#1361  
Old 07-20-2006, 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by bob
I quite clearly said "last season" in my post. A-Rod is having an off-year by all accounts this year.

If you go through the games from last season, not just in late innings but throughout the games, A-Rod had exactly as many game-tying or go-ahead hits as Ortiz.

Ortiz is the most clutch player in the game...that I will agree with. But to paint him as being in a different league as A-Rod is ludicrous. They won games for their teams at an even clip last year, and A-Rod has a far more impressive streak before his move to the Yankees highlighted the comparison to Ortiz.

Sorry, I overlooked the last season part. And here are the late inning stats for the 2005 season (from Fox Sports.com)


David Ortiz

AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG

179 37 52 9 0 19 50 30 41 1 0 . 291 .392 .659

Alex Rodriguez
AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB K SB CS AVG OBP SLG

174 33 54 12 1 9 26 26 44 7 0 .310 .410 .546

I'll give A-Rod credit his average was nearly 20 points higher in late inning situations. However, Ortiz has twice as many home runs and RBI's in late inning situations as A-Rod did last season which in my opinion is the best indicator of clutch performance.

I did not check the game tying or go ahead stats because they can be deciving. A 2 run single in the 3rd which puts a team ahead is condidered a go ahead hit but it is not what I would call a clutch performance. I do believe you when you say those stats are identical but I figure most of A-Rod's game tying or go ahead hits occured in the early innings.

The best indicator of clutch performance is late inning stats, and those stats say, even for last season that Ortiz is vastly superior to A-Rod in clutch situations.

Last edited by cletus66; 07-20-2006 at 07:19 PM..
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  #1362  
Old 07-21-2006, 03:16 AM
Agree to disagree, I suppose...

Ortiz is definitely a superior clutch hitter, but I think they are comparable.
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  #1363  
Old 07-21-2006, 11:12 AM
I;ll tell you who isnt a clutch fielder!!! A ROD!!!!

YANKEES SUCK

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMv8yJiYRb0
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  #1364  
Old 07-21-2006, 09:37 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by daddiefatsacks
I;ll tell you who isnt a clutch fielder!!! A ROD!!!!

YANKEES SUCK

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMv8yJiYRb0

Right on daddiefatsacks right on
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  #1365  
Old 07-21-2006, 10:30 PM
All I'll say about this is: it's getting harder and harder for people to make the argument that Alex's defense wins the Yankees many games and is thus the deciding factor in ranking him higher than David.
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  #1366  
Old 07-21-2006, 11:09 PM
another error tonite, missed pop fly and a lazy throw to first in which he still got the out..barely....all will be overshadowed cuz he hit a 3 run homer, number 450

YANKS STILL SUCK
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  #1367  
Old 07-22-2006, 06:09 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Buck Turgidson
All I'll say about this is: it's getting harder and harder for people to make the argument that Alex's defense wins the Yankees many games and is thus the deciding factor in ranking him higher than David.
A-Rod's "defense" has been horrible this season and he has hurt the Yankees more than it has helped. I just hope if we get another scenario where A-Rod and Ortiz are 1 and 2 for the MVP like we did last season the voters will take A-Rod's terrible fielding this season into account. The only reason he got the MVP last year over Ortiz was because many writers do not believe a DH should be the MVP because they don't contribute anything defensively.
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  #1368  
Old 07-23-2006, 01:36 AM
E-ROD

It's not easy being A-Rod this week. By the way, 0 for 4 tonight...with 4 K's.
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  #1369  
Old 07-30-2006, 01:40 PM
Abreu and Lidle to the Yanks for NOTHING...

the league needs a fucking cap, this is just a ridiculous trade
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  #1370  
Old 07-30-2006, 03:06 PM
Ok, with trade deadlines coming up and whatnot, the Cubs need to cut ties with Kerry Wood, Mark Prior and Derrek Lee.

The Cubs are on fire lately, and one cant help but notice it comes at a time when all 3 are BACK on the DL. Prior came back the other day and pitched a gem, but for him, a game like that has become quite the rarity. The Cubs proved at the beginning of the year, before the May/June nosedive, that they dont need Kerry Wood and Prior pitching to win. Now, they are doing it again. Besides, Kerry and Mark are nothing but burdens to the team anymore, spending more time on the DL than anyone in baseball. I'm sure they'll get someone good for the trade, considering the names of the people their trading and how big of names they are, but really, they are worth nothing.

Cubs just need to cut bait and get some consistent pitching and a legit Big Bat, because Derrek, while he cant really help having a broken hand, hasnt done shit this year.


The way the Cubs are run though, I wouldnt be surprised if they ended up trading Zambrano, the best player they have and arguably the best pitcher in the NL right now, and Maddux instead.

