Official MLB Discussion Thread

[Erroneous]

I would like to thank Fox sports and Bud Selig for fucking the Yankee. They have to play a double header on Sat and also play on Fox at 4pm. Why they could not move the game up a couple hours is beyond me. As a result, the first game ended after 8 pm and then the next after 1am. That is a very nice thing to do to a team trying to set up for the postseason and possibly win the division.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

I would like to thank Fox sports and Bud Selig for fucking the Yankee. They have to play a double header on Sat and also play on Fox at 4pm. Why they could not move the game up a couple hours is beyond me. As a result, the first game ended after 8 pm and then the next after 1am. That is a very nice thing to do to a team trying to set up for the postseason and possibly win the division.

I'm sorry but I've watched the Yankees get every benefit from MLB and a team with $250 million payroll doesn't get any sympathy from me whatsoever.

[John@$$]

What benefits have the Yanks got from MLB horrorfreak13? By your logic with your hate for the Yankees, I expected you to not like the Red Sox since they have huge payroll and are in the AL East with your Blue Jays.

[smok3h]

If the Yankees beat the Twins out of the of playoffs for the 4 time in a row this year, I may consider quitting watching baseball altogether, haha, I just don't know if I can deal with it AGAIN. Seriously though, I really hope that doesn't happen.

[damien22]

GO GIANTS.

What a perfect way for the season to end. I didn't want it to come down to the line like it did just because it would be so risky, but now that we're in the playoffs I'm very happy that things played out like they did. I'm not getting my hopes up too much and I will be satisfied with making it to the playoffs, but I think if our offense gets inspired by this turn of events we could go far because our pitching is PHENOMENAL. Especially the bullpen. Watch out...

[RicochetShaw]

I'm sad my Sox aren't in it, but my hometown Rangers are... and for the first time in 11 years. This should be a great post-season. First on my wishlist - for the Twins to eliminate the Yanks. Please, Twins, please....

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by John@$$

What benefits have the Yanks got from MLB horrorfreak13? By your logic with your hate for the Yankees, I expected you to not like the Red Sox since they have huge payroll and are in the AL East with your Blue Jays.

I'm not really fond of the Red Sox either they were the team that killed us this year since we lost to them almost every time not that it would have helped us make the playoffs I think we are closer than ever now pitching looks great we just need maybe another bat.

Twins no Justin Morneau for the playoffs that will hurt their chances I'm not really sure they can beat the Yankees

Kind of cheering for the Phillies only because I want to see Roy Halladay win a world series the best pitcher in the game deserves it. And I think its going to be hard to beat that pitching staff deepest out of all the teams by far.

Predictions
Yankees in 5
Rays in 5
Phillies in 4
Giants in 4

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

I'm sorry but I've watched the Yankees get every benefit from MLB and a team with $250 million payroll doesn't get any sympathy from me whatsoever.

WOW! What a hater of the Yanks you are. What benefit do they get exactly? Just admit that you rerally hate the fact that they have a $200-$225 not $250 mil payroll and that is all you have.

The Yankees are the soul reason baseball has not lost more of their basball fan base. Where ever the Yankees go on the road, they sell out. Teams opening say they loathe the Yanks, but they love it when they come to town. Tampa fans are just pathetic. They deserve to lose this team for not showing up to see them.

The Yankees play more Sunday night games then the next 3 teams combined. Almost every series against Boston and the Mets takes place on the weekends. Of those games, every Sat game is on Fox at 3 or 4. Every single Sunday game is at night on ESPN. No sport asks as much of the team as baseball does of the Yankees.

As for you only reason you seem to hate the Yankees (money), I say you and everyone who talks about the money can go spit. I say we have every right to spend as much as we want. I am tired of players putting in a show to try to attract a big contract from the Yankees or Boston. It is amazing how so many players seem to put up their A game against the Yankees and suck against other teams. That is how it is every single game of every series. Teams have put a huge bullseye on the Yanks and circle when they play us. That makes things quite a bit harder to compete against. I know you will not agree with this, because of your blind money hatred.

It is the same story for Notre Dame. ND has not been good in years, but if your team beats ND, you move up in the polls. Fucking amazing. Every team that plays ND, puts in an extra effort to win. It is the same thing for your Redskins. I would bet huge dollars they lose this week. They beat the Eagles for McNabb. They will not put up such an effort this week.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

WOW! What a hater of the Yanks you are. What benefit do they get exactly? Just admit that you rerally hate the fact that they have a $200-$225 not $250 mil payroll and that is all you have.

The Yankees are the soul reason baseball has not lost more of their basball fan base. Where ever the Yankees go on the road, they sell out. Teams opening say they loathe the Yanks, but they love it when they come to town. Tampa fans are just pathetic. They deserve to lose this team for not showing up to see them.

The Yankees play more Sunday night games then the next 3 teams combined. Almost every series against Boston and the Mets takes place on the weekends. Of those games, every Sat game is on Fox at 3 or 4. Every single Sunday game is at night on ESPN. No sport asks as much of the team as baseball does of the Yankees.

