretty clear it is not going to ever get close to a vote.

[shoe1985]

Lets discuss the sequester, this is the topic for the thread.

$85 billion is not a big hit to a trillion dollar a year deficit. Add in that the real cuts amount to roughly $40 billion, the rest is just future spending.

We could do more, but I like this number. We need to cut, but nothing drastic to impact the "recovery."

There is a Army depot where I live, and it has cut about 1,000 jobs, all contractors. Many people are worried now, but the truth is this depot has been expected to be hit for years. It is happening, and people are scared. With automation taking over everywhere, we could easily cut many of these jobs.

Lets discuss automation. With the increase in this technology enhancement, we could easily go through the government and implement this, and eliminate many jobs. This would allow cuts to be made, and we could really hit the deficit even more. Short term, it would hurt with job losses, but long term it would allow the country to move closer to a balanced budget.

What else can be done? Stop bailing out companies and other countries. We need to let people fail. Letting people and companies fail lets new companies grow and replace them. It allows for poor decisions to fail. It rewards success.

We have close to 50 million people on welfare, why? How many of these people are out trying to find work? When I was in college, I worked a full-time job, 1 part-time, and was a full-time student. Nobody gave me anything, so, why are we doing it for others? Because the economy is bad? Well, when is the economy ever really good? It goes up and down, but you can't just sit around and wait for it to get better.

We need more cuts from the top to the bottom. We need to close loopholes in the tax system. We should look into reforming the tax system that works for EVERYONE.

[creekin111]

http://live.huffingtonpost.com/r/seg...c90a2f01000110

lol Don't want to make any cuts because wouldn't want Biden to starve. Oh now sure every politician steals.... err... spends money so that justifies MMMMEEEEEE to "spend" a stupid amount of money for "the good of the people." What's going on that was so important that such a high bill was necessary? Lead by example? "Don't do what I do, do what I say! I can't do my job as vice president unless I'm treated like I'm surrounded by a dozen hot women, getting fanned, having foot massages and getting fed grapes. Unless I get stuff like that the people of this nation are going to eventually die."

Irony - going around telling others they're not doing their fair share... going out to Paris and spending the people's money like an emperor. Shit like this is example #900 trillion and one why the problem is systemic. Just think about it if someone got taxed 20% of their wealth (about $8,000 in taxes from what they make). In today's money it would take that person over 70 years just to pay for just that one trip. But of course nobody cares about "a drop in a bucket" people just can't figure out there's been so many drops our nation is now flooded. This is why principles are important.