Oh, and, they need to lose Todd Walker. I dont think I need to back that one up.
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  #1371  
Old 07-31-2006, 03:41 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by daddiefatsacks
Abreu and Lidle to the Yanks for NOTHING...

the league needs a fucking cap, this is just a ridiculous trade
It's a great trade for the Yankees, but I don't like the fact that it blocks Melky Cabrera for the rest of this season and next.
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  #1372  
Old 07-31-2006, 11:49 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by daddiefatsacks
Abreu and Lidle to the Yanks for NOTHING...

the league needs a fucking cap, this is just a ridiculous trade
The Phillies got prospects, that's all they wanted. They received better offers, but they are asses.

And Jackson, you can't trade someone while they are on the DL, it isn't happening. Wood's option won't be picked up anyway, so he's not going to be a Cub. Lee has been hurt all year and that would be the reason he has struggled, so trading a guy of his caliber would be moronic. Prior has had problems with injuries, but he has a much better chance than Wood of recovering from these. Maddux will possibly be traded, but that's the only move the Cubs will make probably.
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  #1373  
Old 07-31-2006, 12:04 PM
I guarantee the only reason that the Phillies traded Abreu to the Yankees was because they were the only ones that said they would pick up his ENTIRE contract.

That freed up the Phillies to go out this offsesaon and pick up or trade for a couple of guys that could help their club win instead of having around 16-18 million dollars invested in one guy.
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  #1374  
Old 07-31-2006, 11:35 PM
You know, so many times this year, I've read or seen the Cubs give up homer upon homer to teams, thus it ending in "setting a club record for most home runs in a game". They did it with the Braves. Tonight, they did it with the D-Backs.

I am so sick and tired of them sucking it up so badly. And doing the dumbass things they do. They trade Todd Walker, who, while he wasnt great, was something, for nothing but a minor league pitcher, who probably wont even get called up this year. They trade Maddux, who wasnt much this year, but so much better than Prior, who sucked it up royally today just like he has all season, for an injured SS who wont do jack for the team. Add to that the fact that they are moving Ronny Cedeno, the current SS for the Cubs, to second base, a place where he is actually not good at playing, just so this injured new guy can take over at SS, where HE is comfortable. So they are basically saying to Ronny, "yeah, we know you play there, but we gotta accommodate this newbie, so scoot over kid."

What shitty trades the made today. And what a shitty game they played.

This isnt our year. This isnt even a rebuilding year. This is just an embarassment year. See ya Madds and Walker, have fun playing on teams with talent and ones that actually win.
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  #1375  
Old 08-01-2006, 07:25 PM
jackson13, thought it'd be interesting to tell you: My mom was just in Chicago with some friends (we live in NY) and she got to watch a Cubs game from the apartment rooftops. She said it was amazing with lots of good food, free drinks, a great view of Wrigley and the city...and she got a nice shirt that says "BEYOND THE IVY, ROOFTOPS, CHICAGO"...she got one for me too!
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  #1376  
Old 08-01-2006, 09:57 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by bob
It's a great trade for the Yankees, but I don't like the fact that it blocks Melky Cabrera for the rest of this season and next.
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  #1377  
Old 08-02-2006, 12:38 PM
Enough with the Cubs - the Best team in MLB is on the South Side of Chicago.

White Sox World Series Champs!!!
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  #1378  
Old 08-02-2006, 07:52 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by veddhead83
Enough with the Cubs - the Best team in MLB is on the South Side of Chicago.

White Sox World Series Champs!!!
Check the standings before you call them the best team in baseball.

ChemcialRomance - LUCKY. The game I attended last season at the Confines, I was as high as high could get. I had a great view - of Chicago. Not the field. Most uncomfortable position I've ever sat in my life. And of course, the Cubs lost, so it wasnt worth it. I would've loved to have been across the street for that game.
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  #1379  
Old 08-02-2006, 09:42 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by jackson13
Check the standings before you call them the best team in baseball.
They are still the champs until some other team wins it my friend.
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  #1380  
Old 08-02-2006, 10:59 PM
Don't look now! The Yanks take first place in the AL East and ladies and gents let's give it for Mr. Chien Mien Wang who is now 13-4.

The man is an innings eater!

Last Start: CG, 2 Hits, 0 Runs
Tonight: 8 IP, 4 Hits, 0 Runs

Some of his losses have been awful...for example there was his CG 2 run gem that ended with a walkoff for the Nationals . This guy is something...right bob?
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  #1381  
Old 08-03-2006, 02:04 AM
Yeah, Wang is great...I won't mind it at all in a few years when Wang is the ace of that staff.

And with the news that Sheff would play first, the Abreu trade looks better...if he was gonna block Cabrera AND Sheffield AND cause clubhouse problems, it would be too much for me to deal with.