As for you only reason you seem to hate the Yankees (money), I say you and everyone who talks about the money can go spit. I say we have every right to spend as much as we want. I am tired of players putting in a show to try to attract a big contract from the Yankees or Boston. It is amazing how so many players seem to put up their A game against the Yankees and suck against other teams. That is how it is every single game of every series. Teams have put a huge bullseye on the Yanks and circle when they play us. That makes things quite a bit harder to compete against. I know you will not agree with this, because of your blind money hatred.

It is the same story for Notre Dame. ND has not been good in years, but if your team beats ND, you move up in the polls. Fucking amazing. Every team that plays ND, puts in an extra effort to win. It is the same thing for your Redskins. I would bet huge dollars they lose this week. They beat the Eagles for McNabb. They will not put up such an effort this week.

I appoligize for the long reply and how much this might drag on

Its all a matter of how much publicity a team gets the Yankees who pretty much have the biggest fan base of any baseball team and the history they have and I have no problem with how much money they spend I'm a fan of a NFL team that spends lots of money salary cap or not I think baseball would be a little better off with a salary cap teams like Florida and Tampa Bay can only stay on top for a short period of time I agree on Tampa not deserving a baseball team if you can't sell out when you have a competitive world series caliber team you don't deserve to have a team at least the hockey team sold out their building during their Stanley Cup run back in 2004 and I'm sure Tampa Bay tickets aren't that expensive.

BTW The Jays our home games with the Yankees and the Red Sox are our biggest home crowds during the year mostly on weekends which are the biggest crowds we get

The networks have a major part in the Yankees playing a lot of prime time games. Watch how many Yankees games in the playoffs ends up on prime time on FOX. I know ESPN's sunday night game the Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Dodgers, Giants, and Phillies get shown alot I don't think the Jays have played a Sunday night game in a long time or if we ever had one.

The main reason I hate them or actually its the media more nonetheless than anything and overhype (I understand it at times living in Canada and being a fan of a hockey team that has the first 6-8 pages of the sports section to themselves and I actually do hate it sometimes the way the media acts towards them) its the same reason I hate the Dallas Cowboys the main difference between the two is this. The Yankees have actually been a good team and have actually done something since 1996 compared to Dallas who is 100-102 since 1996 with one playoff victory and are predicted to win the super bowl every year. The Yankees on the other hand have actually done something and are worthy or the attention of being a great team year after year.

And the publicity my Redskins get considering the history we have is nothing close to the Yankees or the Cowboys the only publicity we get is when we make huge free agent signings, when one of our players get shot and killed and special circumstances like last week where our star QB is going back to a revenge game against Phily and Dallas is off on a bye week and considering we play a super bowl contender in Green Bay it wouldn't surprise me if we lost, it somehow wouldn't shock me if we won either since we seem to bring it during division and good teams and seem to flop playing really shitty teams since somehow all our wins/losses are within a TD or less

BTW watch a Sunday NFL countdown show and watch how much time Dallas gets compared to anybody else.

Now I'm carrying on NFL talk into a baseball thread

Also just a thought I actually would be glad for the Wild Card I'd rather play the Twins who the Yankees have owned for the past few times then the Rangers

Long post over I think thats the longest post I've ever done on this board.

[RicochetShaw]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

It is the same story for Notre Dame. ND has not been good in years, but if your team beats ND, you move up in the polls.

Any time a Division 1 football team wins against any opponent, the team moves up in the polls (given that any team ranked ahead of them lost).

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Almost every series against Boston and the Mets takes place on the weekends.

Four out of six (66.6%) series against Boston were weekend series... a whopping one more than the number of weekend series that Baltimore and Toronto had against them.... and the same amount of weekend series that Tampa Bay had against Boston. As you may know, Tampa Bay has the smallest market in the AL East... and among the smallest in the entire MLB. If such a tiny market team has the same number of weekend series against Boston than the Yankees, what does that say about the point that you just tried to make?

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Every Saturday game between the Yankees and Red Sox is on Fox

The Yankees and Red sox had 4 Saturday games... 2 of which were on Fox. So, actually, half of those games were on Fox.

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Every Saturday game between the Yankees and Mets is on Fox

The Yankees and Mets had 2 Saturday games... 1 was on Fox. So again, only half of those games were on Fox.

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Every single Sunday game is at night on ESPN.

The Yankees had 27 Sunday games this season. Six were at night on ESPN.

Originally Posted by Erroneous

The Yankees play more Sunday night games then the next 3 teams combined.

The Yankees had 6 Sunday night games this year, three other teams (Mets, Cards, Dodgers) had 5 appearances each. Math was never my strongest subject, but I think your figures are incorrect.


.......wait a minute, wait a minute...WAIT!... are you just making shit up? I can't fathom any other explanation for such completely, blatantly wrong statements. Jesus Christ, how much shit did you just completely pull out of your ass in this post? I knew the post smelled bad... I guess that's because it's comprised of complete bullshit.

I'm actually in awe.... your forum name perfectly fits your debate points and debate style. This has to be one of the most poorly researched, factually incorrect, and downright erroneous posts I have ever read on these forums... and I've been here for over 9 years.

[John@$$]

Congrets to Roy Halladay for being the only pitcher so far besides Don Larsen to throw a no-hitter in a playoff game.


Where sarah1980 right now when you need her?

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by RicochetShaw

Any time a Division 1 football team wins against any opponent, the team moves up in the polls.

What a weak ass comment. You know that is not true at all. No one moves up when a higher team beats a much lower team. I am not doing the work. You do it for yourself. Look at ND schedule and the ranking before and after of the teams they play. You prob will too. LOL

Four out of six (66.6%) series against Boston were weekend series... a whopping one more than the number of weekend series that Baltimore and Toronto had against them.... and the same amount of weekend series that Tampa Bay had against Boston. As you may know, Tampa Bay has the smallest market in the AL East... and among the smallest in the entire MLB. If such a tiny market team has the same number of weekend series against Boston than the Yankees, what does that say about the point that you just tried to make?

4 of the 6 were weekend series. The first series, which can go either way started the season off and the first game of the year, which was a Sunday night game on ESPN. I am counting it as a push, so 4 of 5 and the one series that was during the week was a 2 game series.

The Yankees and Red sox had 4 Saturday games... 2 of which were on Fox. So, actually, half of those games were on Fox.

All 4 Sat games against Boston were on Fox. I watched all 4. I think I would know. They also had 4 of 5 Sunday night games. The fifth was on the last day of the season. That does not count, 4 of 4.

The Yankees and Mets had 2 Saturday games... 1 was on Fox. So again, only half of those games were on Fox.

Yes, true. Every year, both series are on on the weekend. 1 Sat game is on Fox and 1 Sun game is a night ESPN game, every year. You tell me how many other series can say that? I went back 4 years. You have no point here.

The Yankees had 27 Sunday games this season. Six were at night on ESPN.

The highest percentage of any team.

.......wait a minute, wait a minute...WAIT!... are you just making shit up? I can't fathom any other explanation for such completely, blatantly wrong statements. Jesus Christ, how much shit did you just completely pull out of your ass in this post? I knew the post smelled bad... I guess that's because it's comprised of complete bullshit.

I'm actually in awe.... your forum name perfectly fits your debate points and debate style. This has to be one of the most poorly researched, factually incorrect, and downright erroneous posts I have ever read on these forums... and I've been here for over 9 years.

I guess you don't understand the concept of exaggeration. Every Sat game between the Sox and Yanks was on Fox. Clearly, the Yankees are the feature team and they play the most featured games of any team. I do find it pretty fucking sad that you actually did the research. Talk about an anal rentent. I guess you have nothing better to do with your life and you act like a big man on here. I laugh at you. Seriously, I am laughing at you. Maybe you are trying to get me banned from here, because I am in first place in the NFL confidence pool. LOL In the future, I suggest if you don't agree with something, you might want to be a bigger person and just let it go.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by RicochetShaw

I'm sad my Sox aren't in it, but my hometown Rangers are... and for the first time in 11 years. This should be a great post-season. First on my wishlist - for the Twins to eliminate the Yanks. Please, Twins, please....

I should have know you are a Sox fan. I find it to be so funny how much hate Sox fans have in their hearts.

The Sox had a great season considering all their injuries. If I had a vote for Cy Young, I would give it to Jon Lester. Shame he did not get any credit. No way Hernandez should get it.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

The Sox had a great season considering all their injuries. If I had a vote for Cy Young, I would give it to Jon Lester. Shame he did not get any credit. No way Hernandez should get it.

Felix Hernandez should get it hands down he lead the league in ERA, WHIP and Ks and its not his fault he pitches for the team that had the worst offense of all time 7 of his starts the team scored 0 runs for him and don't give me that he doesn't have enough wins. Wins is the most misleading stat for a pitcher you don't control it your team does.

To me he's the 2nd best pitcher in baseball behind Roy Halladay who pitched a no hitter in his first post season game how's that for a post season debut.

Wished he did that as a Blue Jays but great for him I'm hoping Phily wins only for him to get the world series championship that he deserves.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Felix Hernandez should get it hands down he lead the league in ERA, WHIP and Ks and its not his fault he pitches for the team that had the worst offense of all time 7 of his starts the team scored 0 runs for him and don't give me that he doesn't have enough wins. Wins is the most misleading stat for a pitcher you don't control it your team does.

To me he's the 2nd best pitcher in baseball behind Roy Halladay who pitched a no hitter in his first post season game how's that for a post season debut.

Wished he did that as a Blue Jays but great for him I'm hoping Phily wins only for him to get the world series championship that he deserves.