And even as a dedicated Yankees fan, I will say that the AL MVP this year has GOT to be David Ortiz.
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  #1382  
Old 08-03-2006, 10:52 AM
its good to see a pitcher that the yanks DIDNT have to buy, actually succeed....
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  #1383  
Old 08-03-2006, 06:42 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by veddhead83
the Best team in MLB is on the South Side of Chicago.


Funny, there is a team in Detroit that has something to say to that. But yeah, they are the currently the champs.

Last edited by screamer581; 08-03-2006 at 06:46 PM..
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  #1384  
Old 08-03-2006, 08:34 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by daddiefatsacks
its good to see a pitcher that the yanks DIDNT have to buy, actually succeed....
How's B.J. Ryan and his largest contract ever for a closer doing?
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  #1385  
Old 08-03-2006, 10:03 PM
so we've bought two pitchers? our payroll maxes out at 70....that covers about 4 of your starting players

oh, and the red sox trade for javy lopez....got an injury to a catcher...NO PROB just spend spend spend

this league needs a cap
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  #1386  
Old 08-03-2006, 10:12 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by bob
How's B.J. Ryan and his largest contract ever for a closer doing?
Billy Wagner's is bigger.
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  #1387  
Old 08-03-2006, 11:09 PM
I'm sick of this salary cap complainging to compensate for Blue Jays losses to the Yankees. And I don't appreciate stupid videos of Blue Jays fans chanting "YANKEES SUCK!"

Do any of them have a list of the standings in front of them right now? Cause the Yankees are 8.5 ahead...and I don't see how that makes them suck? I don't get it? The Yankees suck? Huh? What?
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  #1388  
Old 08-03-2006, 11:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by brodeurnumber1
Billy Wagner's is bigger.
Per year, yeah...but the total amount going to Ryan is more. Technicalites are a bitch....

And the trade for Lopez would be silly, but not then both the AL East frontrunners would have one dead fish catcher.

I HATE SAL FASANO.
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  #1389  
Old 08-03-2006, 11:50 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by bob
I HATE SAL FASANO.
How can you not love the stache.
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  #1390  
Old 08-04-2006, 01:24 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by ChemicalRomance
I'm sick of this salary cap complainging to compensate for Blue Jays losses to the Yankees. And I don't appreciate stupid videos of Blue Jays fans chanting "YANKEES SUCK!"

Do any of them have a list of the standings in front of them right now? Cause the Yankees are 8.5 ahead...and I don't see how that makes them suck? I don't get it? The Yankees suck? Huh? What?
its true man, money buys the W's

the yankees will always suck, no matter how much they spend
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  #1391  
Old 08-04-2006, 02:33 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by daddiefatsacks
the yankees will always suck, no matter how much they spend
This statement is offensive to a point and ignorant. I'm so sick of the money copout being an excuse for Yankee domination. It is immature bullshit! 1996, what were the Yankees then? A team of All Stars? No they made with what they had: Wetland, a set-up man in Rivera, Scoot Brocious, Tino Martinez, a ROOKIE by the name of Derek Jeter, Chilli Davis and a cast of utility players that did their job whenever they were called on. What about 1998? The greatest year for any sports team in any sport, ever? That isn't my Yankee love talking, it's an agreed opinion, ESPN recently ranked the 1998 Yankees as the greatest sports team of all time: the definition of team chemistry, success in the clutch and determination and drive to win. Were they a crew of overpaid All Stars then? No! 1999? No! 2000! No!

The Yankees will not "always suck". If a team wins their division constantly, makes the playoffs and wins...wait...TWENTY SIX championships, I don't believe it matters how much money they spend. It'd be much more worthwhile to see their 90's dynasty for what it was: perfection.
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  #1392  
Old 08-04-2006, 01:15 PM
then i guess its just a coincidence that the yankees have lead all of baseball in payroll all but 2 years since 1994...the years were 1995 (the jays!) and 1998 (the orioles)

as hard as it is to realize, the yankees have no chemistry, and at this rate with however much money the boss spends, they won't ever have any chemistry...too many egos and big money players does NOT equal a winning team

see ya on the golf course in october
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  #1393  
Old 08-05-2006, 02:18 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by ChemicalRomance
1996, what were the Yankees then? A team of All Stars? No they made with what they had: Wetland, a set-up man in Rivera, Scoot Brocious, Tino Martinez, a ROOKIE by the name of Derek Jeter, Chilli Davis and a cast of utility players that did their job whenever they were called on.
And the guy who got the key hit of the World Series, who had HGH oozing out of his ears.
Quote:
What about 1998? The greatest year for any sports team in any sport, ever? That isn't my Yankee love talking, it's an agreed opinion, ESPN recently ranked the 1998 Yankees as the greatest sports team of all time: the definition of team chemistry, success in the clutch and determination and drive to win. Were they a crew of overpaid All Stars then? No! 1999? No! 2000! No!
All true. In the last few years, however, they've seemed to get away from the role players + stars philosophy that Torre favors and gone in more for big splash free agents.