No way! 18 of his games were against terrible offensive teams (Oak 3, Det 1, Bal 1, KC 2, SD 2, LAA 5, ChC 1, ChW 2, Cle 2) 6 games against Texas and 2 of them were when at the end of the season when the O went into the tank. I give him mad props for doing what he did to the Yanks, Bos and Tor, but that brings me to a very important point.

Pitching in the AL east is much harder than if you have to pitch in the AL west. Both Lester and Buchholz had great years. Clay is 17-7 with a 2.33 ERA, so he should be in the conversation with both ERA and wins on his side. CC also lost out on 3 or 4 wins too. I would vote for him and his 0-0 shutout battle with Price in the last weeks of the season over anything Felix did.

I also buy into pressure. Teams in the east had way more pressure knowing that if you win or lose it matters more. Felix had no pressure. He does not get it in my opinion.

[AceD]

Pitching in the AL east is much harder than if you have to pitch in the AL west. Both Lester and Buchholz had great years. Clay is 17-7 with a 2.33 ERA, so he should be in the conversation with both ERA and wins on his side. CC also lost out on 3 or 4 wins too. I would vote for him and his 0-0 shutout battle with Price in the last weeks of the season over anything Felix did.

Valid points all, but I'm in the Felix camp still. Clay barely pitched enough innings to qualify. I think a vote for CC is totally valid. Everyone is talking about old-school vs Sabermatics, but it's really just about having four fantastic pitching performances in the AL this year. I think it's just about forgone that Felix will win, regardless of if he should or not.

I also buy into pressure. Teams in the east had way more pressure knowing that if you win or lose it matters more. Felix had no pressure. He does not get it in my opinion.

A valid point as well, but it's easy as fans to think that players on bad teams don't care as much as we don't care. Felix had pressure like no one else this year in one important area: he was pitching for perhaps the worst offensive team ever. In the history of baseball. Certainly the worst of the modern era. CC or Clay gives up four runs through 5, they've got nothing to worry about. Felix allows a solo shot in the first, he might as well pack it in and go home. I don't disagree with your point entirely, obviously pitching in a playoff race is a different thing, but Felix's stats and his performance against the AL East makes a pretty compelling case in my mind.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

No way! 18 of his games were against terrible offensive teams (Oak 3, Det 1, Bal 1, KC 2, SD 2, LAA 5, ChC 1, ChW 2, Cle 2) 6 games against Texas and 2 of them were when at the end of the season when the O went into the tank. I give him mad props for doing what he did to the Yanks, Bos and Tor, but that brings me to a very important point.

Pitching in the AL east is much harder than if you have to pitch in the AL west. Both Lester and Buchholz had great years. Clay is 17-7 with a 2.33 ERA, so he should be in the conversation with both ERA and wins on his side. CC also lost out on 3 or 4 wins too. I would vote for him and his 0-0 shutout battle with Price in the last weeks of the season over anything Felix did.

I also buy into pressure. Teams in the east had way more pressure knowing that if you win or lose it matters more. Felix had no pressure. He does not get it in my opinion.

Pressure its best pitcher and it doesn't matter what team or what ballpark the player plays in


Here's the case why I think Felix should get it

1. leads the AL in ERA, strikeouts and innings -- and every pitcher who has done that in the Cy Young era has won the award.

2. True, King Felix doesn't pitch in the AL East. But he has a 0.54 ERA against the Yankees and Red Sox.

3. He has a 2.47 ERA in 14 starts against teams that are either in the playoffs or still breathing.

4. Felix's ERA in the 21 starts he hasn't won (3.31) is almost as low as CC's overall ERA (3.18).

5. So he has left seven of his past 14 starts in the seventh inning or later with zero runs on his side of the board. And his run support (3.06 per game) isn't merely the worst in baseball this year. It's the worst in this millennium. And according to Elias, it's the second-worst support in the entire DH era for an AL pitcher with an ERA under 2.50. And the only guy who got crummier support (Jon Matlack) was doing his thing way back in 1978.

And how bad and pathetic was the Mariners offense this year

1. It took the Mariners 151 games to score 481 runs. That's as many as the Red Sox scored before the All-Star break.

2. The Mariners in total scored 513 runs this year to become the first AL team to score fewer than 530 runs in a full, non-strike season since the invention of the DH in 1973 -- and only the third to fail to reach 550.

3. They became the first AL team in the DH era to score three runs or fewer 100 times in one season, they had 101 scoring 3 or less in their last 4 games

4. Their team .235 batting average and .298 on-base percentage, are also all-time records as well

5. And one of their lineup spots is occupied by a fellow who lead the league in hits (Ichiro), who also scored fewer runs (72) than the man who is last in the National League in hits which is .198-hitting Mark Reynolds, who has scored 79 runs.

Now you tell me why its his fault he got a 13-12 record pitching with this piece of shit offense all year. The reason Bucholz isn't gettting the same consideration is the amount of innings he pitched compared to Lester, Sabbathia, and Hernandez. And no offense to Sabbathia but he's not even in my top 3.

With more innings pitched I think Bucholz could probablhy get it since his ERA is right close to Hernandez

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Pressure its best pitcher and it doesn't matter what team or what ballpark the player plays in


Here's the case why I think Felix should get it

1. leads the AL in ERA, strikeouts and innings -- and every pitcher who has done that in the Cy Young era has won the award.

2. True, King Felix doesn't pitch in the AL East. But he has a 0.54 ERA against the Yankees and Red Sox.

3. He has a 2.47 ERA in 14 starts against teams that are either in the playoffs or still breathing.

4. Felix's ERA in the 21 starts he hasn't won (3.31) is almost as low as CC's overall ERA (3.18).

5. So he has left seven of his past 14 starts in the seventh inning or later with zero runs on his side of the board. And his run support (3.06 per game) isn't merely the worst in baseball this year. It's the worst in this millennium. And according to Elias, it's the second-worst support in the entire DH era for an AL pitcher with an ERA under 2.50. And the only guy who got crummier support (Jon Matlack) was doing his thing way back in 1978.

And how bad and pathetic was the Mariners offense this year

1. It took the Mariners 151 games to score 481 runs. That's as many as the Red Sox scored before the All-Star break.

2. The Mariners in total scored 513 runs this year to become the first AL team to score fewer than 530 runs in a full, non-strike season since the invention of the DH in 1973 -- and only the third to fail to reach 550.

3. They became the first AL team in the DH era to score three runs or fewer 100 times in one season, they had 101 scoring 3 or less in their last 4 games

4. Their team .235 batting average and .298 on-base percentage, are also all-time records as well

5. And one of their lineup spots is occupied by a fellow who lead the league in hits (Ichiro), who also scored fewer runs (72) than the man who is last in the National League in hits which is .198-hitting Mark Reynolds, who has scored 79 runs.

Now you tell me why its his fault he got a 13-12 record pitching with this piece of shit offense all year. The reason Bucholz isn't gettting the same consideration is the amount of innings he pitched compared to Lester, Sabbathia, and Hernandez. And no offense to Sabbathia but he's not even in my top 3.

With more innings pitched I think Bucholz could probablhy get it since his ERA is right close to Hernandez

1. Exceptions should be made.
2. I gave him mad props. See Boise state. It is much easier to pitch or play very well when you only play 1 or 2 big games a year. In his case, he played 4 big games this year.
3. ok
4. Point for cc. I am not saying he did not have an awesome year. I just think he does not deserve Cy. I am voting for CC.


I think Lester deserves it and Clay had 17 wins along with a low ERA. He should cancel out Felix. I don't think a man with that record on a nothing team should get it. We agree to disagree and Felix will prob get it. CC and Price had the best years based on pressure, wins and help from their team. BTW ARoid did not deserve to win his MVP with Texas by a long shot.

A word on CC. I don't have the raw numbers, but CC stopped many losing streaks and he is the sole reason the Yankees are in the playoffs. Pettitte did not pitch in the second half, AJ and Javier just died. Phil Hughes tailed off greatly from first half. CC was the only guy going out ther every 5 days and winning. The pitching staff had 3 starting pitcher all stars. Only he finished strong. He was the only 20 game winner in the American league and that should count for something. Litterally, almost every start for the last 2 months meant so much more when compared to Felix. That is pressure and he needs the award for all that.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

I think Lester deserves it and Clay had 17 wins along with a low ERA. He should cancel out Felix. I don't think a man with that record on a nothing team should get it. We agree to disagree and Felix will prob get it. CC and Price had the best years based on pressure, wins and help from their team. BTW ARoid did not deserve to win his MVP with Texas by a long shot.

A word on CC. I don't have the raw numbers, but CC stopped many losing streaks and he is the sole reason the Yankees are in the playoffs. Pettitte did not pitch in the second half, AJ and Javier just died. Phil Hughes tailed off greatly from first half. CC was the only guy going out ther every 5 days and winning. The pitching staff had 3 starting pitcher all stars. Only he finished strong. He was the only 20 game winner in the American league and that should count for something. Litterally, almost every start for the last 2 months meant so much more when compared to Felix. That is pressure and he needs the award for all that.

The problem I have with CC is that he pitches for a team that gives him lots of run support and you can also say that about Price, Bucholz and Lester probably as well

I'm sure if Bucholz didn't get injured and didn't miss about a month in the year I'm sure he would probably get it considering his ERA and WHIP are right close to Felix.

Now the Cy Young award is different from the MVP where it's best pitcher and not Most Valuable Pitcher. If it was for that then CC would get it but that's not what the definition of the award is and since this day and age where we can find every stat and watch almost every game.