For those of us who saw it the first time around, that is reminiscent of the 1979-1989 (roughly) era when Steinbrenner took over and tried to treat his team like a fantasy league team.

I don't begrudge them their success and that's why they have the payroll they have. Because Yankee Stadium will always be one of the major Places To Be, because that team will always be popular and followed, success breeds success.

I just don't know if that money is being spent wisely. When you take on humps like Pavano and Wright...it makes people wonder.
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  #1394  
Old 08-06-2006, 09:23 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by screamer581
Funny, there is a team in Detroit that has something to say to that. But yeah, they are the currently the champs.
Detroit is very good this year - I'll give you that. But don't they have a losing record with against all of the contenders in the AL??? I think they do....
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  #1395  
Old 08-06-2006, 09:25 AM
I agree with the statements above - The Yanks try to buy every WS every year. MLB needs a salary cap. The ChiSox won it all with only 70 million on the payroll. The Yanks, I think, had 240+ on theirs last season. - Pretty sad.
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  #1396  
Old 08-06-2006, 01:45 PM
As a Red Sox fan I love that the Yankees are trying to buy the pennant because it does not work. George fell into this strap for most of the 80's and failed miserably. Their championships in the late 90's and 2000 were not won with a bunch of high priced players but a well rounded roster that meshed extremely well. What the Yankees are doing now is creating a real life fantasy team which is a recipe for disaster.

Before the Varitek injury I thought the Sox were a lock to win the division but Tek's injury has given the Yankees a window. I still think the Red Sox will pull it out and there is a good chance the wild card will come out of the central so this would be the first time in a decade we have a playoff without the Yanks and I can't wait to see the heads roll once that happens.
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  #1397  
Old 08-06-2006, 03:26 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by cletus66
As a Red Sox fan I love that the Yankees are trying to buy the pennant because it does not work. George fell into this strap for most of the 80's and failed miserably. Their championships in the late 90's and 2000 were not won with a bunch of high priced players but a well rounded roster that meshed extremely well. What the Yankees are doing now is creating a real life fantasy team which is a recipe for disaster.

Before the Varitek injury I thought the Sox were a lock to win the division but Tek's injury has given the Yankees a window. I still think the Red Sox will pull it out and there is a good chance the wild card will come out of the central so this would be the first time in a decade we have a playoff without the Yanks and I can't wait to see the heads roll once that happens.
OOOO yea becasue varitek was having such a great season at the plate. It will probbaly hurt the yanks because theymight get a catcher who could actually hit.
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  #1398  
Old 08-06-2006, 08:52 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by veddhead83
Detroit is very good this year - I'll give you that. But don't they have a losing record with against all of the contenders in the AL??? I think they do....


Probably. The Red Sox took 2 of 3 against them (at Boston). New York destroyed them. And your Sox lead the season series against them, although Detroit took the last series. On the other hand, the Tigers have owned the Twins and pretty much everyone else in the league. They play the White Sox after the Twins, so that should be interesting.


Honestly, I don't know many Tiger fans that are picking them to win the whole thing, but it's been a great season. Whatever happens, this is a big step for the program. It's nice not being the laughing stock of the league.

Last edited by screamer581; 08-06-2006 at 08:56 PM..
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  #1399  
Old 08-06-2006, 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by bfox1220
OOOO yea becasue varitek was having such a great season at the plate. It will probbaly hurt the yanks because theymight get a catcher who could actually hit.
You're right Varitek has had an awful season offensively. His work behind the plate and the leadership he provides however is irreplacable. He is the glue that holds the team together. That is Varitek's true value to the Red Sox any offense he provides is just an added bonus.
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  #1400  
Old 08-06-2006, 10:30 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by cletus66
You're right Varitek has had an awful season offensively. His work behind the plate and the leadership he provides however is irreplacable. He is the glue that holds the team together. That is Varitek's true value to the Red Sox any offense he provides is just an added bonus.
We love Tek up here and acknowledge that he is indisputably the leader of the team. If Derek Jeter started batting .265 would he still be the locker room and vocal leader of the Yankees? Of course he would, and it's the same with Varitek. He's having a bad year at the plate.

What makes me less afraid of his injury is the fact that his work behind the plate hasn't been stellar. Last I checked Beckett is on pace to set a record for home runs allowed, Wakefield never liked him, and Schill is only playing decently (he wins but his ERA is pretty high). Based on that, I don't think Varitek will be missed as much as a lot of other people think because he's no longer calling great games for the pitchers. If Javy manages the game as well as Tek (not hard) and is an improvement at the plate, the Sox are still in the hunt.
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