Now this year is somewhat similar to in 1987 Nolan Ryan lead the NL in ERA and in Ks (270 in 211 2/3 innings) and he was rewarded with 0 first place votes because he was 8-16 for a shitty Houston Astros team that never scored for him at all and the award went to a closing pitcher that year

Wins as a pitcher is something you can't control and it doesn't matter to me what jersey you wear if it was a Yankee, Red Sox, Blue Jays or whatever its who I believe deserves the award

While we do disagree on this we do agree on one thing there's no fucking way a player on a last place team should win the MVP award like A-Roid did with Texas. If we go by that then Jose Bautista deserves it this year based on that(BTW I don't really believe he does I think Josh Hamiltion deserves it hands down this year)

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

The problem I have with CC is that he pitches for a team that gives him lots of run support and you can also say that about Price, Bucholz and Lester probably as well

I'm sure if Bucholz didn't get injured and didn't miss about a month in the year I'm sure he would probably get it considering his ERA and WHIP are right close to Felix.

Now the Cy Young award is different from the MVP where it's best pitcher and not Most Valuable Pitcher. If it was for that then CC would get it but that's not what the definition of the award is and since this day and age where we can find every stat and watch almost every game.

Now this year is somewhat similar to in 1987 Nolan Ryan lead the NL in ERA and in Ks (270 in 211 2/3 innings) and he was rewarded with 0 first place votes because he was 8-16 for a shitty Houston Astros team that never scored for him at all and the award went to a closing pitcher that year

Wins as a pitcher is something you can't control and it doesn't matter to me what jersey you wear if it was a Yankee, Red Sox, Blue Jays or whatever its who I believe deserves the award

While we do disagree on this we do agree on one thing there's no fucking way a player on a last place team should win the MVP award like A-Roid did with Texas. If we go by that then Jose Bautista deserves it this year based on that(BTW I don't really believe he does I think Josh Hamiltion deserves it hands down this year)

Pitchers do pitch differently when they have room to play with.

I don't have a prob if Josh gets MVP. The Rangers did not do so well with him out of the lineup and Lee in. He was having a MVP worthy year.

[hoojib127]

Originally Posted by smok3h

If the Yankees beat the Twins out of the of playoffs for the 4 time in a row this year, I may consider quitting watching baseball altogether, haha, I just don't know if I can deal with it AGAIN. Seriously though, I really hope that doesn't happen.

[Sigh] Once again my Twins proceed to graduate high school with high honors, only to flunk out of college the very first semester. Someone get these guys some grit!

Well, it's Go Rays! or Go Rangers! now. But I think the Phillies are going to be the team to beat this year; that Halladay/Oswalt/Hamels 1-2-3 punch is downright lethal.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

[Sigh] Once again my Twins proceed to graduate high school with high honors, only to flunk out of college the very first semester. Someone get these guys some grit!

Well, it's Go Rays! or Go Rangers! now. But I think the Phillies are going to be the team to beat this year; that Halladay/Oswalt/Hamels 1-2-3 punch is downright lethal.

The Twins have to just maybe avoid the Yankees they just don't have the team to beat them at all and it has clearly showed the last few years.

Last year the umpiring screwed you guys a little bit but this time you guys didn't have a chance.

And the Phillies I think are the team to beat just think those 3 pitchers are pitching 6 out of 7 games and you have to win 4 of those games I don't see that happening at all

[countchocula]

Fuck, my Braves are dead. At least they made it back to the postseason. Thanks for the memories, Bobby.

[horrorfreak13]

I'm so pumped for Saturday's game Roy Halladay vs Tim Lincecum 2 of the 5 best pitchers in baseball this is a game that is sure to be a classic.

BTW LCS pick

Yankees over Rangers in 7 - Lineups both sides can do good damage but the Yankees have the better pitching staff

Phillies over Giants in 6 - Phily has the better lineup and deeper pitching staff although the Giants can go 3 deep as well I like Phily's top 3 better.

[John@$$]

The Halladay vs Lincecum game will be worth watching that for sure. Both teams have great pitching lineup. And I agree with your LCS picks for both series horrorfreak.


Yankees over Rangers


Phillies over Giants

[Puck Bond]

You guys are so predictable with those picks...enough with the Yankees and Phils already...I'm rootin' for the underdogs Rangers and Giants, but I'm kind of biased 'cause I'm a Giants fan!!! hehehe

Go Giants!!! Timmy and Cody Ross comin' through in game 1...gotta love it!

[Erroneous]

MLB are a bunch of fuck ups. They have no idea how to market their sport. Nice job of taking two of the best pitchers in the game and make them wait 10 or so days in between starts. You can't do that. DO not punish teams for finishing early. There should only be one day in between series. Thank you MLB for lowering the quality of the games.

Look for both CC and Roy to pitch in game 4 as both will be ready to get back into it quickly.


I hope the Yankees fucking kill Lee tonight. I am really tired of all these stupid ass stories of how 1-1 so far in the series is like being 1-2, because they can't beat Lee. I hope they use these stories as motivation. That is all they have been hearing since before the playoffs.

Two things about this. 1. They hit Lee pretty hard (11 ks though) on Aug 11th and beat him, so they can do it. 2. We faced Pedro Martinez 6 times (5 starts) when he was with Boston in his prime and pretty much the best pitchers in the game at that time. Result 1-2. Lee is no Pedro. We will beat him or out last him at some point. That is what the Yankees do. They figure out how to beat you. Let's just hope it is this year.

[hoojib127]

Honestly, how can you people root for a team that already has EVERYTHING (i.e. the Yankee$)??? It's like rooting for Donald Trump over your own father (or any other ordinary average guy you've respected/admired/looked up to your whole life).

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

Honestly, how can you people root for a team that already has EVERYTHING (i.e. the Yankee$)??? It's like rooting for Donald Trump over your own father (or any other ordinary average guy you've respected/admired/looked up to your whole life).

Been rooting for them my whole life. I guess you think I should switch because they have more money that any three teams combined? I also root for the Giants (football), Nets and Devils. No one knows more about losing your great players to bigger market teams like the Devils who lose at least one home grown talent every year and still find ways to be one of the best teams year in year out. Money does not add up to trophies, but it helps.

Perhaps, you missed the report that came out this summer of what many teams pocketed? Teams with the lowest level payrolls were pulling in some nice chunks of money, when they were supposed to be spending it on keeping their players. Mr Selig was quite embarrassed.

That "everything" you mentioned also includes the fact that pretty much every every team puts out their best when they play the Yanks. Everyone is auditioning to play for us or a team that pays to beat us. No other team is treated like that. Makes it just that much harder to win when everyone puts up 100% effort to beat you game in game out. Teams are not putting in the same effort when they play KC.

I think small market teams like KC, Pitts and Tampa should close up or move. If you can't afford to put up some sort of an effort to field a decent team with a decent payroll, then go away or stop bitching.

Keep this in mind too. It costs at least 20-25% more to live and work in NYC. The taxes are unbelievably high. Buying a house in the suburbs in NY or NJ will run you like twice what you would pay for in Texas or Minn or FL. Some states like FL or TX do not have state income tax. But, I guess logically thinking about why people need to get paid more in NY does not mean anything to you. This might come to some sort of shock to you, but people of all career paths get paid more in NYC than in most other parts of the country. There is a reason for it.

Such a ignorant thing to say. Can't you come up with something original? You really should have very little to say about it. Your owner is a cheap fucker. He makes a lot of money off you fans in Minnysoooota. Minn is not a small market at all. There are a lot of people in that region. I been there. I have been to the mall of somalia. I know all the big businesses you have in the area (Best Buy, Target, all the health care companies). I actually like the area. The suburbs are quite expensive. Instead of ripping the Yanks for buying one of your players (I think the last one was Knobby), rip into your owner for not paying what he can to build the team stronger. There is no reason why he could not pay Santana. I am surprised he ponied up for Mauer. I think the city would not have forgiven him if he let Mauer leave.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

Honestly, how can you people root for a team that already has EVERYTHING (i.e. the Yankee$)??? It's like rooting for Donald Trump over your own father (or any other ordinary average guy you've respected/admired/looked up to your whole life).

Hey don't get me wrong I don't like the Yankees either and I hope Texas wins as well I just think the Yankees have the better pitching staff and have the deeper lineup than Texas.

The Yankees though are stupid if they go to Burnett in 4 instead of Sabathia regardless if they win the game 3 or not.

I really think whoever wins the NLCS wins the whole thing.

[hoojib127]

Originally Posted by horrorfreak13

Hey don't get me wrong I don't like the Yankees either and I hope Texas wins as well I just think the Yankees have the better pitching staff and have the deeper lineup than Texas.

The Yankees though are stupid if they go to Burnett in 4 instead of Sabathia regardless if they win the game 3 or not.

I really think whoever wins the NLCS wins the whole thing.

Seeing how badly Sabathia and Hughes got shelled in the first two games, I think it may be time for you to reconsider.

Ah, Erroneous, you Yankee fans are full of excuses. But, hey, most people would rather be around the high school football captain (no matter how vain and shallow he may be) than the nerdy English Lit. junkie, wouldn't they? Enough with trying to play the victim here because you never will be. I'm a Bulls fan, but even I started getting sick of their dominance over the rest of the NBA back when they started their second three-peat. I sure hope Cliff Lee doesn't sell out and sign with you during the offseason -- not when there are plenty of other legitimate contenders he can side with who haven't won everything under the sun yet.

[Erroneous]

Note to Yankees the next time you face Cliff Lee:

SWING AT THE FIRST FUCKING PITCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND THE SECOND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

0-2 counts on almost every batter.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by hoojib127

Seeing how badly Sabathia and Hughes got shelled in the first two games, I think it may be time for you to reconsider.

Wow I just got home from work to see the ending holy shit

If the Yankees decide to do the stupid thing and go with Burnett instead of Sabbathia on short rest for game 4 they are done for.

[adamjohnson]

Sabathia was garbage his first time around, he'll be garbage again. Rangers have won every inning except ONE this series. And it hasn't been close.

[John@$$]

http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=t...nday-night%2F1


Bud Selig should be waving a white flag today.

Although baseball has long lost its claim to being the national pastime last night's events essentially stomped it into the ground. That the Tennessee-Jacksonville Monday Night Football game drew better TV ratings than the Yankees-Rangers ALCS game is astonishing, and makes you wonder if a good college football game could whip the best that MLB has to offer.

Consider:

The MNF game was an utter dog that made one wonder whether Jacksonville can handle the bright lights. Tennessee was totally in charge by 17-0 at intermission, and the only second-half drama revolved around waiting to see if Jack Del Rio would unhinge in front of a national audience.

Game 3 of the ALCS had a no-hitter going into the fifth inning, and was a 2-0 contest until the ninth.

The MNF game had zip for star power. Vince Young left the stage early with a sprained knee. Chris Johnson was corralled until the final minutes. Maurice Jones-Drew never got his bowling ball body rolling. And David Garrard also limped off early, making it a battle of backup QBs.

The ALCS had Cliff Lee pitching, and knocking on the door of history with his undefeated record in postseason play. It also had such household names as Alex Rodriguez, Derek Jeter and Andy Pettitte.

The MNF game had little consequence for NFL fans. It was a battle between rivals in the AFC South, aka the NFL's pigeon hole for teams from mostly tiny markets.

The ALCS game had monstrous appeal for two of MLB's best demographics -- Yankee lovers and Yankee haters. And with Lee headed for free agency this was a game for every baseball fan to admire the game's hottest arm, and wonder where he'll go.

But no, instead the bigger set of eyes was affixed to a walkover game that Tennessee won 30-3, while high-stakes baseball took a backseat.

-- Tom Weir


Wow that just to show you how huge football is in America.

[AceD]

Originally Posted by adamjohnson

Sabathia was garbage his first time around, he'll be garbage again.

Yeah, that makes sense. The Yankees should really just release him, he's never going to pitch a good game again. And the Phillies shouldn't even consider bringing Halladay back in the SF series.

Obviously Sabathia hasn't been dominant in recent starts, but he's a proven winner. Those type of knee-jerk summations of someone are worthy of Around the Horn.

Rangers have won every inning except ONE this series. And it hasn't been close.

First of all, how the hell have the Rangers "won every inning except ONE"? The seven scoreless innings of game 3? The fourth and sixth of game 2, when the Yankees outscored the Rangers? The Rangers "won" ALL of those?

Even if we concede your point, that's a pretty ridiculous stat that a lot of people are bringing up. Is that inning somehow irrelevant? Was that luck? It's not even like something like the David Tyree catch; this was a series of events. That's like saying "except for the games they lost, the Colts have won every game this year." You can't cast away something that happened. Baseball isn't about winning every inning, it's about scoring more runs.

[Erroneous]

Originally Posted by adamjohnson

Sabathia was garbage his first time around, he'll be garbage again. Rangers have won every inning except ONE this series. And it hasn't been close.

Sabathia and Halladay sucked, because they had so much time off. These are men who are used to getting the ball every 5 days. Sit them for 9 - 10 days and that is what you get. Look for both of them to rebound next time out.

You know next to nothing about the Yankees. Game one is how the Yankees play. They do this 40 times a year, every year. They score many runs in the last 3 innings of the game routinely. I don't even bother to watch Yankee games until the 5th inning. Their whole MO is to get into the bullpen. But, yes they sucked in games 2 and 3.

[adamjohnson]

3-1.

[Bourne101]

Yeah, it will probably be 3-1, but I love how you jump to such conclusions before the game is even over after the Yankees embarrassed the Rangers in game 1 coming back from being down five runs. The Yankees are not playing well in this series and probably won't win the series, but all of this "Sabathia is garbage" and "they've only won one inning" shit is nonsense. It's ignorant and the stuff of kindergarten playtime arguments. Sabathia ruled the playoffs last year and had an excellent year this year. He's a great pitcher.

BTW, Burnett pitched a very solid game. He was probably left in an inning too long considering the amount of days rest he had, but he clearly out-pitched Hunter and was throwing some nasty curves.

[horrorfreak13]

Originally Posted by Erroneous

Sabathia and Halladay sucked, because they had so much time off. These are men who are used to getting the ball every 5 days. Sit them for 9 - 10 days and that is what you get. Look for both of them to rebound next time out.

I didn't see the game Sabbathia pitched but I seen Halladay he wasn't awful he just got beat mostly by one batter Cody Ross which is pretty much every Phillies pitcher this series.

And also I'd like to add fuck you A.J Burnett only because I watched him pitch one good season out of 3 with the Blue Jays knowing he was going to opt out of his contract and go to the highest bidder. I'm really enjoying the shitty year he's having.

In all seriousness he wasnt too bad he was just left in 1 batter too many.